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Old 01-18-2011, 05:11 PM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
10,512 posts, read 10,303,419 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GldnRule View Post
OK....Forget the last part...that does stray off track.

But do you think a vote on the issue of the OP (the cross on govt land) is a bad idea? And, why (either way)?

I mean...if we can take votes about things like legalizing smoking weed...we can vote on something like this. What could be more "fair" than a decision based on a vote?
why would you vote on something that is already illegal and completely against the Constitution, regardless of whether people approve of it or not it is still illegal and the Supreme Court has already determined that.
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Old 01-18-2011, 05:29 PM
 
39,791 posts, read 26,600,116 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptsum View Post
why would you vote on something that is already illegal and completely against the Constitution, regardless of whether people approve of it or not it is still illegal and the Supreme Court has already determined that.
Sorry ptsum . . . that is not exactly correct: Supreme Court says Mojave Cross can stand.

In a divided ruling, the justices rule that the 1st Amendment calls for ‘accommodation’ of religious displays on public land rather than strict separation of church and state. April 29, 2010

Reporting from Washington — The Supreme Court gave its approval Wednesday to displaying a cross on public land to honor fallen soldiers, saying the Constitution "does not require the eradication of all religious symbols in the public realm."

Speaking for a divided court, Justice Anthony M. Kennedy said the 1st Amendment called for a middle-ground "policy of accommodation" toward religious displays on public land, not a strict separation of church and state.
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Old 01-18-2011, 05:34 PM
 
Location: SC Foothills
8,830 posts, read 9,989,434 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by old_cold View Post
Why is it that just because you were not happy and content until you adjusted your way of thinking that you think the rest of us are unhappy and discontent and need to do something about it?
How do you know...or why do you think...our level of contentedness/happiness/lovingness is not the same or possibly even greater, than yours?
I don't think that atheists are unhappy or malcontent, I think a level of happiness can be achieved without God in your life. I don't want people to adjust to my way of thinking, I just want them to know Jesus because there is a hole in all of us that only he can fill.

And I'm not going to argue with you about your level of contentedness/happiness/lovingness is not better than mine, it probably is and that's all I can say about that. But one thing I can guarantee is that your level of peace is not greater than mine. That's what i always needed, was peace and I got that with Jesus. I never had peace, and this is what Jesus said, if we will only reach out and grab it:

John 20:20-22 (New International Version, ©2010)

20 After he said this, he showed them his hands and side. The disciples were overjoyed when they saw the Lord.
21 Again Jesus said, “Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.” 22 And with that he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit.


It's obvious from this scripture that peace also involves the Holy Spirit, you can't receive the Holy Spirit unless you receive Jesus Christ first. It's the total package!!
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Old 01-19-2011, 02:34 AM
 
Location: Florida
19,667 posts, read 19,779,572 times
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[quote=Ilene Wright;17473107]I don't think that atheists are unhappy or malcontent, I think a level of happiness can be achieved without God in your life. I don't want people to adjust to my way of thinking, I just want them to know Jesus because there is a hole in all of us that only he can fill.

And I'm not going to argue with you about your level of contentedness/happiness/lovingness is not better than mine, it probably is and that's all I can say about that. But one thing I can guarantee is that your level of peace is not greater than mine. That's what i always needed, was peace and I got that with Jesus. I never had peace, and this is what Jesus said, if we will only reach out and grab it:

Uh, no. Maybe it was so for you, that you felt you needed something and this is what did it for you.
There are other ways to come to terms with life that don't require being loved by some.....well, I'll say mystical rather than mythical...entity.
I'm happy you're happy but please realize you can't assume everyone feels and thinks like you or has whatever problem you had/have with yourself.
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Old 01-19-2011, 03:05 AM
 
Location: Texas
4,346 posts, read 5,706,881 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilene Wright View Post
And I'm not going to argue with you about your level of contentedness/happiness/lovingness is not better than mine, it probably is and that's all I can say about that. But one thing I can guarantee is that your level of peace is not greater than mine. That's what i always needed, was peace and I got that with Jesus. I never had peace, and this is what Jesus said, if we will only reach out and grab it:
of course, you can't prove it but I had the same experience. It's just a phenomenon but until it actually happens to someone - how can you explain it?

