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Old 10-11-2009, 02:29 PM
 
21,812 posts, read 16,674,400 times
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When I mentioned the five cycles of discipline in the thread pertaining to homosexuality, I was asked to start a thread concerning those five cycles.

God judges nations for their apostasy. He holds nations that are client nations to God--that is, nations that have been given the responsibility of disseminating the Gospel through missionary activity through out the world--to higher standards, and disciplines and judges those nations more severely when they fail to fulfull their responsibility then He judges other nations.

In the age of Israel, the nation Israel was charged with that responsibility. It was God's intention that Israel be the custodian of His word and to evangelize the Gentile nations. Israel consistantly failed to live up to that responsibility and found itself under varying degrees of divine discipline and judgment. Today, the Jews still remain under the fifth cycle of discipline as they remain dispersed through out the world. The fact that some Jews are back in the land at the moment is not the regathering of Israel that God has promised them, and which will occur at the second advent of Christ.

Leviticus 26:14-39 details the five cycles of national discipline as they applied to Israel. They also apply to any nation that disobeys God.


Verses 14-19 start off with the first cycle of discipline in which there's a loss of inner peace, fear and paranoia among the people, there are business and agricultural failures, defeat in war, poverty and sickness.


Verses 18-20 describe the second cycle in which as a result of rejecting God, the nation begins to accelerate its rate of decline, and loses its honor and prestige.


The third cycle of discipline is given in verses 21 and 22, and concerns punishment through plagues,the death of children, the destruction of wealth (cattle--cattle were considered wealth in ancient Israel).

Verses 23-26 details the fourth cycle with its increasing intensity of these judgments, including invasions by foreign powers, and extreme economic adversity, and famine. Plagues and disease increase.

Verses 27-39 details the fifth cycle of discipline which involves the complete loss of personal and national sovereignty, the destruction of the family and the nation. The land is made desolate and conditions can be so bad that people resort to cannibalism.

In our present dispensation, only Gentile nations can be client nations to God, and currently the United States holds that responsibility. As this country continues its mad dash away from God and the national apostasy increases, such as it's embracing of homosexuality, and its turning away from Biblical principles concerning individual freedom, marriage, family, and nationalism; and as the perverting of Christianity continues to increase, then this nation will continue to come under more and more severe judgment from God. We are currently pretty far along on the scale.

Here's a link concerning the cycles of discipline:

Chastisement (Divine Discipline)

Google: the five cycles of discipline for others.
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Old 10-11-2009, 03:30 PM
 
3,553 posts, read 4,470,331 times
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Thank you! It is an interesting read.
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Old 10-11-2009, 08:10 PM
 
Location: Went around the corner & now I'm lost!!!!
1,550 posts, read 3,074,343 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
When I mentioned the five cycles of discipline in the thread pertaining to homosexuality, I was asked to start a thread concerning those five cycles.

God judges nations for their apostasy. He holds nations that are client nations to God--that is, nations that have been given the responsibility of disseminating the Gospel through missionary activity through out the world--to higher standards, and disciplines and judges those nations more severely when they fail to fulfull their responsibility then He judges other nations.

In the age of Israel, the nation Israel was charged with that responsibility. It was God's intention that Israel be the custodian of His word and to evangelize the Gentile nations. Israel consistantly failed to live up to that responsibility and found itself under varying degrees of divine discipline and judgment. Today, the Jews still remain under the fifth cycle of discipline as they remain dispersed through out the world. The fact that some Jews are back in the land at the moment is not the regathering of Israel that God has promised them, and which will occur at the second advent of Christ.

Leviticus 26:14-39 details the five cycles of national discipline as they applied to Israel. They also apply to any nation that disobeys God.


Verses 14-19 start off with the first cycle of discipline in which there's a loss of inner peace, fear and paranoia among the people, there are business and agricultural failures, defeat in war, poverty and sickness.


Verses 18-20 describe the second cycle in which as a result of rejecting God, the nation begins to accelerate its rate of decline, and loses its honor and prestige.


The third cycle of discipline is given in verses 21 and 22, and concerns punishment through plagues,the death of children, the destruction of wealth (cattle--cattle were considered wealth in ancient Israel).

