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So, you seem to really be asking what is God's standard for righteousness, instead of what is sin? We don't know what sin is unless we know what righteousness is (see Romans 7:7 above). I'd like to add one more verse to that:
You, however, continue in the things you have learned and become convinced of, knowing from whom you have learned them, and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.
-2 Tim 3:14-17
Scripture in this verse most likely refers to the only scripture they had at the time - the old testament (if you disagree, what scripture do you believe he is referring to?) While we are not under the law, all scripture (old testament) is useful as a way to determine God's standard of righteousness for us.
And I do not personally feel that the 10 comands define sin, and instead that they, in fact, define the Law, written in stone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harold Kupp
What you feel and what Paul said appear to contradict....
Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
With all due respect to your feelings - I think I will go with Paul.
HK
Using the same verse you completely misunderstand, reread it slowly this time, and then what I wote.
Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin?God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Is the Law sin, defined? No, it(the commands) define the Law.
Have you ever been caught stealing? No? Then you must be a good thief, right?
See the logic behind what you say?
The commandment says thou shalt not steal. Does that make us ALL thieves? No! It says not to covet your neighbors wife. Does that make you lust? No!
It is only if you do those things, which the Spirit convicts you of, that defines the sin in your life.
It is only if you do those things, which the Spirit convicts you of, that defines the sin in your life.
The bible also says to study to show ourselves approved unto God. The Holy Spirit convicts us of sin, but God has also said that His Word is useful for teaching, rebuking, and correcting, and He said that while we were (are) under the new covenant.
Using the same verse you completely misunderstand, reread it slowly this time, and then what I wote.
Actually what you said that I was responding to was:
HotinAZ
"And I do not personally feel that the 10 comands define sin, and instead that they, in fact, define the Law, written in stone."
What you missed requires deductive reasoning... Paul said:
I had not know sin except the law said - and then quoted one of the ten commandments.
Now here is where it gets tricky - you see if Paul said the law defines sin and then says the law said - Thou shalt Not Covet - he was referring to the ten commandments.
You you do not feel that the ten commands define sin - Paul does. Get it?
So really what you are telling me is that God gave us sin, defined. Or you say that Paul did, even though I don't see it.
See, I would rather you said God gave us Love, or the lack there of, defined.
Is it Love to steal, or to kill, or to covet? No? Then by doing those things which God had commanded we should not do, we are actually telling and showing God that we do not love Him, or our fellow man enough, or at all.
Though we reside, alone for now, in a carnal body, set to decay, upon physical death, we are united by our Creator. All part of a Glorious Body. To achieve what our purposes are, we must always remain pure in heart, and remaining pure, must reflect that which our Teacher taught us. Namely to Love.
This concentration on sin, and the Law as it was supposed to be laid out, giving us a roadmap unto righteousness, is starting to consume some on here. Adam, Seth, Abraham, Enoch, Jacob, Joseph, and countless others before Moses on the mountain, knew what the Divine Law was, and they lived out their lives following God, loving God, and God reflected that back unto them.
Do you need a command telling you not to kill, in order for you to know that killing is wrong? I mean, really? Does it matter if it is in the Bible telling you that killing is a sin? Would you kill, if it wasn't? That there is the difference, between what these folks on here are telling you, and what you are failing to "see".
This is the 21st Century. There are ALOT more defined sins out there than the original 10 on stone. For myself, they number in the hundreds. And since I don't live in a tent in a wilderness, tending herds all day, I am sure you can relate to what I am saying, as you probably don't either.
I would like to do a study on this word, because there are a ton of people who hold to the teachings of Moses, and those who hold to the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles, or perhaps they hold to both.
So what is the direct point, that defines what a transgression against God, or man, is?
And while we are at it, let us list them.
Jam 4:17Therefore, to one who knows {the} right thing to do and does not do it, to him it is sin.
Here, the apostle John has already given the definition of sin:
"Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law." 1 John 3:4
Therefore, to one who knows {the} right thing to do and does not do it, to him it is trangression of the law.
Here, the apostle John has already given the definition of sin:
"Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law." 1 John 3:4
Therefore, to one who knows {the} right thing to do and does not do it, to him it is trangression of the law.
The Divine Law, Donna, the Divine One! LOVE! Let God transform that stone into flesh, and let Him Circumcise it,,molding it after His Own Likeness. Once that is done, there is no longer the need for the tablets. It is written on your heart, transformed and completed. His Glory, becomes a part of you, and this is what the Body of Christ is, built with the Chief Corner-Stone, the New Temple, the Annointed.
Forcussing on the dead letter, will only result in the same,,,dead. Focus instead on the Living Word, which Loved us so much He gave His Life, in order that we have Life, His Life.
How about the definition by Heinlein? "The only sin is hurting other people unnecessarily, Hurting yourself is not sinful, just stupid."
Heinlein? Who is Heinlein to supplant the word of God with his opinions? Heinlein has no authority.
The Lord Reigns!
He created the heavens and the earth. The creation has no authority or power over The Creator. His royal law is the standard that he will use to judge all men.
The Divine Law, Donna, the Divine One! LOVE! Let God transform that stone into flesh, and let Him Circumcise it,,molding it after His Own Likeness. Once that is done, there is no longer the need for the tablets. It is written on your heart, transformed and completed. His Glory, becomes a part of you, and this is what the Body of Christ is, built with the Chief Corner-Stone, the New Temple, the Annointed.
Forcussing on the dead letter, will only result in the same,,,dead. Focus instead on the Living Word, which Loved us so much He gave His Life, in order that we have Life, His Life.
It is not possible to love God --or our neighbor without obeying The Ten Commandments. If you are disobeying any one of them, then you do not love.
It is not possible to love God --or our neighbor without obeying The Ten Commandments. If you are disobeying any one of them, then you do not love.
1 John 3:22-24...
22And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight. 23And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
24And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
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