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Old 01-07-2009, 11:35 AM
 
Location: Downtown Omaha
1,362 posts, read 4,200,617 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
The sacrifices was a covering of sins and boy the Jews were sinning because the temple ran blood red. Sacrifice is not forgiveness of sin because there is no amount of sacrifices that could could atone for offending an infinite God which is why Jesus who has to be- must be God is the only way. He "sacrificed" Himself for us, He is the ultimate sacrifice. His blood is sufficient enough for God to forgive us of our sins past, present and future.

I thought you knew this already since you claim to have been a "Christian" these are easy questions.
You just said sacrifice isn't the forgiveness of sin and then in the same paragraph you say the Jesus' sacrifice is the forgiveness of sin?

Also doesn't sacrifice mean you lose something and don't get it back? God got his son back. Doesn't sound like much of a sacrifice to me.
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Old 01-07-2009, 11:43 AM
 
Location: NW Arkansas
3,978 posts, read 7,629,567 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DTO Luv View Post
You just said sacrifice isn't the forgiveness of sin and then in the same paragraph you say the Jesus' sacrifice is the forgiveness of sin?

Also doesn't sacrifice mean you lose something and don't get it back? God got his son back. Doesn't sound like much of a sacrifice to me.

Perhaps if you were hung on a cross and had all the sins of the world put on you, you would consider it the ultimate sacrifice!??!
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Old 01-07-2009, 11:44 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,718,586 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DTO Luv View Post
You just said sacrifice isn't the forgiveness of sin and then in the same paragraph you say the Jesus' sacrifice is the forgiveness of sin?

Also doesn't sacrifice mean you lose something and don't get it back? God got his son back. Doesn't sound like much of a sacrifice to me.
Context.....animal sacrifice. God did not have to do anything because of the wretches we are but He did it anyway which shows His love and mercy. "He took upon the sin of the world", do you understand the depth of that sentence? God hates sin, detest it, it is revolting yet He did it so he could give the gift to mankind which gives Him the glory. Jesus became a liar on the cross, He became a murderer, He became a pedophile, He even became a homosexual so that ALL could be forgiven. He not only suffered and died physically but He suffered and died spiritually as well which was much worse than the physical ordeal.
Some say, Christians would never know what Jesus went through spiritually on the cross but the damned will.
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Old 01-07-2009, 11:52 AM
 
4,439 posts, read 8,207,372 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marianinark View Post
Perhaps if you were hung on a cross and had all the sins of the world put on you, you would consider it the ultimate sacrifice!??!
Still one of my favorite topics!

Which is a greater sacrifice.

1. Sacrificing yourself for the whole world..

or

2. Sacrificing yourself for one person.


The reward for point 1 is great
The reward for point 2 is not as great

Yet both require the same. One sacrifice.
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Old 01-07-2009, 11:53 AM
 
Location: Downtown Omaha
1,362 posts, read 4,200,617 times
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Well divine child sacrifice aside, it seems I won't get an answer to my question of how the bible says jesus being your saviour is the only way to get to heaven BUT if you didn't know about him and you lead a good life that's just as good too. Like most things in the bible it doesn't make any sense.
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Old 01-07-2009, 11:59 AM
 
Location: NW Arkansas
3,978 posts, read 7,629,567 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DTO Luv View Post
Well divine child sacrifice aside, it seems I won't get an answer to my question of how the bible says jesus being your saviour is the only way to get to heaven BUT if you didn't know about him and you lead a good life that's just as good too. Like most things in the bible it doesn't make any sense.

Hopefully some day it will...when you see it through spiritual eyes, instead of physical eyes.
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Old 01-07-2009, 12:02 PM
 
Location: Downtown Omaha
1,362 posts, read 4,200,617 times
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Don't hold your breath. I'm set in my ways and set on spreading the anti-gospel. Have a nice day.
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Old 01-07-2009, 12:02 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,718,586 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DTO Luv View Post
Well divine child sacrifice aside, it seems I won't get an answer to my question of how the bible says jesus being your saviour is the only way to get to heaven BUT if you didn't know about him and you lead a good life that's just as good too. Like most things in the bible it doesn't make any sense.
It is because you don't want to understand. Bible says none are good, only God- What is your definition of good?- You are not good enough to get into heaven which IS work righteousness-God's definition of good is the Ten Commandments. You think you are good when you have broken all His commandments. You have lied, you have stolen, you have murdered, you have committed adultery.
This is God's laws of righteousness and since you can't live up to His standards then you are not righteous in His sight, you are damned and you and I will go to hell because HE IS SO RIGHTEOUS AND HOLY- He cannot have sin in His presence. That is why we need Jesus, we broke God's laws and now the just judge of the universe must punish sin (us) but Jesus stepped in and paid our fine. Now the judge can let us go because Jesus took our place. Jesus took the punishment that was meant for you and me.

That's the gospel.

Last edited by Fundamentalist; 01-07-2009 at 12:13 PM..
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Old 01-07-2009, 12:15 PM
 
Location: Downtown Omaha
1,362 posts, read 4,200,617 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
It is because you don't want to understand. Bible says none are good, only God- What is your definition of good?- God's definition of good is the Ten Commandments. You think you are good when you have broken all His commandments. You have lied, you have stolen, you have murdered, you have committed adultery.
This is God's laws of righteousness and since you can't live up to Him then you are not Holy in His sight, you are damned and you and I will go to hell because HE IS SO RIGHTEOUS AND HOLY- He cannot have sin in His presence. That is why we need Jesus, we broke God's laws and now the just judge of the universe must punish sin (us) but Jesus stepped in and paid our fine. Now the judge can let us go because Jesus took our place. Jesus took the punishment that was meant for you and me.

That's the gospel.
People who never had the gospel would have no way of accepting jesus so automatically they would go to hell.

So is it safe to say that you think adhering to the 10 commandments are a good way to measure salvation for those who didn't know god?

Ok fair enough. Right off the bat they're all going to hell for breaking the first commandment. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. So these people who you all say magically/spiritually no gods will from half way around the world know to worship him when they don't know who it is? Too bad they were all too busy coming up with other gods to worship and different standards to adhere to.
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Old 01-07-2009, 12:23 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,718,586 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DTO Luv View Post
People who never had the gospel would have no way of accepting jesus so automatically they would go to hell.

So is it safe to say that you think adhering to the 10 commandments are a good way to measure salvation for those who didn't know god?

Ok fair enough. Right off the bat they're all going to hell for breaking the first commandment. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. So these people who you all say magically/spiritually no gods will from half way around the world know to worship him when they don't know who it is? Too bad they were all too busy coming up with other gods to worship and different standards to adhere to.
I have covered that in my previous post about revealing, not every individual on this planet will have the same revelation, what that is is up to God. He is a just and fair God and He will judge accordingly.
Idolatry can be worship of money, cars, you children. If you don't put God first then you are committing idolatry, sadly there are many "Christians" doing the same.
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