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Old 01-17-2009, 11:49 AM
 
Location: Gaston, North Carolina
4,213 posts, read 5,037,572 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
What are they demanding that you are so concerned about?
Well lets see, they have demanded legal status for their sexual orientation, they have demanded marriage between same sex couples, they have demanded their lifestyle be taught in schools as an acceptable lifestyle just to name a few.
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Old 01-17-2009, 01:08 PM
 
381 posts, read 685,012 times
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I cannot see the wisdom in worrying about folks whose sin is no different than mine. Our righteousness before God is seen as nothing more than oily rags said the prophet.

force it on us? what they do not deserve? make us accept it.?

I'm with Jesus. I am not of this world. I have overcome the world. so why worry about what gay/lesbian wants through a poltical system. we didn't get a spirit of fear. I don't fear what the gay community wants.

As a parent, you can control what your child believes with godly parenting and ruling your house. nurture has considerable more clout than nature in this matter. i won't judge my friend, I'll just love him. jesus said do that and that alone.
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Old 01-17-2009, 03:44 PM
 
Location: Gaston, North Carolina
4,213 posts, read 5,037,572 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave737driver View Post
I cannot see the wisdom in worrying about folks whose sin is no different than mine. Our righteousness before God is seen as nothing more than oily rags said the prophet.
The difference is you repent and turn to God and they do not. You are concerned about their welfare in the long run that is in jepeordy so long as they remain unrepentant.

Quote:
force it on us? what they do not deserve? make us accept it.?

I'm with Jesus. I am not of this world. I have overcome the world. so why worry about what gay/lesbian wants through a poltical system. we didn't get a spirit of fear. I don't fear what the gay community wants.
Because there are weak people out there who fall for the lies and suffer and will suffer for eternity if we as good Christians do not fight the good fight. I do not fear them either, I fear for them as well as the weak willed of this world.

Quote:
As a parent, you can control what your child believes with godly parenting and ruling your house. nurture has considerable more clout than nature in this matter. i won't judge my friend, I'll just love him. jesus said do that and that alone.
No you cannot control what your child believes when the world outside bombards them with so much worldly temptations and tells them the parents dont know what they are talking about. Look at the school cariculums, peer pressure, advertisements on television and radio, and other things you see in public. Yes you can do your best to raise your children in Godly manner, but you are outnumbered and must fight to get what is right put into these areas and dispose of what is wrong. You are not judging anyone if you are merely sharing what the Lord has said concerning their situation, that is called going to them in love. If you do not go to your friend in love and share the truth then you hate your friend and have already judged them as unworthy of the truth by your inaction.
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Old 01-17-2009, 04:26 PM
 
381 posts, read 685,012 times
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Quote:
you are not judging anyone if you are sharing what the Lord has said concerning their situation. that is called going to them in love.
HI Robin,
i'm reminded of the proverb: raise a child up in the way they should and they will not depart from it" that is the word and i can hang my hat on it. I can bring a safety net of protection over my house and rebuke the evil that is out there. I think I can to that end control what my child believes to a degree; and fight and overcome what the enemy does with my shield of faith (greater is he that is within me ) and annointing.

Now concerning your last comment. I was in outside sales and marketing for 20 years. the good news of the gospel is simply john 3:16
I have shared my faith many times with my friend and as we see in Acts, most often the holy spirit sets up the encounter and directs our efforts just like Phillip and the centurion. Also, we can hindered as Paul was in Acts 17 I believe when he was prevented from going to macedonia.

so, until the holy spirit prepares my friends heart and mine to somehow deal with his sin , telling him that the penalty for his lifestyle is torment and the lake of fire is simply not good salesmanship. as an ambassador of the gospel, and as a salesman, i can tell you everything is based on good timing. you rather amused me when you said that by sharing with him the due penalty of his error as paul so eloquently stated in romans 1 , that I would be going to him in love.

