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Old 08-23-2016, 08:22 PM
Status: "Amused by BF." (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
23,263 posts, read 12,056,137 times
Reputation: 10629

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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
And how we know God spoke to you at all.
Well, he could scribble it on a piece of parchment like all those anonymous, long-dead, primitive dudes you decided were SO believable.
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Old 08-23-2016, 08:24 PM
 
Location: Texas
1,279 posts, read 1,147,320 times
Reputation: 1333
Quote:
Originally Posted by TroutDude View Post
Well, he could scribble it on a piece of parchment like all those anonymous, long-dead, primitive dudes you decided were SO believable.
Who is believable then? Let us know.
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Old 08-23-2016, 08:49 PM
 
2,536 posts, read 888,074 times
Reputation: 2322
Quote:
Originally Posted by RomulusXXV
You have a habit, Jeff, of equating homosexuality with 'wrongs'. And that, to me, is wrong. I don't believe that your posts are going over my head. I understand them as coming from someone who has a personal dislike or aversion to homosexuality and that, you believe, God (the Bible) agrees with you. This is the rather typical mindset of many Christians and not just Fundamentalists, many of whom just regurgitate what has been placed in their minds by their anti-gay Bible-wielding pastors.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
My mindset is to love people, and hate sin.
Well, we could debate 'sin' until the cows come home, Jeff. As mentioned, just about everything we do as humans seems to be offensive to God simply because we're imperfect. How do YOU define 'sin'? I can more relate to the terms 'right' and 'wrong' and I can't for the life of me see where being gay can possibly be 'a wrong' in and of itself. What is it, precisely, about being gay that would bother God? In fact, what gender is God and what is HIS specific sexual orientation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
When your side wants to promote and force society to embrace a lifestyle that is clearly as a serious damaging sin according to God's Word then I'm certainly going to take a dislike to that.
I'm not particularly on any 'side', Jeff. And, I'm not trying to 'force' anything on society or anyone else. As for "God's Word" ...are you as legally or emotionally bound by other books that you read as you are the Bible? If not, is it because other books are written by human authors? You are aware, are you not, that the Bible was written by human authors?

That said, there is nothing in the Bible ("God's Word" as you call it) that refers to 'the homosexual lifestyle' as 'a serious damaging sin'. You just made that up or you're just going along with others who just made that up.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
I don't have to force fit the Bible to meet with a "personal dislike". That's what you try to do.
I have not yet attempted to 'force fit' the Bible to back up anything I've had to say about this topic. I HAVE said on a number of occasions that the only references to homosexuality at all in the Bible is with regard to pagan idolatry practices. And, I still say that because nothing has changed. The Bible still reads the same as it did when I (and others) came to that conclusion.

I asked you this before ...have you actually read those passages that reference homosexuality, Jeff?


Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
The Bible is crystal clear about the subject.
Well, I don't know about 'crystal clear' as there are ambiguities connected with the ancient texts that you and yours quote to condemn homosexuality. However, as already mentioned, the texts in question really do refer to Pagan idolatry practices and shrine temple prostitution. Do you not also realize that temple prostitution was just as likely a heterosexual practice as it was a homosexual practice? You see, the act in and of itself was not whether one was gay or straight but rather with worship and fertility related practices.

Have you ever read up on idolatry and shrine temple prostitution, Jeff? These prostitutes were considered by the Pagans as 'sacred'. This means that the sexual acts affiliated with these folks was religious in nature. They had nothing, zilch, zero, nada to do with homosexuality as we today use the term. That you don't know this really does make you ineligible to be debating this topic.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
Furthermore, your position doesn't even align with the nature of God. God is perfect.
But, humans are not. Moreover, the hissy-fits that are credited to God in the Bible don't make Him sound too perfect either.

On the contrary . . .


Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
God's creations have that trait of perfection as well. A circle is perfect. Likewise God's creations are perfect cycles. The four seasons. Day and night cycle etc... It doesn't make sense for God to decide to create an additional sexual orientations, assign that orientation to a very minor part of the population knowing that it will create confusion and difficulty for that person in life.
The first part ...nice, but irrelevant. A circle might be perfect, the seasons and the day and night might be perfect ...but human beings are NOT perfect. "God" found this out very early on, didn't He? Didn't He not even regret having created humans in the first place? And, why God didn't have fore-knowledge that this would be the case - a God who we are told knows the end from the beginning - brings the 'perfect God' catch-cry into question yet again.

As for the second part. do you not realize that it's often you and yours that is creating confusion and difficulty in a gay person's life, Jeff? Ignorance will do this and you and yours are continually perpetuating ignorance through your waving an ancient book around condemning ACTUAL PEOPLE. a book that doesn't even say what you claim that it says anyway . . .


