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Old 10-09-2009, 06:53 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,410 posts, read 20,114,631 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by june 7th View Post


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Most of all, though, June has the funny feeling that the real message isn't one of terror and fear, although some may feel it to be very valid, very real, and even at times, very useful. June can respect that. However, she also can't help but feel that even the most loyal of individuals who adhere to eternal torment and damnation tend to know that.
June the fact they vehemently refute the good news as being just that "good news", and persist in teaching ET tells us otherwise.
They believe in ET and believe all who end up there deserve to there but themselves .
Sorry June this is not good news.
Its a message of fear and nothing short of it and totally contradicts the message given to us by angels .
The scriptures tell us Perfect love casts out fear , how can a person not have fear of ET , if they cannot fully depend utterly on the unconditional perfect love of God ?.
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Old 10-09-2009, 06:55 AM
 
Location: Somewhere between here and there.
124 posts, read 272,730 times
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Actually I find the Bible to be very terrifying! It seems like god didn't really care about people way back when and he'd squish them like ants when he was mad at them. Now if you are not practically perfect you will go to hell even if you didn't understand. That is kind of scary.
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Old 10-09-2009, 07:03 AM
 
Location: East Coast
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Feel_Fat_2 View Post
Actually I find the Bible to be very terrifying! It seems like god didn't really care about people way back when and he'd squish them like ants when he was mad at them. Now if you are not practically perfect you will go to hell even if you didn't understand. That is kind of scary.
That is why the shepherds who saw the angels were terrified because their concept of God was one of dread and fear.
The shepherds of Israel never told the ordinary folk , that God was a God of mercy , long suffering, slow to anger and so forth.
They controlled the ordinary folk through fear , just like the Roman Catholic church did and does and just like fundamental christianity does.

Ezekiel 34

1The word of the Lord came to me: 2“Son of man, prophesy against the shepherds of Israel; prophesy and say to them: ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: Woe to the shepherds of Israel who only take care of themselves! Should not shepherds take care of the flock? 3You eat the curds, clothe yourselves with the wool and slaughter the choice animals, but you do not take care of the flock. 4You have not strengthened the weak or healed the sick or bound up the injured. You have not brought back the strays or searched for the lost. You have ruled them harshly and brutally. 5So they were scattered because there was no shepherd, and when they were scattered they became food for all the wild animals. 6My sheep wandered over all the mountains and on every high hill. They were scattered over the whole earth, and no one searched or looked for them.
7“‘Therefore, you shepherds, hear the word of the Lord: 8As surely as I live, declares the Sovereign Lord, because my flock lacks a shepherd and so has been plundered and has become food for all the wild animals, and because my shepherds did not search for my flock but cared for themselves rather than for my flock, 9therefore, O shepherds, hear the word of the Lord: 10This is what the Sovereign Lord says: I am against the shepherds and will hold them accountable for my flock. I will remove them from tending the flock so that the shepherds can no longer feed themselves. I will rescue my flock from their mouths, and it will no longer be food for them.
11“‘For this is what the Sovereign Lord says: I myself will search for my sheep and look after them. 12As a shepherd looks after his scattered flock when he is with them, so will I look after my sheep. I will rescue them from all the places where they were scattered on a day of clouds and darkness. 13I will bring them out from the nations and gather them from the countries, and I will bring them into their own land. I will pasture them on the mountains of Israel, in the ravines and in all the settlements in the land. 14I will tend them in a good pasture, and the mountain heights of Israel will be their grazing land. There they will lie down in good grazing land, and there they will feed in a rich pasture on the mountains of Israel. 15I myself will tend my sheep and have them lie down, declares the Sovereign Lord. 16I will search for the lost and bring back the strays. I will bind up the injured and strengthen the weak, but the sleek and the strong I will destroy. I will shepherd the flock with justice.
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Old 10-09-2009, 07:43 AM
 
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No forgiveness for my sins and no sacrifice to make me 'right with God = terror

The gospel of Jesus = no terror

Simple really.

Last edited by Miss Blue; 10-09-2009 at 08:36 AM.. Reason: removed the last sentence to keep us on topic later
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Old 10-09-2009, 07:46 AM
 
3,553 posts, read 4,385,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
June the fact they vehemently refute the good news as being just that "good news", and persist in teaching ET tells us otherwise.
Maybe because they see what Christ did, reconciling, AS the Good News. If there is "Good News", then pray tell me, what before this, was the "Bad News"?

Quote:
They believe in ET and believe all who end up there deserve to there but themselves .
Actually, those who believe in this doctrine think they, themselves, deserve to be there the most. But they also understand what it means to be covered in the blood of Christ. They believe this IS the Good News.

