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Old 07-28-2009, 09:50 AM
 
2,981 posts, read 4,462,316 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
A person is born a lawbreaker..worthy of hell..
No they are not, in Adam, for Jesus Christ has cleansed Adam from the transgression which separated Adam in death from the presence of Glory. Today is the Day of Salvation, in which the Gospel is to be proclaimed to all men.
We in Adam are now clean, for the transgression of our first father is put away by the Atonement which was once, for all men/Adam persons, and the first death is ended; and whosoever will may enter into the presence of the Holy Glory in heaven through Jesus Christ, by adoption into His One Living Spirit.
The nephillim spirits are the only ones born as foul and unclean and without hope for redemption, as they are begotten by unlawful transgression of the eternal law. They are the demon spirits when disembodied, who have no hope for eternal salvation, for they are not of God, but of the evil natures of the fallen watchers.

You are in gross error to call Adam persons foul, who are now cleansed of Adam's transgression which caused the separation, by the once for all Atonement; and all in Adam need to hear the Gospel call proclaimed, so as to know they are invited to enter into the Salvation offered in this day of Grace to all nations, by the Atonement of Christ Jesus, our Kinsman/Redeemer.

You blaspheme God, by your false and evil condemnations of those whom Jesus has died to save, and this is not the day of judgment and condemnation for any Adam person/soul, but is the Day of Salvation, when the Gospel/Good News is to be proclaimed to all souls in Adam, in all the age of the Church, in all the earth.
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Old 07-28-2009, 09:59 AM
 
Location: New England
32,221 posts, read 21,094,471 times
Reputation: 2274
Quote:
Originally Posted by yeshuasavedme View Post
Conviction of right and wrong is given by the Light that lights every man that comes into the world. The power to become sons of God is given by Jesus Christ, who is the Light that lights every man that comes into the world, in the hopes that they may seek the Light while they have the Light, before the darkness overtakes them and the Light is taken away forever and forever, for those cast into the Lake of Fire; where they are undying worms with no hope for remedy, and suffer the blackness of darkness forever; separated eternally from the Light which lights every man that comes into the world, and which Light seeks all men to come and be made new, in Christ.
Today is the Day of Salvation, when the Light is drawing all men to Jesus Christ, so as to be saved from their own fallen state of being in Adam, and be made adopted sons of God in the New Man name and nature.

To know what is right does not mean one has the power to do what is right. In Adam, we are hopelessly dead in spirit, as sons of God, and we must be born anew, into the One Living Spirit, to have eternal Life and the power to walk ion the Spirit of the New Man, and not be bound to do the deeds of our old man nature.


Well your today may not be today to another. It actually says "today if you hear is voice".

Yes you are right about the Light , but and it's a big but

9What shall we conclude then? Are we any better[b]? Not at all! We have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under sin. 10As it is written:
"There is no one righteous, not even one;
11there is no one who understands,
no one who seeks God.
12All have turned away,
they have together become worthless;
there is no one who does good,
not even one."[c]
13"Their throats are open graves;
their tongues practice deceit."[d]
"The poison of vipers is on their lips."[e]
14"Their mouths are full of cursing and bitterness."[f]
15"Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16ruin and misery mark their ways,
17and the way of peace they do not know."[g]
18"There is no fear of God before their eyes."[h]
19Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. 20Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin.


Do you honestly believe that God who is Love is going to send billions upon billions who have never heard the message of salvation or if they have heard it it's a perverted by the religious system of christianity to the lake of fire sponsored by christianity to fry for eternity ?

No wonder the world rejects christianity . By the way there are millions of believers in the Lord Jesus Christ out there who have not part in the religious system of christianity.

Last edited by pcamps; 07-28-2009 at 10:14 AM..
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Old 07-28-2009, 01:08 PM
 
3 posts, read 3,261 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
How can God judge a man by their God given conscience ?. If you read Romans chapter 7 it's made perfectly clear the the things you should be doing you can't, and the things you shouldn't be doing you find yourself doing.In otherwords the Adamic nature is not capable of pleasing God in any shape or form, no flesh shall be justified before God
Jesus makes all the difference in this life and in the life to come . He's the Savior of ALL men and will draw all men to salvation and will cause all men to bow the knee and confess that Jesus Christ is Lord.
Romans 2:12-16 - 12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

Read the entire passage please. God will judge the gentiles who were never given God's laws (in other words those who never had the truth) by the way their mind worked with their conscience, which is given to them by God. And as for chapter 7 Paul was talking about himself, not everyone; some people are more morally inclined than others.

Last edited by jesusstricken; 07-28-2009 at 01:13 PM.. Reason: wanted to include some information
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Old 07-28-2009, 01:14 PM
 
Location: New England
32,221 posts, read 21,094,471 times
Reputation: 2274
Well i know if i am left to myself i am the same wretched man that Paul was .

Jesus said forgive them Father for they know not what they do. I was a law breaker from the gecko , i tried to be good , but because i inherited the adamic nature i could never have pleased God even if i tried , i had no clue about the righteousness of God ,i lived by the depraved mind i was given over to , i was in total darkness until the Lord shed the light of His glorious gospel into my heart.