The good of the cross is simple. Paul said I preach the cross and Him crucified. He talked about sexual immorality but the overriding message of christ love for us was never blanketed in the "if you don't do this, you'll burn in hell for eternity" . that selling style of the gospel is what has turned alot of lost asheep away from the church for years and it is why the lost souls always laugh when there is sexual scandal in the church like the gay, drug peddling evangelist in colorado of a few years ago, the pedophile priests, and who can forget jimmy swaggart.

my point is your style and many of those who condemn gays for their sexual sins act like they can "win" souls on their own talent. you forget and discount the work of the spirit. after all, no one can come to the father except through the son and only if the father draw him nigh. Jesus also said he would by no means cast someone out if they came on their own.
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Old 01-17-2009, 05:20 PM
 
40,252 posts, read 26,848,697 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinD69 View Post
You are not judging anyone if you are merely sharing what the Lord has said concerning their situation, that is called going to them in love. If you do not go to your friend in love and share the truth then you hate your friend and have already judged them as unworthy of the truth by your inaction.
This tired excuse for harassment and bigotry toward those whose lifestyle you find sinful or inexcusable simply won't fly anymore, Robin . . . Do you seriously believe that they do not know what you believe your God thinks of them . . . so that you must warn them and chastise them and urge them to repentance in your "tough love? " Come on!
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Old 01-17-2009, 05:36 PM
 
381 posts, read 685,012 times
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we have to be mindful of the leaven of the pharisees. I am like matthew the collector. Have mercy on me Lord , i am a sinner.

should there be a targeted message in the pulpit for porn lovers, adulterers,
those who lust with their eyes, ( I do it all the time) I'm happily married but struggle with this one area there! I said it. I love my wife , but I should walk around with blinders on and my head down given what the fashion world has done with womens clothing. maybe the muslim world has it right. would ya'll please just wrap up in sheets and quit wearing tthe low riding, underwear showing jeans. i kid my wife about getting plumber's butt all the time .
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Old 01-17-2009, 11:48 PM
 
3,270 posts, read 5,283,394 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave737driver View Post
we have to be mindful of the leaven of the pharisees. I am like matthew the collector. Have mercy on me Lord , i am a sinner.

should there be a targeted message in the pulpit for porn lovers, adulterers,
those who lust with their eyes, ( I do it all the time) I'm happily married but struggle with this one area there! I said it. I love my wife , but I should walk around with blinders on and my head down given what the fashion world has done with womens clothing. maybe the muslim world has it right. would ya'll please just wrap up in sheets and quit wearing tthe low riding, underwear showing jeans. i kid my wife about getting plumber's butt all the time .

I commend you for being honest about your struggles. Men are bombarded with so much sexuality that we do want to sometimes throw in the towel. When we see a woman, a movie, or anything that would make us have sexual thoughts is to try and stop it before we find ourselves entertaining them. I know for me and my wife, we both had to come to an understanding that watching porn alone or together is WRONG. Any tv shows that may entice you sexually need not be watched anymore.

As I say this, I know you can be watching a sports program or the news and they show some hot woman and BAM there you go thinking those thoughts or becoming aroused. For me, I only look at my wife sexually since, technically, she's the ONLY person I am supposed to having sex. It's something that you have to train your mind to do, especially since we live in a culture that says it's ok to look.

But looking is just as bad as doing the actual act because once you start having those fantasies, those fantasies are going to lead to temptation, and then the temptation will most definetly lead to you wanting your wife to be like the woman you have fantasized about. If your wife can't be like t hat woman, then the man starts to substitute his wife by doing other things like masturbating thinking about that woman or worse actually cheating on his wife to satisfy that urge to be with the woman he has been lusting after.

It's something to think about, I grew up in a household where my dad expected his sons to lose their viriginity by age 14,when it was ok for us to watch porn and be like wild dogs out there hounding girls or women for sex. Therefore, for me I had to UNLEARN some bad habits that I developed as a teen when I fully realized as a born again christian that I couldn't any longer hold on to things that would hinder my growth spiritually-watching porn, soft tv show porn, internet pictures, deliberately looking at women wearing fitted dresses, pants, shirts that get any man's attention. I hope this helps.
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Old 01-18-2009, 03:52 AM
 
