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Old 09-30-2009, 11:35 AM
 
17 posts, read 84,113 times
Reputation: 23

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First of all, I believe that Jesus Christ existed, was the son of God and died on the cross to save man from his sins. However, I recently got into a discussion with someone with whom I disagreed with on whether or not a person with no knowledge of the Bible or Christ could achieve salvation. The scenario was, "could a person who lived on a remote island somewhere, who lived a good, honest life (just as instructed in the words of the Bible), but who had no access to the Word of God still go to heaven?" I believe that the Bible serves as instructions on how we should live our lives according to the Holy Spirit, but I don't think God is so selective that He'd exclude those who just didn't know, but lived the life He intended. I also believe that man is falliable and since the actual Bible has suffered through so many translations and interpretations at the hands of man, I find it difficult to take literal translations. Before you get upset with me, please note again the intro at the top of the page.

Anyway, so in the course of this discussion with what turned out to be with a rather fanatical person who did not share my openmindedness, my salvation was questioned and I was called a heretic b/c my "degree in philosphy and religion taught me to defend man's continual discredit of the Bible".

So, what is it? Does it not matter that I believe in God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit? Do I have to believe a literal interpretation of a book that was translated and influenced by the monarchy commissioning the translation and interpreted by different denominations in order to reach salvation? If so, then which version is the right version?

The person who accused me of being a heretic is supposed to be a Christian. She certainly has not convinced me of wanting to break bread with her by casting judgment on me.
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Old 09-30-2009, 11:42 AM
 
Location: Pawnee Nation
7,525 posts, read 14,555,884 times
Reputation: 7001
I found that those who are the most stringent and self proclaiming about their faith are, in fact, the least secure about their faith and are the first to proclaim any who don't agree with them to be "heretics" and "going to hell" and "should accept Jesus into their lives" while those WITH Jesus in their lives and who have accepted salvation are secure enough they don't have proclaim it, it simply shows in their life.......it is called fruits of the spirit, and those whose fruits are bitter and unpalatable to others are the ones so accusatory.
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Old 09-30-2009, 11:45 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,457,452 times
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The bible is clear if you don't have the Son then you don't have the Father. Read 1 John. I don't see anywhere that you are a heretic I just see you being a spiritually immature Christian who is still growing
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Old 09-30-2009, 11:46 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,457,452 times
Reputation: 746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodpasture View Post
I found that those who are the most stringent and self proclaiming about their faith are, in fact, the least secure about their fait and are the first to proclaim any who don't agree with them to be "heretics" and "going to hell" and "should accept Jesus into their lives" while those WITH Jesus in their lives are secure enough they don't have proclaim it, it simply shows in their life.
that's very possible but there are those who love the word so much that they will die for the gospel, that any assault on the gospel and truth is a personal assault on them, their family or anything they hold dear.

It's easy to point fingers but you yourself are without sin even you yourself have some standards of knowing what is a Christian, do you?. What if I said, God was really the big Orville Reddenbauker in the sky and I worship him by only eating peanuts on Sunday, that is my Christianity-I see it in scripture even though you don't. Am I a Christian?
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Old 09-30-2009, 11:52 AM
 
Location: Pawnee Nation
7,525 posts, read 14,555,884 times
Reputation: 7001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
What if I said, God was really the big Orville Reddenbauker in the sky and I worship him by only eating peanuts on Sunday, that is my Christianity-I see it in scripture even though you don't. Am I a Christian?
That is between you and God. It is NOT my place to determine your level or condition of salvation. It does not matter if I think you are Christian. What matters is do YOU think you are and if so, do you listen to the voice of God or do you walk a path indifferent to Him? Neither one is any of my business. What BECOMES my business is my testimony.......how being a Christian and what my faith is part of my life......hopefully you will want what I have. But that is your choice.
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Old 09-30-2009, 11:58 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,457,452 times
Reputation: 746
Quote:
Originally Posted by goodpasture View Post
that is between you and god. It is not my place to determine your level or condition of salvation. It does not matter if i think you are christian. What matters is do you think you are and if so, do you listen to the voice of god or do you walk a path indifferent to him? Neither one is any of my business. What becomes my business is my testimony.......how being a christian and what my faith is part of my life......hopefully you will want what i have. But that is your choice.
copout!!!!!????
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Old 09-30-2009, 12:00 PM
 