If I could bottle and market the stuff I'd be the richest guy on earth! As it is - I'm just the richest guy inwardly, from my unique perspective.
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Old 01-19-2011, 03:11 AM
 
Location: Texas
4,346 posts, read 5,706,881 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by old_cold View Post
There are other ways to come to terms with life that don't require being loved by some.....well, I'll say mystical rather than mythical...entity.
I'm happy you're happy but please realize you can't assume everyone feels and thinks like you or has whatever problem you had/have with yourself.
Agreed. With most who have this spiritual awakening experience there is a perception that you have risen above the mundane in a way that most around you have not experienced. Yet, of course, it is an assumption but one which could be based on some real behavioral observations. Make sense?
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Old 01-19-2011, 03:46 AM
 
6,781 posts, read 4,048,908 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptsum View Post
why would you vote on something that is already illegal and completely against the Constitution, regardless of whether people approve of it or not it is still illegal and the Supreme Court has already determined that.
The Constitution has been amended many times ptsum...and IMO it should be amended again.

Government, Of the People, By the People, and For the People...should be implemented to the greatest degree possible.
In the late 1700s we didn't have the technology for everyone to be able to cast a vote on everything...so they needed Reps. That is no longer the case. We should bring our system of "We the People" up to speed...IMO.

Get rid of Congress...get rid of ALL the politicians, for that matter...except for ambassadors and "figurehead" type people. Get rid of the Supreme Court. Just poll THE PEOPLE...on EVERYTHING. Let THAT determines how things are. We can easily do that now.

If someone has a "more fair" way...I'd like to hear it.
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Old 01-19-2011, 04:00 AM
 
Location: Florida
19,667 posts, read 19,779,572 times
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You have a lot of faith in the intelligence/ability of the masses to make the best decisions, Gldn.
Give thought to things like 'mob rule'....riots.
Think of the reactions of MOST people when there is a fire in a packed theatre.
Just ask 30 people on the street WHY they will vote for the next electee.After getting enough answers like "He's so good looking" as well as 'one-issue; voters.
Look around you and see how many people have apparently made the best life decisions and how many make unwise ones....even in the area of finanaces alone.
You may change your mind about wanting a strict democracy.
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Old 01-19-2011, 04:01 AM
 
Location: Texas
4,346 posts, read 5,706,881 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GldnRule View Post
The Constitution has been amended many times ptsum...and IMO it should be amended again.

Government, Of the People, By the People, and For the People...should be implemented to the greatest degree possible.
In the late 1700s we didn't have the technology for everyone to be able to cast a vote on everything...so they needed Reps. That is no longer the case. We should bring our system of "We the People" up to speed...IMO.

Get rid of Congress...get rid of ALL the politicians, for that matter...except for ambassadors and "figurehead" type people. Get rid of the Supreme Court. Just poll THE PEOPLE...on EVERYTHING. Let THAT determines how things are. We can easily do that now.

If someone has a "more fair" way...I'd like to hear it.
We've been over this ground before, no?

It was determined by a majority of the FOUNDERS to include in the constitution certain inalienable rights which are not up for vote. Can we agree on that?
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Old 01-19-2011, 04:19 AM
 
6,781 posts, read 4,048,908 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by old_cold View Post
You have a lot of faith in the intelligence/ability of the masses to make the best decisions, Gldn.
Give thought to things like 'mob rule'....riots.
Think of the reactions of MOST people when there is a fire in a packed theatre.
Just ask 30 people on the street WHY they will vote for the next electee.After getting enough answers like "He's so good looking" as well as 'one-issue; voters, you may change your mind about wanting a strict democracy.
No way is perfect...I said "most fair".

Gotta be better than Special Interest vote manipulation, partisan votes, votes based on personal opinion instead of the majority of the constituency being represented, votes gotten through "deals", ego driven judges legislating from the bench...and all the other corruption the system we have now suffers from.

How things are for "We the People"...should be determined, to as great a degree as possible, by The People.

All due respect...but I don't think you made a good case for the system I suggest not being "more fair" than what we have, or any other.
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