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Old 08-15-2009, 11:25 PM
 
Location: UP of Michigan
1,647 posts, read 1,077,114 times
Reputation: 5492

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I never would have expected the effect of losing a grandson late term. There is no easy answer and I am dealing with my guilt, even though I have done my best to 'give it up'. I trust no one takes this lightly and walks away from the One hope and succumbs to worldly despair.
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Old 08-15-2009, 11:27 PM
 
2,437 posts, read 3,257,227 times
Reputation: 3180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha8207 View Post
Taking this opportunity to tell you:

PLEASE POST MORE AND MORE IN MANY THREADS!!!!

Great job!
Thanks!

I do not believe unborn babies or babies born go to hell. They have committed no sin and as I stated previously, are incapable of rejecting Jesus.

Matt 19:14 - "But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven."

Matt 5:8 - "Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God."

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Old 08-16-2009, 03:36 AM
 
Location: Somewhere out there
9,621 posts, read 7,006,348 times
Reputation: 3631
Default Utterly amazing!

Quote:
Originally Posted by june 7th View Post
This thread is single handedly reinforcing June's atheism.
Agreed. Many of these posts, and the underlying sick interpretations of scripture, are decidedly pathological. As someone said, I sincerely hope that none of you are ever involved in grief counselling for someone who just lost their precious and innocent little baby child to disease, crime or a natural disaster.

If you utter such profane nonsense to the parents, based on your screwball interpretations, you may very well end up in a particular hell yourself. At the hands of the grieving mother or father.

Heaven help you people!
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Old 08-16-2009, 10:24 AM
 
9,502 posts, read 5,156,714 times
Reputation: 1038
Quote:
Originally Posted by kahskye View Post
Thanks!

I do not believe unborn babies or babies born go to hell. They have committed no sin and as I stated previously, are incapable of rejecting Jesus.

Matt 19:14 - "But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven."

Matt 5:8 - "Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God."
"They have committed no sin and as I stated previously, are incapable of rejecting Jesus."

Based on what scripture....should we just ignore or discard these?


Psalm 51:5
Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me.

Psalm 58:3
Even from birth the wicked go astray; from the womb they are wayward and speak lies.

Isaiah 64:6
All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away.

Psalm 143:2
Do not bring your servant into judgment, for no one living is righteous before you.

John 3:6
Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.

Romans 3:10
As it is written: "There is no one righteous, not even one;

Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death....

There is no such thing as a sinless baby...born or unborn, so says God.

The problem stems from how on views coming to faith. Either faith is a gift from God, or is a choice of man [human]. The unborn do have faith, if the message is heard.

Romans 10:17
Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ

Luke 1:44
As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy.

Psalm 22:9
Yet you brought me out of the womb; you made me trust in you even at my mother's breast.

Psalm 22:10
From birth I was cast upon you; from my mother's womb you have been my God.

Faith is a gift, not a choice.
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Old 08-16-2009, 10:30 AM
 
9,502 posts, read 5,156,714 times
Reputation: 1038
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaniMae1 View Post
So what you have posted for us is a clear contradiction. Oh I know you will say it is not....but people who actually think can see that it is. Thanks!
Psalm 58:3
Even from birth the wicked go astray; from the womb they are wayward and speak lies.

Romans 3:10
As it is written: "There is no one righteous, not even one

Faith isn't about thinking, its about believing the Word
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Old 08-16-2009, 06:36 PM
 
2,437 posts, read 3,257,227 times
Reputation: 3180
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
"They have committed no sin and as I stated previously, are incapable of rejecting Jesus."

Based on what scripture....should we just ignore or discard these?


Psalm 51:5
Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me.

Psalm 58:3
Even from birth the wicked go astray; from the womb they are wayward and speak lies.

Isaiah 64:6
All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away.

Psalm 143:2
Do not bring your servant into judgment, for no one living is righteous before you.

John 3:6
Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.

Romans 3:10
As it is written: "There is no one righteous, not even one;

Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death....

There is no such thing as a sinless baby...born or unborn, so says God.

The problem stems from how on views coming to faith. Either faith is a gift from God, or is a choice of man [human]. The unborn do have faith, if the message is heard.

Romans 10:17
Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ

Luke 1:44
As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy.

Psalm 22:9
Yet you brought me out of the womb; you made me trust in you even at my mother's breast.

Psalm 22:10
From birth I was cast upon you; from my mother's womb you have been my God.

Faith is a gift, not a choice.
To address what's bolded (and off topic) Faith is not the gift, Salvation is.

Ephesians 2: 8 & 9 - "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, least any man should boast."

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and this salvation is not of yourselves, this salvation is the gift of God, this salvation is not of works, lest any man should boast"

I believe that Salvation is the GIFT OF GOD brought to man by grace and received by personal faith in the Lord Jesus Christ." The gift is salvation; the receiving of that gift is by faith.

Now, back on topic:

I still say a baby has committed no sin. Yes, they were born of a sin nature but tell me how a baby is capable of rejecting Jesus?

As I previously posted, John 3:18 - "He that believeth on Him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God"

John 3:36 - "He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him"

A baby in incapable of believing the Bible and also incapable of rejecting Jesus as his/her Saviour.

I agree w/ your above verses that babies are born in sin and are dead in sin. As they get older their depraved sinful nature will manifest itself in many ugly ways.

2 Thessalonians 1: 8 & 9 -

"He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power."

