Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
MightyN you wanted some scriptures so see if you can make these scriptures out to be the carnal mind or the flesh.
Let’s see if satan is ALWAYS in reference to the carnal mind or the flesh, Or whether it is also used of spirit beings.
Numbers 22:22
22 And God’s anger was kindled because he went: and the angel of the LORD stood in the way for an adversary/satan against him. Now he was riding upon his ass, and his two servants were with him.
Is this angel also the carnal mind or the flesh? Or a spirit being? I think it would be hard to prove that this angel is the carnal mind or flesh of man.
Job 1:6-12
6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them. 7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it. 8 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? 9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought? 10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land. 11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face. 12 And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.
Job 2:1-7
Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD. 2 And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it. 3 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou movedst me against him, to destroy him without cause. 4 And Satan answered the LORD, and said, Skin for skin, yea, all that a man hath will he give for his life. 5 But put forth thine hand now, and touch his bone and his flesh, and he will curse thee to thy face. 6 And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, he is in thine hand; but save his life.
7 So went Satan forth from the presence of the LORD, and smote Job with sore boils from the sole of his foot unto his crown.
Is satan here also the carnal mind or the flesh? Or is it a spiritual being?
Luke 10:17-20
17 And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name. 18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. 19 Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you. 20 Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven.
Is satan here the carnal mind or the flesh? Or is it a spiritual being?
Luke 13:10-16
10 And he was teaching in one of the synagogues on the sabbath. 11 And, behold, there was a woman which had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bowed together, and could in no wise lift up herself. 12 And when Jesus saw her, he called her to him, and said unto her, Woman, thou art loosed from thine infirmity. 13 And he laid his hands on her: and immediately she was made straight, and glorified God. 14 And the ruler of the synagogue answered with indignation, because that Jesus had healed on the sabbath day, and said unto the people, There are six days in which men ought to work: in them therefore come and be healed, and not on the sabbath day. 15 The Lord then answered him, and said, Thou hypocrite, doth not each one of you on the sabbath loose his ox or his ass from the stall, and lead him away to watering? 16 And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the sabbath day?
Is satan here the carnal mind or the flesh? Or is it a spiritual being?
Luke 22:3
3 Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve.
John 13:27
27 And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.
Is satan here the carnal mind or the flesh? Or is it a spiritual being?
If the carnal mind or the flesh, why does it say satan entered? If the carnal mind or the flesh it would have already been in him.
Ephesians 6:10-12
10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might. 11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Is satan here the carnal mind or the flesh? Or is it a spiritual being?
If so why is it so hard to understand that these evil spirits are devils/satans?
Was the legion of devils that ran into the swine, the carnal mind or flesh of men?
Yes, I believe in Evil Spirits. I believe that evil spirits are evil exhibitions of the carnal nature. A carnal mind is just a mind that exhibits the evil spirit (Satan). As for the legion, I believe that is another allegorical teaching by Christ. For example, when Jesus called the Pharisees "serpents", I don't believe they were literally "serpents". I believe that Jesus uses earthly things to teach us heavenly things. For example, I do believe something signficant happened in that the swine ran off the cliff etc... but I don't believe we are to take it literally but analyze it Spiritually. I believe your of the literal view which is why I believe you have stumbled over the rock (Jesus). When someone takes what He does or says literally and interprets that to be His point they have errored. Take for example, when Jesus says to take a sword and Peter replies that he has Two Swords. Jesus answer is that it is "enough". Peter stumbled because he interpreted the meaning that Jesus meant to take a LITERAL Sword. You making the same mistakes in my opinion that Peter made.
Yes, I believe in Evil Spirits. I believe that evil spirits are evil exhibitions of the carnal nature. A carnal mind is just a mind that exhibits the evil spirit (Satan). As for the legion, I believe that is another allegorical teaching by Christ. For example, when Jesus called the Pharisees "serpents", I don't believe they were literally "serpents". I believe that Jesus uses earthly things to teach us heavenly things. For example, I do believe something signficant happened in that the swine ran off the cliff etc... but I don't believe we are to take it literally but analyze it Spiritually. I believe your of the literal view which is why I believe you have stumbled over the rock (Jesus). When someone takes what He does or says literally and interprets that to be His point they have errored. Take for example, when Jesus says to take a sword and Peter replies that he has Two Swords. Jesus answer is that it is "enough". Peter stumbled because he interpreted the meaning that Jesus meant to take a LITERAL Sword. You making the same mistakes in my opinion that Peter made.