Location: Pawnee Nation
7,525 posts, read 14,555,884 times
Reputation: 7001
no

just a simple Christian.....the way Jesus taught us to be..........
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Old 09-30-2009, 12:05 PM
 
Location: Vermont
10,097 posts, read 10,629,055 times
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1. Yes, you are a Christian.
2. So is the person you were talking to. She is also a narrow-minded bigot.
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Old 09-30-2009, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,395,647 times
Reputation: 1690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgansmom00 View Post
First of all, I believe that Jesus Christ existed, was the son of God and died on the cross to save man from his sins. However, I recently got into a discussion with someone with whom I disagreed with on whether or not a person with no knowledge of the Bible or Christ could achieve salvation. The scenario was, "could a person who lived on a remote island somewhere, who lived a good, honest life (just as instructed in the words of the Bible), but who had no access to the Word of God still go to heaven?" I believe that the Bible serves as instructions on how we should live our lives according to the Holy Spirit, but I don't think God is so selective that He'd exclude those who just didn't know, but lived the life He intended. I also believe that man is falliable and since the actual Bible has suffered through so many translations and interpretations at the hands of man, I find it difficult to take literal translations. Before you get upset with me, please note again the intro at the top of the page.

Anyway, so in the course of this discussion with what turned out to be with a rather fanatical person who did not share my openmindedness, my salvation was questioned and I was called a heretic b/c my "degree in philosphy and religion taught me to defend man's continual discredit of the Bible".

So, what is it? Does it not matter that I believe in God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit? Do I have to believe a literal interpretation of a book that was translated and influenced by the monarchy commissioning the translation and interpreted by different denominations in order to reach salvation? If so, then which version is the right version?

The person who accused me of being a heretic is supposed to be a Christian. She certainly has not convinced me of wanting to break bread with her by casting judgment on me.
It's between you and God... I find nothing wrong with your thoughts nor do I see a contradiction to the scripture in any of it. But then I too am a heathen believer who is destined for hellfire.

Remember all you who condemn a spirit wrongly:

Mark 3: 28-30 I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of men will be forgiven them. But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin.” He said this because they were saying, “He has an evil spirit.”



If you say someone has an evil spirit and you are wrong.... ouch! you will never be forgiven! Eternally even!
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Old 09-30-2009, 12:16 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,457,452 times
Reputation: 746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgansmom00 View Post
First of all, I believe that Jesus Christ existed, was the son of God and died on the cross to save man from his sins. However, I recently got into a discussion with someone with whom I disagreed with on whether or not a person with no knowledge of the Bible or Christ could achieve salvation. The scenario was, "could a person who lived on a remote island somewhere, who lived a good, honest life (just as instructed in the words of the Bible), but who had no access to the Word of God still go to heaven?" I believe that the Bible serves as instructions on how we should live our lives according to the Holy Spirit, but I don't think God is so selective that He'd exclude those who just didn't know, but lived the life He intended. I also believe that man is falliable and since the actual Bible has suffered through so many translations and interpretations at the hands of man, I find it difficult to take literal translations. Before you get upset with me, please note again the intro at the top of the page.

Anyway, so in the course of this discussion with what turned out to be with a rather fanatical person who did not share my openmindedness, my salvation was questioned and I was called a heretic b/c my "degree in philosphy and religion taught me to defend man's continual discredit of the Bible".

So, what is it? Does it not matter that I believe in God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit? Do I have to believe a literal interpretation of a book that was translated and influenced by the monarchy commissioning the translation and interpreted by different denominations in order to reach salvation? If so, then which version is the right version?

The person who accused me of being a heretic is supposed to be a Christian. She certainly has not convinced me of wanting to break bread with her by casting judgment on me.
My best advice to you is to read your bible and pray everyday to know if you are a Christian and stop listening to sheep and goats in this forum. It will only confuse you
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