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Old 10-13-2009, 02:39 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,455,222 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristyGrl View Post
Jesus said this to show that children are pure in heart and are teachable....something most adults lack and we are also to become like then if we want to enter in the Kingdom.
Children are not pure in heart. Do you have kids? Been to a Chucky Cheese lately?

Jesus characterized conversion picturing faith as simple, helpless, trusting dependence on those who have no resources of their own like children they have no achievements and no accomplishments to offer or commend themselves with.
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Old 10-13-2009, 02:44 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,392,881 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
(Luke 18:16)

16But Jesus called for them, saying, "Permit the children to come to Me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. Amen!
Well then there you go! Case Closed! God said that the kingdom of God belongs to the children so fire your pastor and hire a kid because obviously the child is more qualified by default!

I can accept that... from the mouths of babes.

All children are saved....

all adults..well a nice bath in the lake of fire will do for us!

(BTW-The disciples thought the children would bother Jesus while he taught and they were wrong because it is the children who understand the nature of God infinitely more than indoctrinated adults.)
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Old 10-13-2009, 02:46 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,455,222 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Well then there you go! Case Closed! God said that the kingdom of God belongs to the children so fire your pastor and hire a kid because obviously the child is more qualified by default!

I can accept that... from the mouths of babes.

All children are saved....

all adults..well a nice bath in the lake of fire will do for us!

(BTW-The disciples thought the children would bother Jesus while he taught and they were wrong because it is the children who understand the nature of God infinitely more than indoctrinated adults.)
Why are you making such bizarre statements?

Jesus characterized conversion picturing faith as simple, helpless, trusting dependence on those who have no resources of their own like children they have no achievements and no accomplishments to offer or commend themselves with.

That is how we come to God, on humble knees not proud and boastful. It's all for you God
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Old 10-13-2009, 02:51 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,392,881 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
Children are not pure in heart. Do you have kids? Been to a Chucky Cheese lately?
I have four and they are (sometimes) small demons! BUT I love them dearly even though they seriously live in a different dimension than I do! I count myself as civilized, yet children don't seem to have that problem of being civilized! LOL they are cute though

Quote:
Jesus characterized conversion picturing faith as simple, helpless, trusting dependence on those who have no resources of their own like children they have no achievements and no accomplishments to offer or commend themselves with.
Exactly... now you are getting somewhere!
If a man says that he accepted Jesus and is now saved.. that is an accomplishment and commendable. BUT if we are as little children and just accept that we have no resources and so it is GOD and GOD alone who is behind our salvation....then we are as little children and the kingdom is meant for us... right?

So all you who think you earned a place in heaven, have no part in the kingdom of heaven.
And all those who think they did not and can not earn a place in heaven, have a place in the kingdom of heaven.

UR=cannot earn a place in heaven, it is given.
ET/AN= if you don't earn it you are sent to annihilation or eternal torture...

SEE?
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Old 10-13-2009, 02:53 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,392,881 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
Why are you making such bizarre statements?

Jesus characterized conversion picturing faith as simple, helpless, trusting dependence on those who have no resources of their own like children they have no achievements and no accomplishments to offer or commend themselves with.

That is how we come to God, on humble knees not proud and boastful. It's all for you God
I have a bad (some would say ) habit of using sarcasm mixed with truth to show error... sorry bout that... I am working on it.

Do you agree that it is faith that saves or grace?
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Old 10-13-2009, 02:59 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,455,222 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Exactly... now you are getting somewhere!
If a man says that he accepted Jesus and is now saved.. that is an accomplishment and commendable. BUT if we are as little children and just accept that we have no resources and so it is GOD and GOD alone who is behind our salvation....then we are as little children and the kingdom is meant for us... right?.....
With all due respect your logic is a bit convoluted. No that has nothing to do with someone who professes Christ, that is not the accomplishment but "work righteouness" a person who tries to earn his or her way into heaven.