381 posts, read 685,012 times
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thanks for your reply.. I travel alot as you know and many of my peers are obssessed with porn. by the power of the holy spirit that urge is simply removed. i just don't do it. as with my struggles, the enemy came at me in the form of a young gate agent that works many of my flights. she was doing many flirtatious things and i had to walk a fine line of not appearing callous and also not inviting her wrath. professionalism always wins and I saw this here. as a single man years ago before I was saved i saw the same thing in sales and I lost out either having given in to customer advances or to having then refused them. the one i politely declined since I was "availabe" made sure I lost the account.
to get back on point, I feel the holy spirit is the guide into having an opportunity to help a brother or sister a struggling in sin. I have seen it in dicipling to others. We go down a slippery slope when we let our zeal for being saved override a sense of tact and sensitivity toward talking about someone else's sin and here it was a gay lifestyle or sexual perversion.
when Robin I think tried to convince me that pointing out to someone that the due penalty of their way was eternal punishment and then called this sharing out of love , I had to say, Nah, nah, I don't think it is.
rememebr, we are dealing with humans and when the time is right and the holy spirit prepares our hearts as he did to Paul, peter,barnabas and others in acts, then not only will we speak the truth in Christ, but the message will get through because the spirit has worked on the other person as well. This is how it works throughout the bible and it is not my opinion or interpretation. Too much christian zeal and the hurling of bible verses at someone simply comes across the wrong way and it is why winning souls becomes some kind of sport and the real message of good news never makes it. It also gives the message of the cross a negative tone.
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Old 01-18-2009, 02:32 PM
 
4,439 posts, read 8,216,336 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinD69 View Post
Well lets see, they have demanded legal status for their sexual orientation, they have demanded marriage between same sex couples, they have demanded their lifestyle be taught in schools as an acceptable lifestyle just to name a few.
Legal status? They are already citizens so they already have legal status. Do you realize that homosexuals are not illegal aliens.

Yes..they demand the same rights you have. Fancy that. In a country where "all men are created" equal, isn't it funny that equal rights should be accepted.

My guess.. as I'm not gay.. is they DON'T want the version of marriage you think they do. See I'm guessing they'd like to stay married.. and since most heterosexual marriages end in divorce I'm guessing they are searching for something a little more meaningful.

However.. that has nothing to do with the tea in China. The fact is people are being DENIED rights because of their sexual orientation. Thats wrong. The biggest of these is healthcare.

LT and I are lucky.. see I work and she is able to stay at home. We feel blessed like that. However LT has to have health insurance. She just has to. As such she falls under the coverage of me.. her awesome husband (and I do mean awesome + infinity + 1 + how awesome you think you are + 2).

A loving gay couple is DENIED that same right. Its wrong.. its unconstitutional and believe me.. it will be changed. You can gnash you teeth till you turn blue.. but it will be changed. There will be a federal civil union law coming within the next 10-15 years.

As to their lifestyle being taught in schools. See.. the very fact you used the word lifestyle shows ignorance. I say this because I love my wife very much and take great offense to the fact that you call the love I have for my wife a "lifestyle". Its not a lifestyle. See I didn't pick to be heterosexual.. I just am. So when they teach sex ed in school.. they are teaching acceptance of different people.. not different positions.

In the end.. you won't change your mind and I wont' change mine. However I sleep well at night knowing the time is coming that laws will be introduced that extend the rights of this country to every citizen.. not just the citizens YOU deem worthy of having those rights. I sleep well at night knowing that when my child grows up and she is 30 something years old I can look her in the eye and say I totally supported rights for gay people. Not because I have gay friends.. not because a family member of mine is gay.... for no other reason because its the right thing to do under the laws of this country.

Federal civil unions between two people..

Marriage defined at the state level and let those churches decide if they want to be bigots as their right to not marry gay couples would be protected under the federal constitution set forth through case law already established.

See its quite easy.. a loving gay couple requires nothing from you. Not one single thing. Nothing.. zero... nada. You can preach what you want in the comfort of your own home. If you see fit you can tell you children how "the gays are bad"... thats your right. However its their right to have the same rights as you.

If you don't like it find another country. I hear Iran doesn't like gays.. maybe you could move there.. (Although they don't like Christians much there so I wouldn't broadcast that.. on the other hand then you would know what it was like for gay people.. call it a win win lesson).
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Old 01-18-2009, 05:29 PM
 
Location: Nowhere'sville
2,345 posts, read 3,908,537 times
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Why do some people make such a huge deal out this particular sin? Isn't a sin a sin? But when it comes to gays it's like some people run around in fear "Oh noooo it's a gay person! Help! Get it away!" I don't get it.
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