Quote:
Originally Posted by RomulusXXV
"God's Word" states that simply having human characteristics is 'a sin', Jeff. "God" demands perfection from those who were created IM-perfect, a demand impossible to keep! According to the Bible (your "God") human beings were created lesser than the angels who were likewise created lesser than God. And yet, again, "God" demands that humans become 'God-like'. Have you become 'God-like', Jeff? You come across here as believing that you have.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
Christ paid the death penalty for our sins so God isn't demanding perfection.
Yes He is. This time the perfection comes through Jesus. But God still demands perfection.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
He only wants a relationship with each person.
But, 'each person' has to be heterosexual, right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
God hates sin because it creates a barrier to that relationship and opens a doorway for demons to cause all kinds of trouble and pain. If you give your life over to sinfully pursuits than you love sin more than you love God.
You actually believe in demons, Jeff? Do demons cause trouble and pain or could we perhaps attribute trouble and pain to less supernatural causes?

Tell me, what 'sinful pursuits' are homosexuals engaged in specifically? Are their 'sinful pursuits' different to the 'sinful pursuits' of heterosexuals? I just don't understand where you're coming from on this topic, Jeff. Is it purely sex-related? If it is ...you know what I'll have to say next, don't you?


Quote:
Originally Posted by RomulusXXV
Anyway, we know that you haven't attained perfection, Jeff, don't we? So, one could just as well point the finger at you for being 'a sinner'. See how pointless this debate on 'sinning' is? So, why do you keep this up ...why not just admit that YOU PERSONALLY don't care for gay people and be done with it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
The perversion of truth is your side has taken "do not judge" to mean never speak out against sin.
One's sexual orientation is not 'a sin', Jeff. Yes, homosexual people commit wrongs just as heterosexuals commit wrongs but one's sexual persuasion is not THE wrong ( 'sin').

Correct me if I'm wrong, Jeff, but you come across to me as someone who actually believes that homosexual people are feigning being gay ...that they are really heterosexuals who are knowingly going against their natural straight orientation for no other reason than to be deviants and p--s off Christians.

Am I correct in thinking this?


Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
I am not personally judging someone when I speak my beliefs regarding homosexuality.
Your beliefs come from an unreliable source ...i.e. man's misinterpretation of certain ambiguous scriptures. You ARE judging a minority group as a whole for simply being WHO they are.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
I don't call people out by name and run them down. Judging involves condemning and desiring punishing. That's up to God, not us. We are only called to love each other and fight against sin from destroying lives.
You sound like Jack Nicholson in A Few Good Men. His intentions were to protect (American) lives but his methodology for doing so was somewhat skewed. Gay people will no more be responsible for destroying lives than straight people will. In fact, straight people have already done a pretty good job of that.

I've discussed these cherished Bible texts with you previously, Jeff. You just haven't listened because you really do seem to have an anti-gay agenda. Is it the party line of your particular church that you're upholding? Or is it you personally who can't handle the truth ...?
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Old 08-23-2016, 09:07 PM
Status: "Amused by BF." (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
23,263 posts, read 12,056,137 times
Reputation: 10629
Quote:
Originally Posted by cowdog View Post
Who is believable then? Let us know.
It's not difficult.

Those who make sense and produce evidence to buttress what they say.

Which eliminates a goodly portion of the bible.
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Old 08-23-2016, 09:09 PM
 
37,477 posts, read 25,224,572 times
Reputation: 5853
Quote:
Originally Posted by RomulusXXV View Post
Well, we could debate 'sin' until the cows come home, Jeff. As mentioned, just about everything we do as humans seems to be offensive to God simply because we're imperfect. How do YOU define 'sin'? I can more relate to the terms 'right' and 'wrong' and I can't for the life of me see where being gay can possibly be 'a wrong' in and of itself. What is it, precisely, about being gay that would bother God? In fact, what gender is God and what is HIS specific sexual orientation?
I'm not particularly on any 'side', Jeff. And, I'm not trying to 'force' anything on society or anyone else. As for "God's Word" ...are you as legally or emotionally bound by other books that you read as you are the Bible? If not, is it because other books are written by human authors? You are aware, are you not, that the Bible was written by human authors?
That said, there is nothing in the Bible ("God's Word" as you call it) that refers to 'the homosexual lifestyle' as 'a serious damaging sin'. You just made that up or you're just going along with others who just made that up.

I have not yet attempted to 'force fit' the Bible to back up anything I've had to say about this topic. I HAVE said on a number of occasions that the only references to homosexuality at all in the Bible is with regard to pagan idolatry practices. And, I still say that because nothing has changed. The Bible still reads the same as it did when I (and others) came to that conclusion.
I asked you this before ...have you actually read those passages that reference homosexuality, Jeff?

