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Old 09-04-2009, 08:59 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,704,547 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
......an untruth has a way of revealing itself by yet another untruth...sooner or later, they eventually catch up with you...

......given enough time...the truth does have a way of revealing itself...does it not...?


Actually it is the bible revealing all our hearts.
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Old 09-04-2009, 09:04 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,261 posts, read 6,260,099 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
Actually it is the bible revealing all our hearts.
...never a truth better spoken.
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Old 09-04-2009, 09:13 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,432,041 times
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God will change the sinner so that he no longer desires to sin. Then he will be saved.

Its that simple.

As has been repeated in many other posts, don't assume "not entering the kingdom of heaven" = eternal hell.
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Old 09-04-2009, 09:14 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,432,041 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
......an untruth has a way of revealing itself by yet another untruth...sooner or later, they eventually catch up with you...

......given enough time...the truth does have a way of revealing itself...does it not...?
What are you talking about Verna? Please spell it out for me.
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Old 09-04-2009, 09:26 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,410 posts, read 20,126,059 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HotinAZ View Post
Yep, so when you come to this knowledge, you can do whatever you heart desires, because you are saved anyway. There is no reprocussions against God Almighty, maybe outside of a little fire, for a spell, but have no fear of God or man or any law made by either. Since you are saved anyway, do as you wish.

God loves you. It does not matter at all if you don't love God. It does not matter if you accept Jesus, nor follow Him. Why?

Because in the next age, you will get a little beat down to bring you into submission, perhaps. Perhaps there is no punishment. Don't know, but don't worry, we are saved anyway. Just remember to bow when called to, and see Jesus crowned King. Then scripture can be fulfilled. After that, don't worry, be happy.

You will have gotten the best of both worlds. You can live your best life now, and your best life later. Who would not want that???

And yes, this post is not how I feel, but I wanted to show you the utter lunacy of what is being preached these days as truth.
I have had this out with you many times . I have never met anyone who claims to be a christian(or whatever you want to be known by) regardless of what denomination they belong ro or whether they believe ET or UR who believes and says "live how you want it doesn't matter because you are going to be saved anyway".

This thought(line of thinking) is actually coming out of your own heart without a doubt .

Any true seeker of the Lord regardless of whether they believe ET or UR would never consider that they could live unto God with such thoughts and actions.

More to the point i really believe it's jealousy and resentment on your behalf because it takes away you being able to boast in yourself and how you earnt salvation.

Do you really those who genuinely are seeking God regardless of what they believe , God somehow is going to leave them in the dark or lost ?God is looking at our heart not what we believe about church tradition and doctrine.

What we believe rules us . God is transforming how minds to think how He does so we are Godly minded not carnally minded , He's not transforming how minds to adhere to the traditions of man and church doctrine, which you and the rest of you bible bashing cronies seem to think it's all about.
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Old 09-04-2009, 09:41 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,261 posts, read 6,260,099 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
What are you talking about Verna? Please spell it out for me.
For the sake of saving a lot of time...first read your reply...#64...then read Hot's reply to yours...#65...then read your answer to his...#66...then read my reply in #70...and that will explain everything.

...spell it out?...o.k...

Y-o-u-r...d-o-c-t-r-i-n-e...i-s...f-a-l-s-e...i-t...i-s...a...l-i-e...f-r-o-m...t-h-e...p-i-t...o-f...h-e-l-l,...a-n-d...o-n-l-y...l-e-a-d-s...t-h-o-s-e...w-h-o...d-o...n-o-t...k-n-o-w...a-n-y...b-e-t-t-e-r...t-o...t-h-e-i-r...v-e-r-y...d-e-s-t-r-u-c-t-i-o-n...a-n-d...t-h-e-i-r...b-l-o-o-d...w-i-l-l...b-e...u-p-o-n...y-o-u-r...h-a-n-d-s...a-s...y-o-u...s-t-a-n-d...b-e-f-o-r-e...T-h-e...K-i-n-g...o-n...j-u-d-g-e-m-e-n-t...d-a-y,...w-o-e...b-e...i-t...u-n-t-o...y-o-u...a-n-d...a-n-y-o-n-e...e-l-s-e...w-h-o...t-e-a-c-h-e-s...t-h-i-s...t-o...i-n-n-o-c-e-n-t...l-a-m-b-s.

Last edited by Verna Perry; 09-04-2009 at 09:50 AM..
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Old 09-04-2009, 09:45 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,432,041 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
I have had this out with you many times . I have never met anyone who claims to be a christian(or whatever you want to be known by) regardless of what denomination they belong ro or whether they believe ET or UR who believes and says "live how you want it doesn't matter because you are going to be saved anyway".

This thought(line of thinking) is actually coming out of your own heart without a doubt .

Any true seeker of the Lord regardless of whether they believe ET or UR would never consider that they could live unto God with such thoughts and actions.

More to the point i really believe it's jealousy and resentment on your behalf because it takes away you being able to boast in yourself and how you earnt salvation.

Do you really those who genuinely are seeking God regardless of what they believe , God somehow is going to leave them in the dark or lost ?God is looking at our heart not what we believe about church tradition and doctrine.

What we believe rules us . God is transforming how minds to think how He does so we are Godly minded not carnally minded , He's not transforming how minds to adhere to the traditions of man and church doctrine, which you and the rest of you bible bashing cronies seem to think it's all about.
Yes this is a good point pcamps.