Paul
First the natural then the spiritual brother, you want to do away with the one and only hold to the other.
And besides that Mark and Luke were the ones who related the story, NOT Jesus. So your Jesus using it as a parable has no scriptural foundation.
Is this story also just an allegory, or did it actually happen?
Luke 7:1-10
[LEFT][/LEFT]
[CENTER] [/CENTER]
[LEFT]Now when he had ended all his sayings in the audience of the people, he entered into Capernaum. 2 And a certain centurion’s servant, who was dear unto him, was sick, and ready to die. 3 And when he heard of Jesus, he sent unto him the elders of the Jews, beseeching him that he would come and heal his servant. 4 And when they came to Jesus, they besought him instantly, saying, That he was worthy for whom he should do this: 5 For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue. 6 Then Jesus went with them. And when he was now not far from the house, the centurion sent friends to him, saying unto him, Lord, trouble not thyself: for I am not worthy that thou shouldest enter under my roof: 7 Wherefore neither thought I myself worthy to come unto thee: but say in a word, and my servant shall be healed. 8 For I also am a man set under authority, having under me soldiers, and I say unto one, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it. 9 When Jesus heard these things, he marvelled at him, and turned him about, and said unto the people that followed him, I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel. 10 And they that were sent, returning to the house, found the servant whole that had been sick.
If these things did not actually happen brother then how do we know Jesus even came in the flesh, die and rose again, are we to assume these things are all alligorical as well?
Was the legion of devils that ran into the swine, the carnal mind or flesh of men?
The passage about the swine has always confused me. The legion of devils wanted to go into something living then they turn around, go into the swine and run off a cliff. I never understood that. After the swine ran off the cliff and drowned the demons would be once again left without an abode. What was the point of that?
First the natural then the spiritual brother, you want to do away with the one and only hold to the other.
And besides that Mark and Luke were the ones who related the story, NOT Jesus. So your Jesus using it as a parable has no scriptural foundation.
The natural is only a guide to lead us to the Spiritual. You seem to be holding on to it. Don't you realize that holding on and valuing the natural as if it is the significance is exactly why Jesus destroyed the letter?
As for as Mark and Luke relating the story - all of it is Christ.
Is this story also just an allegory, or did it actually happen?
Luke 7:1-10
[LEFT][/LEFT]
[CENTER] [/CENTER]
[LEFT]Now when he had ended all his sayings in the audience of the people, he entered into Capernaum. 2 And a certain centurion’s servant, who was dear unto him, was sick, and ready to die. 3 And when he heard of Jesus, he sent unto him the elders of the Jews, beseeching him that he would come and heal his servant. 4 And when they came to Jesus, they besought him instantly, saying, That he was worthy for whom he should do this: 5 For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue. 6 Then Jesus went with them. And when he was now not far from the house, the centurion sent friends to him, saying unto him, Lord, trouble not thyself: for I am not worthy that thou shouldest enter under my roof: 7 Wherefore neither thought I myself worthy to come unto thee: but say in a word, and my servant shall be healed. 8 For I also am a man set under authority, having under me soldiers, and I say unto one, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it. 9 When Jesus heard these things, he marvelled at him, and turned him about, and said unto the people that followed him, I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel. 10 And they that were sent, returning to the house, found the servant whole that had been sick.
If these things did not actually happen brother then how do we know Jesus even came in the flesh, die and rose again, are we to assume these things are all alligorical as well?
There are people who beleive such.[/LEFT]
I'm not saying they didn't happen. I'm saying the natural perspective of those events is NOT signficant. The significance is in the Spiritual Perspective.
I'm not saying they didn't happen. I'm saying the natural perspective of those events is NOT signficant. The significance is in the Spiritual Perspective.
Paul
Well that is not what you said you said it was an allagory.An alligory is something that did not really happen.
What you seem to want to do is take some things as alligory and some things as actually happening.
The natural is only a guide to lead us to the Spiritual. You seem to be holding on to it. Don't you realize that holding on and valuing the natural as if it is the significance is exactly why Jesus destroyed the letter?
As for as Mark and Luke relating the story - all of it is Christ.
Paul
I am not holding on to nothing I understand both perspectives, you have given up on the one and hold only to the other and that is what I said you were doing right from the start.
God has given in part to you a spiritual perspective and now you reject the natural perspective as though it is not also true.
And like I said I agree with the spiritual perspective, but understand the actual perspective is still true, if it is not than NOTHING in scripture actually happened it is all alligorical, and some people do beleive that to be true, and you seem to be leaning towards their error.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