Verses 23-26 details the fourth cycle with its increasing intensity of these judgments, including invasions by foreign powers, and extreme economic adversity, and famine. Plagues and disease increase.

Verses 27-39 details the fifth cycle of discipline which involves the complete loss of personal and national sovereignty, the destruction of the family and the nation. The land is made desolate and conditions can be so bad that people resort to cannibalism.

In our present dispensation, only Gentile nations can be client nations to God, and currently the United States holds that responsibility. As this country continues its mad dash away from God and the national apostasy increases, such as it's embracing of homosexuality, and its turning away from Biblical principles concerning individual freedom, marriage, family, and nationalism; and as the perverting of Christianity continues to increase, then this nation will continue to come under more and more severe judgment from God. We are currently pretty far along on the scale.

Here's a link concerning the cycles of discipline:

Chastisement (Divine Discipline)

Google: the five cycles of discipline for others.
Looks like America is at the third and fourth cycle ( or should I say spiral)
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Old 10-12-2009, 01:37 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,667,088 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
When I mentioned the five cycles of discipline in the thread pertaining to homosexuality, I was asked to start a thread concerning those five cycles.

God judges nations for their apostasy. He holds nations that are client nations to God--that is, nations that have been given the responsibility of disseminating the Gospel through missionary activity through out the world--to higher standards, and disciplines and judges those nations more severely when they fail to fulfull their responsibility then He judges other nations.

In the age of Israel, the nation Israel was charged with that responsibility. It was God's intention that Israel be the custodian of His word and to evangelize the Gentile nations. Israel consistantly failed to live up to that responsibility and found itself under varying degrees of divine discipline and judgment. Today, the Jews still remain under the fifth cycle of discipline as they remain dispersed through out the world. The fact that some Jews are back in the land at the moment is not the regathering of Israel that God has promised them, and which will occur at the second advent of Christ.

Leviticus 26:14-39 details the five cycles of national discipline as they applied to Israel. They also apply to any nation that disobeys God.


Verses 14-19 start off with the first cycle of discipline in which there's a loss of inner peace, fear and paranoia among the people, there are business and agricultural failures, defeat in war, poverty and sickness.


Verses 18-20 describe the second cycle in which as a result of rejecting God, the nation begins to accelerate its rate of decline, and loses its honor and prestige.


The third cycle of discipline is given in verses 21 and 22, and concerns punishment through plagues,the death of children, the destruction of wealth (cattle--cattle were considered wealth in ancient Israel).

Verses 23-26 details the fourth cycle with its increasing intensity of these judgments, including invasions by foreign powers, and extreme economic adversity, and famine. Plagues and disease increase.

Verses 27-39 details the fifth cycle of discipline which involves the complete loss of personal and national sovereignty, the destruction of the family and the nation. The land is made desolate and conditions can be so bad that people resort to cannibalism.

In our present dispensation, only Gentile nations can be client nations to God, and currently the United States holds that responsibility. As this country continues its mad dash away from God and the national apostasy increases, such as it's embracing of homosexuality, and its turning away from Biblical principles concerning individual freedom, marriage, family, and nationalism; and as the perverting of Christianity continues to increase, then this nation will continue to come under more and more severe judgment from God. We are currently pretty far along on the scale.

Here's a link concerning the cycles of discipline:

Chastisement (Divine Discipline)

Google: the five cycles of discipline for others.
Funny you point to America but I immediately thought of 70AD when Josephus writes about the mother who roasted her baby to stay alive while the city of Jerusalem was besieged. Now that is serious chastisement.... however, America has always claimed to be a place for freedom of religion not slavery to religion as the Israelites were in the time of Leviticus...

Comparing those verses to every nation is absurd as it was the nation of Israel that had a covenant with God not America.

Besides... all those things happened to Israel.

I will use those verses to dispute futurists as that all points to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD... so thanks!
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Old 10-12-2009, 08:08 AM
 
4,512 posts, read 6,728,744 times
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as a foreigner i am glad, but forever dumbfounded at this archaic view expressed by using the biblical records without coming to a CLEAR INTERPRETATION of their meaning at any time, i.e. then AND now.

no agreement obviously, but endless bashing of one another for not agreeing.

kudos all around!!

thanks to the op, all the same.
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Old 10-12-2009, 05:03 PM
 
21,812 posts, read 16,674,400 times
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Nations rise and fall by the hand of God. God's punishment of nations is not confined to Israel. Many nations in human history have been judged by God.