No one earns their place in heaven. We come to Him on our knees as beggars to the foot of the cross and say, I am done, I am nothing without you. I set aside my pride and give it all to you, my life is now yours. I don't derserve anything from you let alone heaven. I surrender
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Old 10-13-2009, 03:01 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,455,222 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
I have a bad (some would say ) habit of using sarcasm mixed with truth to show error... sorry bout that... I am working on it.

Do you agree that it is faith that saves or grace?
We are saved by grace alone through faith alone
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Old 10-13-2009, 03:47 PM
 
37,553 posts, read 25,261,889 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
That is how we come to God, on humble knees not proud and boastful. It's all for you God
This is the distortion . . . God needs NOTHING from us . . certainly not some ego-boosting, feet-kissing, (I will remain semi-respectful and forget the other analogy) submission and supplication, cowering and acknowledging His Almighty power in the face of our complete worthlessness . . . all to His glory, worship, blah, blah, blah. His glory has no need of it. His ego has no need of it. We and we alone benefit from reaching out to God and that is what He wants us to do FOR US . . . NOT HIM. Only a weak human ego would want that kind of "glory and worship and acknowledgment of inferiority and worthlessness from others. God HAS NO HUMAN WEAKNESSES . . . no jealousy, no wrath, no anger, no hate, no vengeance, no greed, no power-hungry ego, no desire for adulation, etc. . . . no human weaknesses whatsoever!
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Old 10-13-2009, 04:39 PM
 
2,996 posts, read 4,759,404 times
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---Quote (Originally by joetownmom)---
Just remember that Christians of any sect would not have a Bible had not the Catholic Church - the only CHristian sect for centuries - preserved it until the Reformation Years (1500's) when men like Luther could start to come up with their own take on it.
---End Quote---

The inspired Books had already been determined by God himself , and it was simply up to the Church to recognize which books were inspired for canonization . The RCC didnt 'give us the Bible'... God himself did. The RCC by applying the stringent requirements for inspiration, selected the books that were to be the canon. Unfortunately, the RCC also wanted the error-laden Apocrapha included as well, but even the famous Roman Translater/Scholar Jerome, refused to translate it due to not meeting the criteria and having geographical error in it.

Luther did a very noble and brave thing by taking a stand against the heresies that had crept in due to the traditions of Men (madeup doctrine) thruout the centuries, and helped restore the Bible to the way it should have been with the qualified inspired books only . Whenever any teaching comes against the Bible, the finished work of christ , justification, atonement, salvation, Gods duties., etc.. we should vehemently take a stand. And sadly, there are some 33 RCC doctrines which do exactly that. Regards.

Last edited by 007.5; 10-13-2009 at 04:42 PM.. Reason: add
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Old 10-13-2009, 04:57 PM
 
1,534 posts, read 1,594,070 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
You just confirmed that familiar spirit is a "hollow sound" meaning that there is no substance in it! That means it is a figment of imagination. The necromancers thought they were hearing the knowledge of the dead and were passing that on... do you think the dead speak too?

You have given me nothing that can convince me that satan or demons are real and alive! there is no scripture that contradicts that the adversary is anyone who opposes another.. that could be me opposing myself yet I am not called satan!

Since you seem to have a grasp on using the original languages you should study this:
  1. Origin of sin - James 1:13-15; Mark 7:20-23 cf. Jer. 17:9.
  2. The meaning of satan (adversary) - the following are referred to as "satan" or "adversary":
    1. God - 2 Sam. 24:1 cf. 1 Chron. 21:1.
    2. An obedient divine angel - Num. 22:22.
    3. Hadad the Edomite - 1 Kings 11:14.
    4. Peter - Matt. 16:23.
  3. The meaning of "devil" (accuser; calumniator) - the following are referred to as a "devil" or "slanderer":
    1. Judas - John 6:70.
    2. Women - 1 Timothy 3:11 cf. Titus 2:3.
    3. Men - 2 Timothy 3:3.
    4. "Sin in the flesh" - Heb. 2:14 cf. Heb. 9:26 and Rom. 5:21; 6:23 (to show that "devil" is synonymous with "sin") and then cf. Rom. 7:17, 18.
Demon possessions in the NT were counted as sicknesses.. yet we have really cool "casting out of demons" medicine that will cure those same sicknesses.....
Jesus casts out the demons in Legion and then he is said to be "of his right mind." Today we would prescribe anti-psychotic drugs and have the same result.

