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Old 02-02-2009, 12:43 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
If He wrote His laws in our hearts? but what about the sins that are not literally in the bible. Wouldn't the Holy Spirit convict you? If you go against the Holy Spirit then aren't you sinning so really it is not left to the individual but the Holy Spirit to know if it is a sin or not?

the Holy Spirit, when really present, will prevent you from asking these questions. so please STOP here and now. Tx.


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Old 02-02-2009, 12:44 PM
 
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Originally Posted by SeekerSA View Post
I do not disagree with the OP title but what is sin to you may not be sin to another and both are right. It is when you want to compare yourself to others that the sin list comes out and you start comparing notes. This is the exact thing Jesus spoke against the S&P's, their false piety.

I do sense your heart is in the right place however - words sometimes fail us.
Well said, Seeker!
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Old 02-02-2009, 12:44 PM
 
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Originally Posted by effie briest View Post
the Holy Spirit, when really present, will prevent you from asking these questions. so please STOP here and now. Tx.


I want to know
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Old 02-02-2009, 12:50 PM
 
Location: MI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
If He wrote His laws in our hearts? but what about the sins that are not literally in the bible. Wouldn't the Holy Spirit convict you? If you go against the Holy Spirit then aren't you sinning so really it is not left to the individual but the Holy Spirit to know if it is a sin or not?
Well, I'm not sure what you were asking me since you just asked the same question I did about the Holy Spirit convicting you. What did you mean? (Referencing your response to me above...sorry I'm not getting it. )
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Old 02-02-2009, 12:53 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Not if we are acting out of agape love . . . if we are acting out of any other mindset . . . we may be . . . like judging or condemning others whose "spiritual state" we cannot possibly know for certain from their external acts.
If you love your child, you will judge your child. That is beside the point. I asked do we know all the sins we are committing? if not then why can't we, if we are acting out agape love or are those people fooling themselves?
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Old 02-02-2009, 12:58 PM
 
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Originally Posted by RobinD69 View Post
You are completely misunderstanding me. I am not saying you have to follow the letter of the law but that you will desire to follow the letter of the law if you trully love the Lord.
And I am saying the law becomes irrelevant when you have matured spiritually and understand its purpose . . . it is for the immature.
Quote:
I am speaking of the fruit of the spirit and anything else is hatred towards those you claim to love. How can you understand the true concept of agape love if your perception is clouded by the flesh? When we justify a sin and demand we be accepted no matter what we do then were are actually exibiting hatred for the Lord and defying the definition of love. Therefore our blind devotion to our perception of love is actually devotion to our carnal lusts and there is no true love in us because we have rejected the Love God has offered freely and sought after the love that leads to destruction.
No . . . I understand you completely. You are judging on the basis of carnal things externally adduced that may or may not have the internal "spiritual effect" you attribute to them . . . (probably because that WAS the effect it had in YOU . . . but you are a sample of one . . . not useful). We CANNOT know what the spiritual state of anyone else IS or IS NOT, period! We are not capable of it. ONLY Jesus is.
Quote:
By being selfish and doing the exact opposite of the definition of love we are as children, led artray by what feels good rather than guided by what is good for us.

Remember I am not saying we are saved by works or the law, but that these are examples of our salvation, that we desire to do the works of the Lord and reject the lusts of the world.

I say we because no one is perfect and we are all at different levels of our walk and sometimes we have veired off the path and honestly believe we are on a better path because of feelings and lust. It has taken some deep thinking and personal examination to be willing to admit to my own short comings and humble myself to the point I can understand that sin is sin is sin is sin.....
Too bad you don't realize that it is totally dependent on your state of mind (spiritual is of the mind . . . not the body) . . . not your acts.
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Old 02-02-2009, 01:00 PM
 
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Originally Posted by StirringWaters View Post
Well, I'm not sure what you were asking me since you just asked the same question I did about the Holy Spirit convicting you. What did you mean? (Referencing your response to me above...sorry I'm not getting it. )
I knew you would ask that , my question is would stake the claim to know every sin; does the Holy Spirit convict us every sin we commit and if not then is it because we are so fallen that we suppress the Holy Spirit in that manner?
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Old 02-02-2009, 01:05 PM
 
Location: Gaston, North Carolina
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Originally Posted by SeekerSA View Post
You are very close with most of your post. However this bit is backward.

