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14And the LORD God said unto the serpent[satan or the devil], Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: 15And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel
This is very interesting, for what God said should be taken very seriously, and that is that the serpent had a seed..
Now for that to be true, He [satan] was a Father..which Jesus affirms for us in jn 8:
44Ye are of your father the devil
What this means, is that satan or the devil had within him a posterity, a generation, a offspring as the word father and seed imply..
Lets look at the definition of seed as in gen 3 15
its the word zera and means:
offspring, descendants, posterity, children
Now lets look at the word father as in jn 8 44 as jesus calls the devil:
Its the word pater and means:
a more remote ancestor, the founder of a family or tribe, progenitor of a people, forefather: so Abraham is called, Jacob and David
generator or male ancestor
Now, how did satan become a father or the possesor of a seed or ancestory ? Was it because he had sex with eve ? No..It was because God said so..
God said He , satan has a seed, a prodigy, and that settles it..Just like when God told abraham he has a prodigy, a seed, that settled it..
But here is the kicker, if satan as adam had a seed, in the beginning, then each father, when acting, when they sinned, did not do it as private entities, but by Gods decree, all whom they represented [their respective seed in them] sinned as well..Thats just how God designed it folks, cant argue it, cant debate it, its a done deal..
We know that adam sinned in the beginning, and we have clear scripture testimony that the devil sinned from the beginning 1 jn 3:
8He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning
Now wether or not this sin of the devil was causing adam and eve to sin,or, a form of mureder, or if its referring to an earlier sin, perhaps when he was kicked out of heaven, nevertheless, he had a seed for whom he represented..and it was not the other angels who fell with him, but this seed was in him, as the elect seed was in adam..
Now, whomever God constitutes as sinning in the devil, that person will never be forgiven as their father will not be forgiven..Jesus christ did not love or die for the devil, hence nor his seed..because God sees them as one..see jn 6 70
But Jesus christ both loved and died for adam and his seed, whom eve was out of him, and this pictured, adam and eve, his Love for the church eph 5:
31For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.
32This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
you see, satan and his seed, didnt prefigure Gods Love to the church, but adam and eve did..big difference wouldnt you say ?
Now whomever God constitutes as sinning in adam, they will be forgiven and will recieve the remission of sins..
Next we will look at a very important sequence in isa 53:
12Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.
The ones Jesus spake to were jews at the time jn 8:
44Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
But by no means am i saying that this seed is exclusively Jewish, because its not, its in all races of people..
The ones Jesus spake to were jews at the time jn 8:
44Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
But by no means am i saying that this seed is exclusively Jewish, because its not, its in all races of people..
Yes but He also said to them i know you are Abraham's seed in the very same chapter
37[Yes] I know that you are Abraham's offspring; yet you plan to kill Me, because My word has no entrance (makes no progress, does not find any place) in you.
Jesus was obviously speaking of the spirit they were of and not what seed they were born of . Just like when He rebuked Peter and said get behind me satan.
On the original subject "satan's seed" please be plain and say that you believe satan Moderator cut: I'm no prude, but... Eve and Cain was born as a result. I don't deny your documentation and quote of scripture that may or may not support your argument. I just happen to prefer when people cut to the chase, say as simply as possible what they mean and then go into all the supporting arguments to back up the conclusion.
Frankly, I sit on the fence on this one? I have not been enlightened by the Holy Spirit on this one yet. We have discussed it and I see some validity to the claim. But if satan Moderator cut: forum rules say "Keep it PG-13 Eve, was it the first time she had ever had intercourse and was Adam's sin following up behind satan? Am I to believe that with Adam and Eve sitting around naked all that time, watching the animals go at it, they never gave it a try? And if they did have sex before Eve reportedly did it with satan, then was the sin Eve committed the one of adultery? And if that is true, then how does that relate back to the warning by God to not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil?
You see, I am willing to consider the possiblity of the conclusion but there are too many other questions surrounding it that I need to have answered before I am willing to stake my religious belief on it. Frankly, I find too much emphasis given on subjects such as this when I think people should really focus more on the simple Love and Sacrifice of Jesus. I believe if we all put our greatest focus on Jesus and what he taught and how he asked us to live we and the world would be a lot better off. These debates, though interesting topics for discussion, can be dangerous by causing us to base our belief on things that we really can't know until The Holy Spirit makes them known to us.
Simply put, I am afraid to agree on anything much past the existence of God as creator of all things, our salvation by the blood of Christ and the gift of The Holy Spirit that was sent by Christ. Beyond that, I am in dangerous territory and subject to believe in a lie. Let Chirst's love and sacrifice be sufficient for me and let me do as he instructed and lead me not into temptation (to think I know) but deliver me from evil (to know I know) when actually I know too little?
On the original subject "satan's seed" please be plain and say that you believe satan Moderator cut: orphaned 'reference' Eve and Cain was born as a result
no i dont believe that, but here is what i teach about that:
Humm, I guess I would have to think on that a while. I was basing my definition of satan's seed regarding William Barnham from the comments in Wikipedia about that topic.
It seems you are talking about a spiritual seed - though even after reading all of the link you posted, I am still not sure of what it said.
A question for you - God created satan, correct? God created all of the angels that fell, correct? Was it God's will that it happen? If God is supreme and in total control of every event in the life of man, is it not possible that God Knew, Allowed and Uses satan simply to build an acceptable Church for His Son and even in that, He knows whom are tares and whom will be wheat?
I heard a scripture once that I can not find - something to the efffect that in our weakness, He is perfected. If God allows and condons satan and wickedness to exist is it not so that we, his people may be tested - not so that we may make ourselves worthy because that could never happen but so in our proper choices during the attacks by satan and sacrifices as we embrass the blood of Jesus that we may be shown as acceptable to recieve the Groom on the appointed day?
Yes, I would have to agree that we are satan's seed spiritually because we lost God's spiritual seed in the fall from grace but God did not come unprepared, I believe our physical seed enters back into the physical realm where every chunk of matter or wave of energy is from God, by God, of God and returns to God. It is somewhat metaphysical, I suppose but I don't think we can deny our physical creator as being God. It may be true that satan lead us into sin but he did not make us. The matter and energy that occupies the "me" space are all created by God.
Sorry for jumping all around the subject but that's kind of what I do.
Humm, I guess I would have to think on that a while. I was basing my definition of satan's seed regarding William Barnham from the comments in Wikipedia about that topic.
You should base what someone says by what they say, and not what someone else says..people are different in their understandings about any given subject..
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