Quote:
Its a message of fear and nothing short of it and totally contradicts the message given to us by angels .
Why is there this fear? The only reason a person would be scared of facing God and being found guilty of sinning against God is because they have heard the Good News, and rebuked it. For that, they should be scared and fearful.


Quote:
The scriptures tell us Perfect love casts out fear , how can a person not have fear of ET , if they cannot fully depend utterly on the unconditional perfect love of God ?.
Perfect Love? Do you even understand what you are saying?

How can a person not have fear of ET, if? Have you heard the Good News about Jesus Christ?
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Old 10-09-2009, 07:58 AM
 
7,793 posts, read 10,480,890 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
June the fact they vehemently refute the good news as being just that "good news", and persist in teaching ET tells us otherwise.
They believe in ET and believe all who end up there deserve to there but themselves .
Sorry June this is not good news.
Its a message of fear and nothing short of it and totally contradicts the message given to us by angels .
The scriptures tell us Perfect love casts out fear , how can a person not have fear of ET , if they cannot fully depend utterly on the unconditional perfect love of God ?.
June hears what you are saying, but did you read her post in it's entirety? One of the things she pointed out was the context in which ET is presented, along with why. --Along with the fact that she thinks there is more to that particular doctrine than just the 'terror aspect.'

As in:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha8207 View Post

No forgiveness for my sins and no sacrifice to make me 'right with God = terror

The gospel of Jesus = no terror

Simple really.

That ^ seems to put it in a context.

June has read the bible. June didn't gleen a whole lot of terror from the NT, but then again, this is June, and what does June know?

Take gentle care.
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Old 10-09-2009, 08:01 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,410 posts, read 20,114,631 times
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The bad news was man was helpless to free Himself from a conscience of sin.

Hebrews 9 14How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death,[c] so that we may serve the living God!

They do not believe they deserve to be there most , if this statement was true , the message of them would be good news rather than bad news.

No our sin conscience puts us in fear of God , we automatically believe because of our wrong concept of God that He is against us .

Those who have a sin conscience (which predominantly happens to be fundamental christians)naturally fear God and consequently teach the world and believers God is a God who should be feared and if you don't you will suffer the consequences of ET or in the case of your belief annihilation.

Your have turned reverent fear of the Lord God into fear of punishment through ET or annihilation.by Him.
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Old 10-09-2009, 08:10 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,410 posts, read 20,114,631 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by june 7th View Post
June hears what you are saying, but did you read her post in it's entirety? One of the things she pointed out was the context in which ET is presented, along with why. --Along with the fact that she thinks there is more to that particular doctrine than just the 'terror aspect.'

As in:




That ^ seems to put it in a context.

June has read the bible. June didn't gleen a whole lot of terror from the NT, but then again, this is June, and what does June know?

Take gentle care.
This is because we have been indoctrinated by a false concept that God who is love is also a total contradiction of Himself , because we think punishment, correction,judgement, and discipline are to destroy a person literally , rather than for correction.
We think because our penal system does not work , God's doesn't , forgetting the fact that God is more than able and more willing and more long suffering than man could ever imagine.
Yet remarkably fundamental christians do not have faith to believe that God is able and willing to rehabilate man through correction because they cannot get their eyes of sin, they believe a man's sin is greater than God's grace.
No wonder christians are leaving the organized system in their droves.

Here's why

The "Out of Church" Christians - BOOK by Andrew Strom.
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Old 10-09-2009, 08:12 AM
 
7,780 posts, read 13,280,624 times
Reputation: 3450
Quote:
Originally Posted by june 7th View Post
June has read the bible. June didn't gleen a whole lot of terror from the NT, but then again, this is June, and what does June know?
That's exactly my point. Yet hell and ET is there in the New Testament too....but if June reads it....it isn't terrifying....it's wonderful. There's nothing to be afraid of when June has the one who drives out fear. Without Christ, June should be terrified.
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Old 10-09-2009, 08:23 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,562,115 times
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I guess it depends whether you believe that making a mistake is a sin?
It has always been my opinion that Christians are obsessed with sin, so much so that they are afraid of making mistakes.
I don't think that it is hell which is eternal torment, but that the actual torment is the fear of making any mistake (no matter how small).
I mean how is a person able to learn when he is not allowed to make mistakes?

The only way to avoid making mistakes is by listening to holy (read: learned) individuals who have studied the Bible intensively.
So when you believe that making a mistake is a sin and that God is perfect (read: does not make a mistake therefore does not need to change his mind) you need a person like Jesus to explain God's new direction while, at the same time, maintaining that nothing has actually changed.
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