How can you demonstrate Love of the Lord unless you can demonstrate that to your neighbor? The latter is observable the former not so unless you think some "church activities" do this for you?
I knew this objection would be brought up and I included the answer in a portion of the original statement. We cannot love our neighbor unless the love of God is within us. Another words we have no true concept of love without God and the only way we can have God is to accept his truth and love Him as He commands. We will fall for the lust of this world and accept hatred as love to appease the flesh therefore rejecting God. We seek after darkness rather than light when we want to justify our sins as acceptable rather than turn from them and seek God.

Quote:
IMO your post appears to have nuances of self projection in it or IOW, the sins you have/had problems with.

I do not disagree with the OP title but what is sin to you may not be sin to another and both are right. It is when you want to compare yourself to others that the sin list comes out and you start comparing notes. This is the exact thing Jesus spoke against the S&P's, their false piety.

I do sense your heart is in the right place however - words sometimes fail us.
As I have stated before in other posts, one of my favorite verses to live by is the removal of the post in my eye to see the speck in anothers. I am open to admit all my sins in relation to reaching out to another, because I know we all struggle with sin even if we do not realize we do. This just goes to show our different levels of our walk, our fruit will vary from person to person as we grow in the Lord. This leads to our perfection in the Lord the more we are willing to confess and accept the truth of the Lord the closer we become more like Him. I understand the statement that what is sin for one may niot be sin for another, but that is why we must come to a deeper understanding of the truth so we may be cleansed of all sin or understand that what we believe to be sin is not. As Paul wrote if eating meat is a sin for my brother then I will refrain from eating meat so as to not be a stumbling block to my brother. This goes along with Christ revealing to Peter that foods are not sinful even though we all know that some foods can cause us physical problem they have no effect on our spirit.

What I desire to do is bring all to a proper understanding of what we should and should not do, not by our own power but by the desire we have as the fruit of the spirit as we grow in our knowledge of the truth of Christ. Yes there are lists of sins in the Bible and many reject these list because they are still feeding on milk and cannot accpet the meat for now. I understand that many will want to say the opposite because they are still cought in their sins that they are blinded to do to their unwillingness to commit wholly to God. This is where the earlier example I gave of the definition of love. Love is not proud, or selfish and many are too proud to admit to sin and too selfish to give up a particular and expect the Lord to just accept their sin.

I am not here to point fingers at anyone or even to condemn or judge, I am just here to help those I can on their walk as I rely on others to help me on mine. I still sin even if my sins are small they are still sins and even if I do not realize something is sin, it still is and until I come to that realization then I am only cheating myself of the blessings the Lord wants to give me. We are all in this boat and Satan will take every opportunity to blind us to that fact and keep us from our full potential. We are commanded to emulate Christ and we cannot do this if we are willing to live in sin and justify it as acceptable to the Lord.
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Old 02-02-2009, 01:05 PM
 
37,615 posts, read 25,307,232 times
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Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
If you love your child, you will judge your child. That is beside the point.
It is not beside the point if you extend that judging to those who are NOT your children.
Quote:
I asked do we know all the sins we are committing? if not then why can't we, if we are acting out agape love or are those people fooling themselves?
And you don't seem to get the meaning of grace that stems from the agape LOVE . . . you cannot commit sin in that state of mind, period!
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Old 02-02-2009, 01:13 PM
 
Location: MI
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Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
I knew you would ask that , my question is would stake the claim to know every sin; does the Holy Spirit convict us every sin we commit and if not then is it because we are so fallen that we suppress the Holy Spirit in that manner?
Oh. Good question! I have no idea. I'll have to pray about that.

Sometimes I think you ask these things of me on purpose... (I am truly being silly here, I promise...lol.)
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