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Old 12-15-2008, 08:20 PM
 
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I was reading the many posts in the Once Saved Always Saved thread and was going to type my response, and then the Lord put it on my heart to begin a new thread since, in my opinion, I think we need to ask Can true Christians lose their Salvation instead of addressing it as Once Saved Always Saved topic?

There are many passages in the bible that teach that those who are truly born again or true followers of Christ, will continue in the Christian life until death and will then go to be with the Lord in heaven.

Jesus says in John 6:38-40 NKJV
For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.
This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.
And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

As we see here Jesus says that everyone who believe in him will have eternal life. He also says that he will raise up that person on that last day. From the context here, believing in the Son and having eternal life clearly means that Jesus will raise that person up to eternal life with him and not to raise him up to be judged and or condemned. If Jesus is to do the will of the Father as verse 38 emphasizes, and as verse 39 says Jesus should lose nothing of all that his Father has given him.

Another Scripture that emphasize this truth is John 10:27-29 where Jesus says:
My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father's hand

We see in these verses that those who follow Jesus, those who are his sheep, are given eternal life. Jesus further says that no one shall SNATCH them out of His hand. So my point here is that if we are Jesus' true sheep by hearing his voice, and by following him, then NO ONE, including ourselves, can be snatched out of Jesus' hands once we are in them.

There are other passages that teach that those who believe have ETERNAL LIFE. Look at John 3:36. It says: He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.

Here again we see that believers in the Son has a life that lasts forever with God. It is a gift from God that comes with salvation, and therefore, goes opposite of condemnation and eternal judgment which is also the opposite of death, the opposite of judgement and separation from God. It's a life that goes on forever in the presence of God, and he who believes in the Son has this everlasting life.

A popular Scripture that I have seen quoted by people who believe that Christians can lose their salvation is the one from Matt 7:21-23:
"Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.
Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?'
And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'

As we see here, these people prophesied and cast out demons and did many might works in Jesus' name. Their ability to do such works did not prove that they were Christians. We see here that Jesus says that he never knew them. But he doesn't say that he once knew them at one time but now no longer know them because they have strayed from him or stopped believing in him. Jesus simply says I NEVER knew you. These were people who weren't really saved in the first place or were not true followers of Jesus Christ.

Another verse that is quoted to teach that Christians can lose their Salvation is Hebrews 6:4-6

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit,
And have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,
If they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.

Just from reading this verse alone one would think that a Christian can lose his Salvation. If we were to go back and start reading at Hebrews 5:11 and read it to Hebrews 6: 12, we will see that the writer is addressing the need to move on to maturity.

Some scholars hold the interpretation that Hebrews 6:4-6 is written not about christians but about unbelievers who are convinced of the basic truths of the gospel but who have not placed their faith in Jesus Christ as Savior. They are intellecutally persuaded by the gospel's message but spiritually uncommitted to it or God's saving grace. For whatever reason, they just haven't been sold on Jesus totally even though they attend church.

One scholar puts it this way, the falling away is a reference to those who have tasted the truth but, not having come all the way to faith, falling away from even the revelation they have been given. The tasting of truth is not enough to keep them from falling away from it. They must come all the way to Christ in complete repentance and faith; otherwise, they in effect re-crucify Christ and treat him in contempt. Those who sin against Christ in such a way have no hope of restoration or forgiveness because they reject him with full knowledge and conscious experience. They have condluded that Jesus should have been crucified, and they stand with his enemies. It is therefore impossible to renew such to repentance.

Another scholar says that the key word in Hebrews 6 is IF. The writer of Hebrews is setting up a hypthetical statment; If a Christian were to fall away...." The point being made is that it would be impossible (IF a Christian falls away) to renew salvation. That's because Jesus died once for sin (Hebrews 9:28), and if his sacrifice is insufficient, then there's no hope at all.

I lean on this last intepretation because if a Christian can lose his salvation, then it must also mean that NO ONE WHO LOSES HIS SALVATION CAN EVER REGAIN IT. The idea that salvation would be unattainable to some who seek it in Christ is not scriptural at all. The bible clearly teaches that God is concerned not simply about whether we end up in heaven but how we have served him since becoming a Christian, and whether we have earned through those works our eternal reward 1 Corinthians 3.

I thank my Lord that I can be assured of my salvation that no matter how much I stumble in this life, it's because of the blood of Jesus that cleanses me daily as I pray to my Lord daily for forgiveness of my sins. The bible tells us to work out our salvation Phil 2:12. Being a Christian is high maintenance, and we must do everything humanly possible to be obedient to God and to Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment Mt 22:37-40.

Last edited by antredd; 12-15-2008 at 08:29 PM..
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:28 PM
 
Location: Romeoville, IL
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Such a belief is so watered down and false that it is blasphemy. Are you Catholic? I hope not, because we don't believe that garbage.

It is perfectly possible for Christians to do acts of immorality and lose their salvation. Why should God reward those who do not repent?
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:32 PM
 
Location: God's Country
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Can true Christians Lose Their Salvation? No, never, absolutely not.
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:34 PM
 
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No they can't! That's it, "True Christians". Many profess to be Christian but they are not. I will never say who is because that is not my place but Jesus does.

"I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!"
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:36 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronK View Post
Such a belief is so watered down and false that it is blasphemy. Are you Catholic? I hope not, because we don't believe that garbage.

It is perfectly possible for Christians to do acts of immorality and lose their salvation. Why should God reward those who do not repent?
Wow. I am not Catholic. I am a christian first and I choose to worship with Baptists.

So are you saying that a true christian can eventually be snatched out of Jesus' hands which is contrary to Scripture?
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:37 PM
 
3,259 posts, read 5,035,651 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
No they can't! That's it, "True Christians". Many profess to be Christian but they are not. I will never say who is because that is not my place but Jesus does.

"I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!"
Amen fundamentalist. Who are we to judge anyone as to whether or not they are a true christian. I guess you can argue that we can judge a person by the fruit they bear, then that becomes controversial as well.
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:39 PM
 
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Originally Posted by antredd View Post
Amen fundamentalist. Who are we to judge anyone as to whether or not they are a true christian. I guess you can argue that we can judge a person by the fruit they bear, then that becomes controversial as well.
We could never judge someone's salvation He has already done that but WE CAN question it.
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:40 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
We could never judge someone's salvation He has already done that but WE CAN question it.
Very good point. Amen!
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:54 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
We could never judge someone's salvation He has already done that but WE CAN question it.
How is that different from judging it?
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:58 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,343,069 times
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Originally Posted by mzjamiedawn View Post
How is that different from judging it?
One is forming an opinion and stating it, the other is probing. Remember we are talking about salvation. Anytime I witness to someone and they say, they are Christian, I probe with questions that Christians should know. This tells me about their "salvation"
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