Those who go to hell are those who have deliberately disobeyed the gospel and refused to believe and accept the Lord Jesus as their Savior. A baby DOES NOT willfully disobey the gospel.

Revelation 20: 11-15 - "and they were judged every man according to their works. "

What evil works has a newborn baby committed?

Matthew 18:14 - "Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish."

Last edited by kahncss; 08-16-2009 at 06:37 PM.. Reason: spelling
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Old 08-16-2009, 08:26 PM
 
9,502 posts, read 5,156,714 times
Reputation: 1038
Quote:
Originally Posted by kahskye View Post
To address what's bolded (and off topic) Faith is not the gift, Salvation is.

Ephesians 2: 8 & 9 - "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, least any man should boast."

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and this salvation is not of yourselves, this salvation is the gift of God, this salvation is not of works, lest any man should boast"

I believe that Salvation is the GIFT OF GOD brought to man by grace and received by personal faith in the Lord Jesus Christ." The gift is salvation; the receiving of that gift is by faith.

Now, back on topic:

I still say a baby has committed no sin. Yes, they were born of a sin nature but tell me how a baby is capable of rejecting Jesus?

As I previously posted, John 3:18 - "He that believeth on Him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God"

John 3:36 - "He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him"

A baby in incapable of believing the Bible and also incapable of rejecting Jesus as his/her Saviour.

I agree w/ your above verses that babies are born in sin and are dead in sin. As they get older their depraved sinful nature will manifest itself in many ugly ways.

2 Thessalonians 1: 8 & 9 -

"He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power."

Those who go to hell are those who have deliberately disobeyed the gospel and refused to believe and accept the Lord Jesus as their Savior. A baby DOES NOT willfully disobey the gospel.

Revelation 20: 11-15 - "and they were judged every man according to their works. "

What evil works has a newborn baby committed?

Matthew 18:14 - "Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish."
I'm glad to read that we agree that "babies are born in sin and are dead in sin." Normally that is a sticking point.

Babies can and do have the capability to believe, according to these verses:

Psalm 22:9,10

Yet you brought me out of the womb; you made me trust in you even at my mother's breast. From birth I was cast upon you; from my mother's womb you have been my God.

Luke 1:44
As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy.

Science has shown that babies unborn can hear noises, sounds, voices from outside the womb. That was what God Word confirmed in Luke 1:44. John (who wasn't born) leaped for joy upon hearing the name Jesus (who also is unborn). Question becomes, why leap of for joy if there is no need for a saviour? Somehow (I don't know how) John knew that his Saviour from sin was near.

God does say that the wicked start being wicked from the womb. Psalm 58:3. Therefor its not just the actions that makes one accountable for sin, but being a sinner.

What I'm referring to is called "original sin"
Sin makes one an enemy of God.
Sins (plural) is the result of sin.

"The wages of sin is death" "a wage is something that is earned"
Babies die because of sin.....the condition.
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Old 08-16-2009, 08:30 PM
 
Location: Hot-Houston Texas
20,052 posts, read 21,063,773 times
Reputation: 28092
Quote:
Originally Posted by kahskye View Post
Why do babies die? It's because we live in a fallen world. Many people are living immoral lifestyles not to the design and plan of our Creator. In such a world any of us can be victims as well as perpetrators of wrong, including babies.

I believe a baby that dies is safe in the arms of Jesus. Jesue died for all of our sins, including every baby ever born. For those posting that believe in the elect only going to heaven, if Jesus died for all, then His death for the non-elect would have been a total waste because it would never have accomplished their salvation.

John 3:18 - "He that believeth on Him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God"

A baby isn't capable of rejecting Jesus.

There's two groups of people, believers and non believers.

John 3:36 - "He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him"

A baby in incapable of believing the Bible and also incapable of rejecting Jesus as his/her Saviour.

Someone mentioned the age of accountability and it's true that nowhere is it found in the Bible. I do believe the accountability of every individual before God is Biblical. A baby who is incapable of belief cannot be condemned for what he's unable to do. As a child grows and matures, he reaches a point where he's able to understand right from wrong and make decisions. Only God knows when a person is old enough to either receive or reject Jesus Christ. We all have unique mental capacities. God alone knows when a person is old enougth to either receive Christ or reject Him. Besides babies, what about the people who are mentally handicapped and never reach the age of accountability. We do not have all of the answers now, but God does.

So, why do babies die? I read this once and loved it.

They say that God takes his favorites home when they are young and that they sometimes need a breath of youth to grace Heaven.
I agree with this
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Old 08-16-2009, 08:32 PM
Status: "God saves ALL" (set 10 days ago)
 
5,958 posts, read 2,970,809 times
Reputation: 467
Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman View Post
Agreed. Many of these posts, and the underlying sick interpretations of scripture, are decidedly pathological. As someone said, I sincerely hope that none of you are ever involved in grief counselling for someone who just lost their precious and innocent little baby child to disease, crime or a natural disaster.

If you utter such profane nonsense to the parents, based on your screwball interpretations, you may very well end up in a particular hell yourself. At the hands of the grieving mother or father.

Heaven help you people!
Rifleman, what is your reason as to why babies die?

Paul
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Old 08-16-2009, 08:33 PM
Status: "God saves ALL" (set 10 days ago)
 
5,958 posts, read 2,970,809 times
Reputation: 467
Does anyone dispute the fact that when a baby is born it is born a sinner?

Paul
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