Well, I don't know about 'crystal clear' as there are ambiguities connected with the ancient texts that you and yours quote to condemn homosexuality. However, as already mentioned, the texts in question really do refer to Pagan idolatry practices and shrine temple prostitution. Do you not also realize that temple prostitution was just as likely a heterosexual practice as it was a homosexual practice? You see, the act in and of itself was not whether one was gay or straight but rather with worship and fertility related practices.
Have you ever read up on idolatry and shrine temple prostitution, Jeff? These prostitutes were considered by the Pagans as 'sacred'. This means that the sexual acts affiliated with these folks was religious in nature. They had nothing, zilch, zero, nada to do with homosexuality as we today use the term. That you don't know this really does make you ineligible to be debating this topic.

But, humans are not. Moreover, the hissy-fits that are credited to God in the Bible don't make Him sound too perfect either.
On the contrary . . .

The first part ...nice, but irrelevant. A circle might be perfect, the seasons and the day and night might be perfect ...but human beings are NOT perfect. "God" found this out very early on, didn't He? Didn't He not even regret having created humans in the first place? And, why God didn't have fore-knowledge that this would be the case - a God who we are told knows the end from the beginning - brings the 'perfect God' catch-cry into question yet again.
As for the second part. do you not realize that it's often you and yours that is creating confusion and difficulty in a gay person's life, Jeff? Ignorance will do this and you and yours are continually perpetuating ignorance through your waving an ancient book around condemning ACTUAL PEOPLE. a book that doesn't even say what you claim that it says anyway . . .

Yes He is. This time the perfection comes through Jesus. But God still demands perfection.
But, 'each person' has to be heterosexual, right?
You actually believe in demons, Jeff? Do demons cause trouble and pain or could we perhaps attribute trouble and pain to less supernatural causes?
Tell me, what 'sinful pursuits' are homosexuals engaged in specifically? Are their 'sinful pursuits' different to the 'sinful pursuits' of heterosexuals? I just don't understand where you're coming from on this topic, Jeff. Is it purely sex-related? If it is ...you know what I'll have to say next, don't you?

One's sexual orientation is not 'a sin', Jeff. Yes, homosexual people commit wrongs just as heterosexuals commit wrongs but one's sexual persuasion is not THE wrong ( 'sin').
Correct me if I'm wrong, Jeff, but you come across to me as someone who actually believes that homosexual people are feigning being gay ...that they are really heterosexuals who are knowingly going against their natural straight orientation for no other reason than to be deviants and p--s off Christians.
Am I correct in thinking this?

Your beliefs come from an unreliable source ...i.e. man's misinterpretation of certain ambiguous scriptures. You ARE judging a minority group as a whole for simply being WHO they are.
You sound like Jack Nicholson in A Few Good Men. His intentions were to protect (American) lives but his methodology for doing so was somewhat skewed. Gay people will no more be responsible for destroying lives than straight people will. In fact, straight people have already done a pretty good job of that.
I've discussed these cherished Bible texts with you previously, Jeff. You just haven't listened because you really do seem to have an anti-gay agenda. Is it the party line of your particular church that you're upholding? Or is it you personally who can't handle the truth ...?
Wow! This post is entirely too rational, reasonable, considerate, caring and enlightened to be "cast before . . ."!!! But perhaps there will be some here who will benefit from its eloquence. Bravo!
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Old 08-23-2016, 10:39 PM
 
Location: Texas
1,279 posts, read 1,147,320 times
Reputation: 1333
Quote:
Originally Posted by TroutDude View Post
It's not difficult.

Those who make sense and produce evidence to buttress what they say.

Which eliminates a goodly portion of the bible.
If it's not difficult then why didn't you tell me?

Who is believable?
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Old 08-24-2016, 06:45 AM
 
6,813 posts, read 3,131,023 times
Reputation: 2373
Quote:
Originally Posted by cowdog View Post
You lied about me and my family.
You and I know your truth, cowbell.


God wants you to find an anger management group and a meeting.
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Old 08-24-2016, 07:51 AM
 
Location: GOVERNMENT of TRAITORS & NAZIS
20,554 posts, read 22,715,248 times
Reputation: 7625
Quote:
Originally Posted by cowdog View Post
How come you do not make her prove her words? Which are lies?
You said they were deleted then you confessed to saying it..PROOF and EVIDENCE...

Or are you referencing the words you allege are lies about you and your family?

I believe her so they must be true--YOU should prove them wrong...
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Old 08-24-2016, 08:36 AM
Status: "Amused by BF." (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
23,263 posts, read 12,056,137 times
Reputation: 10629
Quote:
Originally Posted by cowdog View Post
If it's not difficult then why didn't you tell me?

Who is believable?
I did tell you.

Apparently, it was too difficult for you to understand.
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Old 08-24-2016, 05:27 PM
 
Location: Texas
1,279 posts, read 1,147,320 times
Reputation: 1333
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonkonkomaNative View Post
You and I know your truth, cowbell.
I know you are a liar, Jezebel.
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