Does this verse apply to Christians?

[MysticPhD]

Originally Posted by Harold Kupp

What happens is that modern Christianity filters the Biblical verses through those cliches so that when I quote the Scripture "Thou hatest all workers of iniquity" after filtering it comes out:

"Jesus loves me that I know because the Bible tells me so"

HK

Someone centered in hate . . . (a human emotion resulting from our weakness and sinful animal nature) . . . is unable to understand that hate is the result of weakness and sin and could NEVER be a part of God. It is sad . . . because a soul with hate can NEVER be allowed to be in the presence of God either.

[Fundamentalist]

Originally Posted by MysticPhD

Someone centered in hate . . . (a human emotion resulting from our weakness and sinful animal nature) . . . is unable to understand that hate is the result of weakness and sin and could NEVER be a part of God. It is sad . . . because a soul with hate can NEVER be allowed to be in the presence of God either.

Love is a human emotion also and so it could never be from God either? that is your criteria of what is or what isn't from God. READ YOUR BIBLE!

[Harold Kupp]

Originally Posted by Fundamentalist

Love is a human emotion also and so it could never be from God either? that is your criteria of what is or what isn't from God. READ YOUR BIBLE!

Isn't the real problem the false concept that God's love is unconditional when the Scriptures absolutey state that continuing to receive God's love is conditional upon what we do?

HK


John 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.


John 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.


John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

[moonsavvy]

You know I have to say that after reading many post's in this forum over the years, I've just had a breakthrough. The most fundamental people who (to me) are very "pushy" with their beliefs are only doing it because they really feel that what they are doing is out of love. To them they "know" there is a hell and they don't want the rest of us to go to hell. They want to see others go to heaven, and I can see how it is loving in their own way (even though I don't agree with it).

I use to read their post's and it would irritate me because I felt their delivery was very self righteous, but now I see that really they do it because of care and concern for their fellow "man". hmmm little break through for me. I do continue to follow my own path but I can respect the fundamentalist's view. FINALLY, took me a while but I can identify with it and in return really respect it! Much Love.

Moonsavvy (seeker and believer)

[ShanaBrown]

Shana writes:

I believe that the scriptures teach that God hates sin and loves the sinner.


Shana thank you for the discussion - I understand your views and I accept that you truly believe the comment above.

Thank you for the discussion also, Harold.

From my point of view what you believe is the result of Christian Cliches such as:

"God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life"

Well, I do believe that the scriptures teach us that God loves us and that He has a plan for our lives. His plan is to restore all of us to Himself. (Ephesians 1) This a wonderful, glorious plan.

"God hates sin but loves the sinner"

Yes, God does hate sin. Jesus came to set us sinners free from our sins. Sin is toxic, destroys, is incompatible with God. If He did not love us sinners, Jesus would not have died for us. The sinful man in us is to be destroyed but there is a new creation in Christ Jesus.

"Christians are sinners too - just forgiven"

I believe that believers are not to continue a life of sin. We are forgiven and as a result, we are to live our lives for the Lord. We do stumble and fall at times and we are hopefully putting to death the old man, learning to please the Lord. The old man must go. We are to turn away from a life of sin. We want to please the Lord and we are sinners saved by His grace. We once were lost but now we are found, we were once blind, but now we see. ...new creations in Christ.

What happens is that modern Christianity filters the Biblical verses through those cliches so that when I quote the Scripture "Thou hatest all workers of iniquity" after filtering it comes out:

"Jesus loves me that I know because the Bible tells me so"

The Bible does tell us that God loves us. We learn from the scriptures that God sent His Son to die for us, to reconcile us to Himself. God who is love sent Jesus to be the Savior of the world. I pray that you come to know the love of God for us Harold. Take care and God bless you.

[MysticPhD]

Originally Posted by Fundamentalist

Love is a human emotion also and so it could never be from God either? that is your criteria of what is or what isn't from God. READ YOUR BIBLE!

You have never understood this distinction, Fundy . . . all our positive human emotions are from God as part of our being "like" God (in His "likeness"). The negative human emotions are the result of a "battle." A COMBINATION . . . of our positive spiritual nature (from God) and our confused consciousness (Ego) corrupted by our uncontrolled (not "overcome") sinful human nature. Your lack of understanding of this basis of NEGATIVE human emotions is why you misunderstand God . . . who has no such internal conflicting emotions.