U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-15-2009, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Valencia, Spain
7,884 posts, read 4,544,275 times
Reputation: 1511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
Not going off a tangent. You were making a case that you were innocent, I said different and built my case using His rules which justifies in His eyes for your guilt.
No. I was making the case that I am as I was made. If it is a 'sin' not to believe and your god created me knowing that I wouldn't believe then he created me knowing that I was condemned. Your god made me knowing that I would not believe and by my non-belief, would suffer an eternity of torture...yet he created me anyway. He created me in a way that I cannot change and I am to be tortured for eternity for that.

You said that it was justified. I'm asking you to explain how.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-15-2009, 11:33 AM
 
8,990 posts, read 8,563,772 times
Reputation: 725
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
No. I was making the case that I am as I was made. If it is a 'sin' not to believe and your god created me knowing that I wouldn't believe then he created me knowing that I was condemned. Your god made me knowing that I would not believe and by my non-belief, would suffer an eternity of torture...yet he created me anyway. He created me in a way that I cannot change and I am to be tortured for eternity for that.

You said that it was justified. I'm asking you to explain how.
because He is God. If God exist then who am I to question Him? This is not a democracy
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-15-2009, 11:35 AM
 
8,990 posts, read 8,563,772 times
Reputation: 725
Quote:
Originally Posted by iriekate View Post
Wait......what?
glory hound is carnal and not a paticular person's nature, it's God's. God is not carnal but righteous. We as human being have no right to be angry or be vengeful because we are not righteous but He is.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-15-2009, 11:38 AM
 
Location: Valencia, Spain
7,884 posts, read 4,544,275 times
Reputation: 1511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
because He is God. If God exist then who am I to question Him?
That's it is it?? God can deliberately create people to be tortured for eternity...because he's god and that is justification enough in your eyes?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-15-2009, 11:42 AM
 
8,990 posts, read 8,563,772 times
Reputation: 725
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
That's it is it?? God can deliberately create people to be tortured for eternity...because he's god and that is justification enough in your eyes?
LOL....This is not a democracy. He gave us the gospel to explain why we go to hell, He made laws, we broke them. The bible is not for us to accept, it is telling us. You have free will to do what you want
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-15-2009, 11:42 AM
 
259 posts, read 443,783 times
Reputation: 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
glory hound is carnal and not a paticular person's nature, it's God's. God is not carnal but righteous. We as human being have no right to be angry or be vengeful because we are not righteous but He is.

So you're saying God is angry and vengeful?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-15-2009, 11:50 AM
 
Location: All around the world.....
2,895 posts, read 5,404,602 times
Reputation: 988
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
Not going off a tangent. You were making a case that you were innocent, I said different and built my case using His rules which justifies in His eyes for your guilt.

His sovereignty. Most if not all doctrines even the ones taught in Sunday school we do not fully understand but we trust that everything He does is for our good and His glory like He said because He is God, why shouldn't we believe? He is God.

[
Quote:
B]If God exist then what He says goes, His attributes gives Him the glory and seeks the glory because if He didn't seek His glory He wouldn't be God. This is His nature.
Quote:

God just is.
[/b]

I don't agree that God gets the glory out of seeing people suffer, in fact
quite the contrary, I personally believe that He wants the best for us as a loving Father would want for His children, but when they are hard headed,
and do not obey, they disrupt the plans (flow) that is going on in the household, and there are consequences to disobedience.
I also believe that we are free moral agents, given a choice from Eden, so
why did Cain choose to murder his brother?, because the door had already been opened through the disobedience of their parents Adam &
and his wife Eve, someone gave satan an entry door to wreak havoc in the
bloodline, so until these sins have been repented of and dealt with, I believe
that the offspring will have to deal with the sins of their fathers.
I don't want to ramble all over the place, it's much deeper than God strutting
around and watching us poor little mortals suffer, this would seem twisted to me. but that is why he sent His son to pay our sin debt in full. but we don't have the legal right to if we don't believe in Him or serve Him .
There are some answers that we will never understand.
this is my own opinion that when evil has been introduced through an open door in our bloodline it is designed to destroy it. unless someone in this lineage
stand up and be responsible for renouncing it, getting forgiveness, and repentance.
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. II Chron. 7:14
this is my opinion only, and I'm not trying to debate,
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-15-2009, 11:50 AM
 
Location: where the moss is taking over the villages
2,161 posts, read 3,121,223 times
Reputation: 1164
Wink why?

Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
Why do people not believe: Deception, or their own choice?
free will is in the mind of the inferer

deception is perceived in the mind of the implicator

kate
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-15-2009, 11:58 AM
 
Location: Valencia, Spain
7,884 posts, read 4,544,275 times
Reputation: 1511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
LOL....This is not a democracy. He gave us the gospel to explain why we go to hell, He made laws, we broke them. The bible is not for us to accept, it is telling us.
You're still not getting it are you....because you don't want to get it. I was created to be a 'sinner' DELIBERATELY by your god. I have no choice to change. Creating me as a sinner means that he knew I was condemned. I am to be punished for something that is not of my making.

Quote:
You have free will to do what you want
No I don't. We have already ascertained that your deity created knowing how things would turn out. I can't make any free-will decision that will change that outcome.

Do you know what true free will is? It's the freedom to do and choose without consequence.

Please read:

"You saw me before I was born and scheduled each day of my life before I began to breathe. Every day was recorded in your book!" [Psalm 139:16]

So if your god has "scheduled every day of your life", would you please explain how you can make any free will decision that will change what your god has planned for you? How do you make a free will decision that might change what is "recorded in his book"???
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-15-2009, 12:03 PM
 
7,462 posts, read 6,952,160 times
Reputation: 2833
Going once....Going twice...

LAST CHANCE OR IT GETS CLOSED!!


Keep it on topic, folks!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $84,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top