We could just as easily ask an ET believer, "well now that you are saved you can live how you want, fulfill all your carnal desires, because you are saved anyway, right? Do whatever you want, you are saved in the end!" See how misguided that is?

Spot on regarding the boasting pcamps. We cannot save ourselves. God saves us - when He wants to, not when we "decide" or "allow" Him to. By definition, the savee has no say whether they will be saved or not. Does an unconscious swimmer on the bottom of the pool "decide" the lifeguard to save him?

No one is saved if they still desire to sin all the time. That doesn't mean God cannot save that person later at a time of God's choosing. When God does save that person, He will lead them to repent so they no longer desire to sin.
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Old 09-04-2009, 09:47 AM
 
Location: Germany
1,662 posts, read 1,721,720 times
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haven't read the whole thread but what about

Matthew 10:39 (KJV)

He that findeth his life [psychÍ] shall lose it: and he that loseth his life [psychÍ] for my sake shall find it.

life is a misstranslation, it's Greek psychÍ - soul, not life

He that finds his soul [psychÍ] will lose it, and he that loses his soul [psychÍ] for my sake will find it.

how does loosing one's soul indicate everlasting torment? - and what about this verse?, those who lose their soul in this verse will find it; and why do you seem so obsessed to "prove" everlasting torment true?
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Old 09-04-2009, 09:49 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,432,041 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
For the sake of saving a lot of time...first read your reply...#64...then read Hot's reply to yours...#65...then read your answer to his...#66...then read my reply in #70...and that will explain everything.

...spell it out?...o.k...

Y-o-u-r d-o-c-t-r-i-n-e i-s f-a-l-s-e...i-t i-s a l-i-e f-r-o-m t-h-e p-i-t o-f h-e-l-l, a-n-d o-n-l-y l-e-a-d-s t-h-o-s-e w-h-o d-o n-o-t k-n-o-w a-n-y b-e-t-t-e-r t-o t-h-e-i-r v-e-r-y d-e-s-t-r-u-c-t-i-o-n...a-n-d t-h-e-i-r b-l-o-o-d w-i-l-l b-e u-p-o-n y-o-u-r h-a-n-d-s a-s y-o-u s-t-a-n-d b-e-f-o-r-e T-h-e K-i-n-g o-n j-u-d-g-e-m-e-n-t d-a-y, w-o-e b-e u-n-t-o y-o-u a-n-d a-n-y-o-n-e e-l-s-e w-h-o t-e-a-c-h-e-s t-h-i-s t-o i-n-n-o-c-e-n-t l-a-m-b-s.
Well then you obviously don't understand what it means to reign in the kingdom nor what it means to be a subject of the kingdom. Try reading some of my other replies on here with an open mind. No one has said you can sin you way into heaven.

For what its worth, L-I-K-E-W-I-S-E. The doctrine of eternal hell is from the pit of satan (its not from the pit of hell since there is no hell). And you are leading many astray by saying God is not loving or powerful enough to save all people. You will be answerable for that on judgment day, but God will have mercy on you.
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Old 09-04-2009, 10:03 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,261 posts, read 6,260,099 times
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I wonder why no one wants to discuss Scripture? I've noticed not a word from any of you "like-minded folks" in answer to this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna
There is a first death, and there is a second death...
...and whatever is indicated as being eternal or perpetual or everlasting in a negative sense, as in fire, torment, condemnation, damnation and judgement; or in a positive sense, as in life and salvation, will manifest after the resurrection from the first death, at the Great White Throne of Judgement.

Let's look at what John 5:24-29 says:

(24)Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but IS PASSED FROM DEATH UNTO LIFE.
(25)Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, WHEN THE DEAD SHALL HEAR THE VOICE OF THE SON OF GOD: AND THEY THAT HEAR SHALL LIVE.
(26)For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself.
(27)And hath given him authority to execute judgement also, because he is the Son of man.
(28)MARVEL NOT AT THIS: FOR THE HOUR IS COMING, IN THE WHICH ALL THAT ARE IN THE GRAVES SHALL HEAR HIS VOICE,
(29)AND SHALL COME FORTH; THEY THAT HAVE DONE GOOD, UNTO THE RESURRECTION OF LIFE; AND THEY THAT HAVE DONE EVIL, UNTO THE RESURRECTION OF DAMNATION.

Revelation 2:11 says: He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

...some, who died their first death as an overcomer of sin while they lived, will be resurrected from this first death unto eternal life...and those who died their first death in sin, shall be resurrected unto eternal damnation...eternal condemnation...eternal judgement.

...Read what 2 Thessalonians 1:7-9 says:

(7)And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels,
(8)In flaming fire, taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
(9)Who SHALL BE PUNISHED WITH EVERLASTING DESTRUCTION FROM THE PRESENCE OF THE LORD, and from the glory of His power.
(10)When He shall come to be glorified IN HIS SAINTS, and to be admired IN ALL THEM THAT BELIEVE (because our testimony among you was believed) IN THAT DAY.<<(which is the Day of The LORD).

Bottom Line:
If you die in sin...when you are resurrected for judgement at the Great White Throne of Judgement...you are resurrected unto eternal damnation....eternal condemnation...eternal judgement.

If you die an overcomer of sin...when you are resurrected for judgement at the Great White Throne of Judgement...you are resurrected unto life eternal in the Kingdom of God.

In Love,
Verna.
...hmmmmmm....I wonder why that is?.......would any of you care to address this post?
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