Christmas-A Christian Holiday? (prayer, recall, repentance, charity)

[renriq02]

you dont get it.

Faith without works is dead

If you have no works then your faith is dead.

Originally Posted by JViello

If this is what the Christian church as been reduced to...we are doomed and the church and nation must be reduced to dust and rebuilt. Or God will just raise up another nation like China should he tarry.

This nation is full of cement shoed bored Christians the same way the Israelites wandered the desert finding things to complain about. I'm convinced.

When this nation falls, the world is in termoil and the REAL testing comes...these conversations will look very silly. When folks are starving in the street and Christians are being put to death for their faith - navel gazing and a stupid tree tradition will be the last thing on your mind I can assure you.

The lost are out there in MASS NUMBERS, people are abandoning their faith, our nation is crumbling around us and we are arguing about a tree.

I hope folks start to see the forest through the trees. Pun intended.

Edit:



Ah, well that makes sense now. Your a works person. A legalist. Your salvation depends upon your ability to follow all the rules perfectly, and not Christ's sacrifice on the cross. I got it.

[CatManDoo]

Originally Posted by renriq02

A lot of people will say 'well that's not my intention'

Well it's not my intention to sin, but I'm still held accountable.

So if intent is so irrelevant to my actions, I can just go to church every Sunday, sit there, and call it "worship?"

[Alpha8207]

Originally Posted by renriq02

1. Holy Spirit will not convict you for everything wrong. This is why we must turn to the Word of God. How is it in the last days that even the Elect will turn? Because they followed vain teachings and other doctrines. I know getting drunk is wrong because of the Word of God tells me...the Holy Spirit doesnt need to 'convict me'.

If you are in Christ, the Holy Spirit will convict you for sinning, whether you think He needs to or not.

Originally Posted by renriq02

2. Spirit of the Lord guides us to follow God so we wont be breaking laws like adultery, fornication, drunkardness, etc. It doesnt mean that there is freedom to do what we want or to sin.

Totally agree. Maybe you are called to be obedient to something I'm not and vice versa. I knew a woman once who felt like she had been asked by the Lord to always wear a dress, so she obediently followed that prompting. She did not, however, try and put her conviction on someone else. Her decision and obedience was something that was specific to her and God.

Originally Posted by renriq02

3. Decorating anything that is unholy doesnt make it 'holy'. If I put a cross on a pentagram w/circle will that make the pentagram holy? It's obvious that the pentagram w/circle is considered bad to many people, and they know that you can bless it 10 million times, annoint it, kiss it, pray over it, etc....that it will always be UNHOLY.

Awesome. Now tell me where I said my tree was holy?

Originally Posted by renriq02

The XMAS tree is not UNHOLY the practice of bringing it inside your home, and erecting it, putting presents under it, etc is UNHOLY.

Now I'll use the logic you exercise here and tell you that I am excluded from your comments because I don't use a real tree. So that scripture doesn't apply to me. That's what you would say, right? I can hear you saying 'The scriptures ARE CLEAR this only applies to trees that have been cut down and that have nails used to secure them into the home!" Well, my trees plastic and is kept upright by the stand...no nails or hangers! I'm A-OK!

Originally Posted by renriq02

Christmas is about Jesus being born not about xmas trees or giving each other presents.

If anyone disputes this then please research where the practice of XMAS trees came from.

What surprises me is that a lot of people look down on Catholics for bringing in statues, pictures, frames, etc of dead saints yet you're bringing in XMAS trees in your home!

You both say that you're not worshipping it....

Then why adorn the tree?
Then why put presents under the tree? Any person in the old times would think that you're sacrificing to the tree!
Then why erect it in your home?

A lot of people will say 'well that's not my intention'

Well it's not my intention to sin, but I'm still held accountable.

We're all accountable, renriq. If you don't want to celebrate Christmas or have a Christmas tree or a nativity or whatever else, that's between you and the Lord. I know the God I serve. I see Him in my life on a daily basis. I see His blessings and I see His hand of correction. If I saw no evidence of Him moving in my life, no fruit, no joy, no peace, no self-control, etc....then I would reevaluate and reevaluate until I felt like I had made the necessary changes in my life. I'm seeking as much of my risen Savior as I can grasp this side of Heaven, and I trust Him to lead me as He sees fit. Right now, Christmas is an opportunity for more worship, more witnessing, more sharing, more helping others, and more love for God and my fellow man.

God bless you this season of whatever you and the others don't celebrate.

[renriq02]

I dont celebrate Christmas as others do, and I see nothing wrong with celebrating it.

I just dont agree with some of the practices that are done during the celebrations.

[JViello]

Originally Posted by renriq02

you dont get it.

Faith without works is dead

If you have no works then your faith is dead.

You're right I don't get it. I ar stoopit and nevar reeded James.

If your faith is based on works, it's not faith. Tada!

Works coming out of a glad heart and not a self righteous one is the idea.

Luk 18:9 To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everybody else, Jesus told this parable:

Luk 18:10 “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector.

Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood up and prayed about[fn1] himself: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men–robbers, evildoers, adulterers–or even like this tax collector.

Luk 18:12 I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.’

Luk 18:13 “But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’

Luk 18:14 “I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.”

[Alpha8207]

Originally Posted by renriq02

I dont celebrate Christmas as others do, and I see nothing wrong with celebrating it.

I just dont agree with some of the practices that are done during the celebrations.

I understand.

[JViello]

Originally Posted by renriq02

I dont celebrate Christmas as others do, and I see nothing wrong with celebrating it.

I just dont agree with some of the practices that are done during the celebrations.

And that my brother (sister?) is totally understood and fine by me.

Just watch how you point out that speck in your brothers eye...lots o planks in the eye going around these days.

[renriq02]

i guess you dont get it still

you are saved by grace THROUGH FAITH

If you have no faith then you're not saved.

Works comes from faith

righteousness is a fruit...not works.

Originally Posted by JViello

You're right I don't get it. I ar stoopit and nevar reeded James.

If your faith is based on works, it's not faith. Tada!

Works coming out of a glad heart and not a self righteous one is the idea.

Luk 18:9 To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everybody else, Jesus told this parable:

Luk 18:10 “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector.

Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood up and prayed about[fn1] himself: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men–robbers, evildoers, adulterers–or even like this tax collector.

Luk 18:12 I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.’

Luk 18:13 “But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’

Luk 18:14 “I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.”

[Miss Blue]

Hmmm. I go Christmas shopping for presents for the old folks home and the Angel Tree for the kids in the hospital lobby,and drop a donation into santa's bucket for the Salvatiom Army.. Then I stop to speak to Mary and Joseph , the shepherds, sheep and camels in the parking lot and come home all satisfied and feeling the Joy of the Lord and the season of love and giving and whatcha know now I find I have spent the afternoon sinning

[MysticPhD]

Originally Posted by renriq02

Gee I wonder what we do with xmas tree that IS NOT WORSHIP?

1. adorn it
2. leave presents under it
3. erect it in our home

You're right...nobody worships the XMAS tree.

Worship is in the minds of the worshipers . . . not in the external things around them. This mindless assignment of worship to objects is ridiculous. By your stupid rule anything we adorn (like ourselves) or homes or . . . whatever is worship. Worship has NOTHING to do with objects and everything to do with what is in your MIND and SOUL. Stop judging by appearances.