Romans 11

32For God has bound all men over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

Read the whole book of Romans
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Old 07-28-2009, 01:24 PM
 
Location: E: (0.00) - S: (-0.97)
229 posts, read 286,815 times
Reputation: 243
Default you are equally guilty, just much more subtil and deceptive

Quote:
Originally Posted by yeshuasavedme View Post
No they are not, in Adam, for Jesus Christ has cleansed Adam from the transgression which separated Adam in death from the presence of Glory. Today is the Day of Salvation, in which the Gospel is to be proclaimed to all men.
We in Adam are now clean, for the transgression of our first father is put away by the Atonement which was once, for all men/Adam persons, and the first death is ended; and whosoever will may enter into the presence of the Holy Glory in heaven through Jesus Christ, by adoption into His One Living Spirit.
The nephillim spirits are the only ones born as foul and unclean and without hope for redemption, as they are begotten by unlawful transgression of the eternal law. They are the demon spirits when disembodied, who have no hope for eternal salvation, for they are not of God, but of the evil natures of the fallen watchers.

You are in gross error to call Adam persons foul, who are now cleansed of Adam's transgression which caused the separation, by the once for all Atonement; and all in Adam need to hear the Gospel call proclaimed, so as to know they are invited to enter into the Salvation offered in this day of Grace to all nations, by the Atonement of Christ Jesus, our Kinsman/Redeemer.

You blaspheme God, by your false and evil condemnations of those whom Jesus has died to save, and this is not the day of judgment and condemnation for any Adam person/soul, but is the Day of Salvation, when the Gospel/Good News is to be proclaimed to all souls in Adam, in all the age of the Church, in all the earth.
I've said this before and I'll say it again, I can't understand why you are accusing beloved57 of blasphemy, when essentially you believe the same thing he does, the only difference that I can see is that beloved57 is offering a more reasonable explanation of why he believes all are not saved, (albeit it being vile and unspeakable to anyone with an inkling of true compassion and empathy for anyone other than themselves)

If all people are not saved then beloved has be right, if God knows all from the beginning to the end and everything is set in stone before this charade and farce is even played out, I do agree with beloved when he says God will have His own way.

Isa 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love

People are quick to accuse and point fingers at the universalists and conditionalists for being in error and quick to call them heretics, even although these people really sought the Lord, because they were not merely content with being spoonfed the doctrines of the day, and worrying about no one else besides just themselves and just waiting and trusting on the Lord waiting to be rapture, letting the world go to (in their own eyes) deserved fate
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Old 07-28-2009, 01:26 PM
 
Location: New England
32,221 posts, read 21,094,471 times
Reputation: 2274
Quote:
Originally Posted by alisonminnie View Post
I've said this before and I'll say it again, I can't understand why you are accusing beloved57 of blasphemy, when essentially you believe the same thing he does, the only difference that I can see is that beloved57 is offering a more reasonable explanation of why he believes all are not saved, (albeit it being vile and unspeakable to anyone with an inkling of true compassion and empathy for anyone other than themselves)

If all people are not saved then beloved has be right, if God knows all from the beginning to the end and everything is set in stone before this charade and farce is even played out, I do agree with beloved when he says God will have His own way.

Isa 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love

People are quick to accuse and point fingers at the universalists and conditionalists for being in error and quick to call them heretics, even although these people really sought the Lord, because they were not merely content with being spoonfed the doctrines of the day, and worrying about no one else besides just themselves and just waiting and trusting on the Lord waiting to be rapture, letting the world go to (in their own eyes) deserved fate
I agree and also agree with you about Beloved57 .
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Old 07-28-2009, 07:29 PM
 
3 posts, read 3,261 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Well i know if i am left to myself i am the same wretched man that Paul was .

Jesus said forgive them Father for they know not what they do. I was a law breaker from the gecko , i tried to be good , but because i inherited the adamic nature i could never have pleased God even if i tried , i had no clue about the righteousness of God ,i lived by the depraved mind i was given over to , i was in total darkness until the Lord shed the light of His glorious gospel into my heart.

Romans 11

32For God has bound all men over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

Read the whole book of Romans
I won't argue with you on that one pcamps I'm right there with you and Paul, but there are those few who live extraordinarily upright lives. For example, Joseph, Daniel, and Job just to name three. So it's not anti-biblical to say that some people are more moral then others. I do agree that we are saved by God's grace, but the reality is that faith in that grace is not enough. The bible teaches that faith without works is dead faith. My point is that salvation is a little more complex than faith in Jesus Christ as our savior, so lets not be hasty when telling somone whether or not we think one of their loved ones will be saved.
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:05 AM
 
Location: New England
32,221 posts, read 21,094,471 times
Reputation: 2274
Quote:
Originally Posted by jesusstricken View Post
I won't argue with you on that one pcamps I'm right there with you and Paul, but there are those few who live extraordinarily upright lives. For example, Joseph, Daniel, and Job just to name three. So it's not anti-biblical to say that some people are more moral then others. I do agree that we are saved by God's grace, but the reality is that faith in that grace is not enough. The bible teaches that faith without works is dead faith. My point is that salvation is a little more complex than faith in Jesus Christ as our savior, so lets not be hasty when telling somone whether or not we think one of their loved ones will be saved.
I actually know people who are not christians who live out their lives that would put most of us to shame,but they are still bound under disobedience that God may have mercy over all.

I believe the good news cannot be more simple , it's faith in His grace alone . For those who truelly believe the word tells us that we are His workmanship , He works in us to will and to do, He's the Author and finisher of our faith.

None of us have arrived , many of us really have not even set off because
we believe tradition and the teaching of men over the word of God , the fact is we cannot change ourselves , Jesus said we can do nothing of our ownselves.

The problem for the christian is not his lack of works but of being sin conscicous rather than God conscious , all of our struggles stem from this.
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