I have no fear of satan, the devil, or demons, evil spirits, or familiar spirits.... they exist in your imagination and books of fiction.

There is absolutely no "real live" demons/devils running a muck in the world. That is an ancient idea and I hope we have evolved beyond the Salem Witch Trials! Where poisoning of grain was considered to be "demon-possessed" yet we know that a simple medicine will cure the "demon-possessed."

but alas, this is way off topic....
First I did not comfirm a familar spirit is a hollow sound. To begin with many words have more than one meaning. And just as in the English the meaning is determined by the context. This word is no different it means:

1.)a mumble
2.)a water skin (because it has a hollow sound) It doesn't say the defintion IS a hollow sound.
3.)necromancer
4.)bottle
5.) familiar spirit

Reread the definiton:

familiar spirit #178 'owb obe *from the same as 1 (apparently through the idea of prattling a father's name); properly, a mumble, i.e. *a water skin (from its hollow sound); hence a necromancer (ventriloquist, as from a jar):--bottle, familiar spirit.

*NOTE its the water skin that has a hollow sound not the familiar spirit.

Again note: in the O. T. it's rendered as familiar spirit(s) 16 times and bottles 1 time.

You have give me nothing to prove the word adversary always means satan/the devil. First of all if it means satan it has the definite article, and again this word has more than one meaning, and the defintion is determined by the context it's used in:

#7854 satan saw-tawn' from 7853; an opponent; especially (with the article prefixed) Satan, the arch-enemy of good:--adversary, Satan, withstand.

Again...in the O. T. it is render Satan 19, adversary 7, withstand 1

Quote:
Demon possessions in the NT were counted as sicknesses.. yet we have really cool "casting out of demons" medicine that will cure those same sicknesses.....

Jesus casts out the demons in Legion and then he is said to be "of his right mind." Today we would prescribe anti-psychotic drugs and have the same result.
2 And when he was come out of the ship, immediately there met him out of the tombs a man with an unclean spirit,

Mark. 5:6 But when he saw Jesus afar off, he ran and worshipped him,

NOTE, he, the man is not named. In other words the man's name is not Legion.

7 And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not.

8 For he said unto him, Come out of the man, thou unclean spirit.

Did Christ say, come out of him you sickness? No He said unclean spirit.

9 And he asked *him, What is thy name? And **he answered, saying, My name is Legion: for ***we are many.

*him. Who? The unclean spirit.
**he. Who answered? the unclean spirit.
***we. Who's the we? A legion of unclean spirits.
****them. Who. The legion of unclean spirits.

NOTE. the unclean spirits talked to Christ. Can a disease do this? I think not.

10 And **he besought him much that he would not send ****them away out of the country.

11 Now there was there nigh unto the mountains a great herd of swine feeding.

12 And all the devils besought him, saying, Send us into the swine, that ***we may enter into them.

13 And forthwith Jesus gave them leave. And the unclean spirits went out, and entered into the swine: and the herd ran violently down a steep place into the sea, (they were about two thousand); and were choked in the sea.

Again could a disease have been chocked in the sea?

14 And they that fed the swine fled, and told it in the city, and in the country. And they went out to see what it was that was done.

15 And they come to Jesus, and see him that was possessed with the devil, and had the legion, sitting, and clothed, and in his right mind: and they were afraid.

Now if you can't see that Christ cast out a Legion of unclean spirits from this man than there's not much hope for you.

Last edited by mshipmate; 10-13-2009 at 05:05 PM.. Reason: spelling
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