U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-02-2009, 10:20 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 2,266,496 times
Reputation: 231
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
but now you have added things. Grace and faith.
If that is the way my words appear to you , then I must struggle to be more clear in picking my words.

"For by Grace you have been saved through faith"

The Grace
part is the Father sending his only Son to die for you, and in his resurrection there is the offer to all of mankind to be reborn and forgiven.

The Faith part is that part within you that responds to the Lord's voice to believe.

Faith saves alone, but saving faith is never alone.
Good Works come with saving faith every time.

The form the Good Works take in your life might be very different than the way they show themselves in my life...
The Good works of some are rather showy and get a lot of attention, (Think of the church at Corinth)
Others have some very minor good Works to offer God, (Think of the thief on the cross)

But the works themselves dont save us or anybody else.

The Good Works of a Christian are a sign to the unbeliever, they strengthen the church body, they help with our own personal walks, but they never save us...rather they "confirm" that salvation has already happened.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-02-2009, 10:36 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 2,266,496 times
Reputation: 231
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
Over what premise now did a person doing the "list" in Jesus name, then be told to depart?
The answer is found in the words of Jesus to this very question-
"Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

The answer is not that Jesus was totally unaware of the persons.
Jesus is not saying that he was ignorant of their being alive.

Rather he is saying that they were never a believer in him, they never became one of his flock.
They had no personal connection with the Lord.

The term "evildoers" points us away from them being anything but very bad people in God's eyes...

So, going over the list of things the people are said by Jesus to be doing in His name, and understanding that they people were actually very evil, you catch on to what type of person we are talking about.....(insert Jimmy Swaggart's name here)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2009, 10:48 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 3,302,316 times
Reputation: 628
Do you believe you do not need to provide the verse that states believing only in the resurrection of Christ is all that is needed?

Because most of what you write seems to just be dancing around your original statement in this regaurd by adding other things. I would not say it is a matter of having to choose your words differently, I think you may simply be wrong within the context of eternal doom.

If I was to think I needed saving from some eternal doom, then I would shy away from what your saying as it is too unclear to not be risky.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2009, 11:02 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 2,266,496 times
Reputation: 231
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
Do you believe you do not need to provide the verse that states believing only in the resurrection of Christ is all that is needed?

.
For what?
I dont understand the question?

I know that the bible tells us that:"They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved" and then they went and were baptised.

or that it says also that "
"If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved." ...

So acts like speaking in tongues, or being baptised, or making a confession of faith will always come with saving faith.
But faith is what saves alone.

It dont matter to me what Good Work your salvation brings with it.
I rejoice that you have faith, and enjoy your good works.
But the Good Works are not the important meaty part, they are the dressing.
Always there with and along side the main dish.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2009, 11:05 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 2,266,496 times
Reputation: 231
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post

Because most of what you write seems to just be dancing around your original statement.
Like I said before, I may have to be more careful in the words I use, as sometimes a phrase that I think is very clear in its meaning to me, is totally lost on others.

So if there is anything I have written you think I need to go over again, just let me know.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2009, 11:06 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 3,302,316 times
Reputation: 628
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
For what?
I dont understand the question?

I know that the bible tells us that:"They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved" and then they went and were baptised.

or that it says also that "
"If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved." ...

So acts like speaking in tongues, or being baptised, or making a confession of faith will always come with saving faith.
But faith is what saves alone.

It dont matter to me what Good Work your salvation brings with it.
I rejoice that you have faith, and enjoy your good works.
But the Good Works are not the important meaty part, they are the dressing.
Always there with and along side the main dish.

But you have went from believing "in the resurrection of Jesus" to "Jesus is Lord"

While it is the same person, you have supplied two different premises now.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2009, 11:09 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 2,266,496 times
Reputation: 231
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
I think you may simply be wrong within the context of eternal doom.

.
I totally lost you here....

I was not aware that I had used the term 'eternal doom",
Nor was i aware that on this topic i had addressed that "eternal doom" issue.

perhaps i have, but have forgotten?
I dont know....I guess I could have, but I sure dont remember that right now as i write this to you.

Where did I bring that topic up?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2009, 11:16 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 3,302,316 times
Reputation: 628
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
I totally lost you here....

I was not aware that I had used the term 'eternal doom",
Nor was i aware that on this topic i had addressed that "eternal doom" issue.

perhaps i have, but have forgotten?
I dont know....I guess I could have, but I sure dont remember that right now as i write this to you.

Where did I bring that topic up?

Hmm, what then is the result of not believing in the resurrected Christ?

Nothing happens I suppose?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2009, 11:18 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 2,266,496 times
Reputation: 231
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
But you have went from believing "in the resurrection of Jesus" to "Jesus is Lord"
.
The "Jesus is Lord' is the work listed in that verse....
(Go read it for yourself to be sure of what Im saying)

Remember: "Jesus is Lord" that is what you say with your mouth in that verse.

It's an action.
Its a good work...

But just saying that is meaningless unless what?....
The answer to that question brings us to the other part of that same verse...
"and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved."


So just saying the words , (or just doing works) is pointless without the faith that is behind the good works being in the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

It is though faith that God has saved us, not the works that come always with our faith.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2009, 11:20 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 2,266,496 times
Reputation: 231
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
Hmm, what then is the result of not believing in the resurrected Christ?
The pile of works in your life become meaningless...
and you hear Jesus say to you : "Depart from me, I never knew you"
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $84,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:02 AM.

© 2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top