The book of Ezekiel lists the nations of Babylon, Tyre, Egypt, Moab, Amon, Idumea, Sidon, and Assyria as Gentile nations that have come under divine judgment.

The Babylonian Empire was completely destroyed. It did continue on as a city, and the ultimate destruction of Babylon is prophesied in Revelation 17 and 18.

In more recent times, the British Empire, once a great nation; there was a time when it was said that the sun never set on the Union Jack; eventually declined in power and influence as it turned away from God.

Just as God took the land that was inhabited by the various tribes of the Canaanites, and because of idol worship gave the land to Israel, so too, God took the land away from the various tribes of the so called native American peoples, and also because of idolatry, gave it to the English settlers and brought into being, the United States of America.

America has been great because of God. But now we are in decline as a nation because of our failure to honor God.

Here's another link concernng the judgments of God that might be of interest:

Judgment - BibleFocus.net
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Old 10-12-2009, 07:14 PM
 
Location: Somewhere between here and there.
124 posts, read 282,206 times
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Mike says that nations rise and fall by the hand of god. So what is it like some sick game that god is playing with us? No wonder I can't make myself fall in love with this "god"! I've tried but it ain't happening.
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Old 10-13-2009, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Went around the corner & now I'm lost!!!!
1,550 posts, read 3,074,343 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Feel_Fat_2 View Post
Mike says that nations rise and fall by the hand of god. So what is it like some sick game that god is playing with us? No wonder I can't make myself fall in love with this "god"! I've tried but it ain't happening.
Mike is saying what Deuteronomy has already said; there are blessings for obedience to God's rules and cursing for DISobedience to those same rules...read for yourself. Your problem is that you don't want to hear or know the truth but in your own family, work or play there are rules to abide by. If these rules are not followed then there will be chaos and confusion and we know who is the author of both... so why it is so hard to understand?

God commands are there for the benefit of All ...I repeat ALL people; no groups is held in higher regard than another. God already knows the harm it will bring if it continues just as a parent already knows if a child puts his hand in the fire, he will get burned then suffer pain and if not treated will get infected, the infection spreads until lose of limb or death. So God, the parent he is will discipline his children; not difficult to conprehend...simple.
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Old 10-13-2009, 01:50 PM
 
40,040 posts, read 26,720,362 times
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Originally Posted by eyewrist View Post
So God, the parent he is will discipline his children; not difficult to conprehend...simple.
But the "parent" Mike is describing would be convicted of child abuse in any of our courts of law. He presents a horrendously evil and egotistically human God that a rational person could never truly love . . . only pretend to love in worship and fear of His mysterious and power-hungry ways.
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Old 10-13-2009, 03:32 PM
 
Location: Went around the corner & now I'm lost!!!!
1,550 posts, read 3,074,343 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
But the "parent" Mike is describing would be convicted of child abuse in any of our courts of law. He presents a horrendously evil and egotistically human God that a rational person could never truly love . . . only pretend to love in worship and fear of His mysterious and power-hungry ways.
I did not see where Mike is trying to be a parent to those on this thread. He just stated the obvious and what has been recorded in the bible. If you read through Chroniciles ALONG with I and II Kings side each other instead of as separate books you will read that each subsequent King gets worse than the prior and because of that the nation of Israel gets worse also. Doesn't proverbs say "were the king is corrupt so are the people?"

This mean and cruel God you speak of gives Israel MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY chances to repent and turn from their evil ways and obey him but they did not. And because of that, they are punished by God allowing the Babylonians and Assyrians to overtake them. But even in their captivity, God protected a few who would not disobey him and they found favor amongst their enemies!!!!

Nothing has changed from then to now the same rules applies and God's same reaction to sin applies...If you repent and turn from your wicked ways, I will forgive you and heal your land, which IMO means your body, your family, your needs (not necessarily your wants) but if you do not, your sin will not go unpunished. God disciplines like you would discipline your child but God is much more patient then we are, he can tolerate disobedience for years even decades but he says that's enough; then that enough!
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