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Old 04-18-2016, 08:05 PM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,651 posts, read 32,108,797 times
Reputation: 9442

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Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
Yes for the record God says they can
YOU are on the record saying new born babies can talk, even though it has never actually happened. The Bible says something, which you clearly think means something else.

Quote:
But as you said, you prefer your humanistic reasoning over against what God said
No, i did not say that.

I simply said babies cannot talk, which is a fact. Everyone knows that, even you, even thought you are too proud to admit it.

Have you seen a new born baby talk?

Last edited by Finn_Jarber; 04-18-2016 at 08:19 PM..
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Old 04-18-2016, 08:30 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,825 posts, read 9,847,406 times
Reputation: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by wallflash View Post
Sure it's been dodged , as you have so far refused to answer , and everyone on the forum can see that you have not . I have no hoped for narrative , I just would like to see if you have the courage to give a straight answer to what you seem to imply .

There are only 3 possible answers. Yes they will, no they won't, or maybe they will. In my last couple of attempts to get an honest answer out of you I have focused on the maybe part so as to not be putting words in your mouth by suggesting you are saying God will send them to Hell. There isn't any other answer that doesn't fall into one of the three , and trying to avoid answering by claiming what you said previously just doesn't fit my narrative , when you didn't give any of the actual answers, is nothing but a cop out .

You don't appear to have the willingness to state your beliefs openly, and hide behind quoting scripture to shield yourself from having to do so. Sounds like a person somewhat ashamed of his beliefs to me .
Haven't you noticed I don't care that you're pouting.

I have openly stated what God said as to the human condition which is the truth:
"flesh gives birth to flesh" ~ Jesus

Conclusion:
  • babies are sinful from birth, --- not the alternative (which is a lie) of being sinless
  • babies are a product of sinful human parents
"All have turned away,
they have together become worthless;
there is no one who does good, not even one.”


Conclusion:
  • babies are included in "all" --- not the alternative (which is a lie) of " well except for"
  • babies are included in "not even one " --- not the alternative (a humanistic lie) of 'well except for'

"The Lord saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth,
and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time
"

Conclusion:
  • babies (born or not) are included in " the human race " --- not the alternative (which is a lie) that the unborn is not human being
  • babies are included in " the thought of human heart " --- not the alternative (which is a lie)
  • babies are included in " every inclination " --- not the alternative (which is a lie)

"Yet you desired faithfulness even in the womb; you taught me wisdom in that secret place."
Conclusion:
  • if babies are sinless as the suppositions falsely suggest then:
    • God would not desire "faithfulness even in the womb"
  • if babies are incapable as the suppositions falsely suggest then:
    • "you taught me wisdom in that secret place." then this is too is calling God a liar
now if you notice a pattern developing (as brilliant and insightful as you boast of being), where no answer is given by God,the alternative answer is nothing short of a satanical desire to peer into God's domain, thus my answer is "there is no answer".

Got it ?

Last edited by twin.spin; 04-18-2016 at 08:50 PM..
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Old 04-18-2016, 08:41 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,825 posts, read 9,847,406 times
Reputation: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
YOU are on the record saying new born babies can talk, even though it has never actually happened. The Bible says something, which you clearly think means something else.

No, i did not say that.

I simply said babies cannot talk, which is a fact. Everyone knows that, even you, even thought you are too proud to admit it.

Have you seen a new born baby talk?
I'm on record that God says in the Holy Bible
  1. they (the wicked) speak lies,
  2. they are taught by God wisdom in that secret place,
  3. they are capable to learn the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus
  4. they are products of sinful human parents "flesh gives birth to flesh"
  5. God desires faithfulness even in the womb
  6. "No one is righteous, not even one" includes babies
  7. that when God declared that the entire human race inclination of the heart is only evil all the time that babies are included
and all you can do is argue against God's Holy Word in preference to lean on your realm of understanding.
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Old 04-18-2016, 08:45 PM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,651 posts, read 32,108,797 times
Reputation: 9442
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
I'm on record that God says in the Holy Bible
  1. they (the wicked) speak lies,
  2. they are taught by God wisdom in that secret place,
  3. they are capable to learn the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus
  4. they are products of sinful human parents "flesh gives birth to flesh"
  5. God desires faithfulness even in the womb
and all you can do is argue against God Holy Word like any typical atheist \ agnostic that you and I always encounter here because it appears you'd rather lean on your realm of understanding.
You are dodging.

Let's try again.

Do you believe new born babies can talk? Yes, or no?

Have you ever seen/heard a new born baby talk? Yes, or no?
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Old 04-18-2016, 08:50 PM
 
4,851 posts, read 1,481,811 times
Reputation: 1571
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
Haven't you noticed I don't care that you're pouting.

I have openly stated what God said as to the human condition which is the truth:
"flesh gives birth to flesh" ~ Jesus

Conclusion:
  • babies are sinful from birth, --- not the alternative (which is a lie) of being sinless
  • babies are a product of sinful human parents
"All have turned away,
they have together become worthless;
there is no one who does good, not even one.”


Conclusion:
  • babies are included in "all" --- not the alternative (which is a lie) of being sinless
  • babies are included in "not even one " --- not the alternative (a humanistic lie) of 'well except for'

"The Lord saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth,
and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time
"

Conclusion:
  • babies (born or not) are included in " the human race " --- not the alternative (which is a lie) that the unborn is not human being
  • babies are included in " the thought of human heart " --- not the alternative (which is a lie)
  • babies are included in " every inclination " --- not the alternative (which is a lie)

"Yet you desired faithfulness even in the womb; you taught me wisdom in that secret place."
Conclusion:
  • if babies are sinless as the suppositions falsely suggest then:
    • God would not desire "faithfulness even in the womb"
  • if babies are incapable as the suppositions falsely suggest then:
    • "you taught me wisdom in that secret place." then this is too is calling God a liar
now if you notice a pattern developing (as brilliant and insightful as you boast of being), where no answer is given by God,the alternative answer is nothing short of a satanical desire to peer into God's domain, thus the answer is "there is no answer".

Got it ?

I've got that for all your meaningless and irrelevant insults you can't bring yourself to give a direct answer, but must hide behind quoting scripture for some reason . To say there is no answer is ridiculous . The babies wil go somewhere , or will never exist in the afterlife . If they won't exist then that is the answer . If they will exist in an afterlife , then they will exist somewhere . And either your theology teaches that they will go to Heaven , they will go to Hell, or their fate is uncertain and unknown and so there is a possibility they will go to Hell . This, if you didn't grasp it before, would be the "maybe" option.

For all your talk, you lack the courage to simply answer a question . And all your pathetic attempts at insults won't change that any . You are big on implying an unpleasant fate for babies, but become a big duck and dodge guy when ask for something direct .
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Old 04-18-2016, 08:56 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
15,586 posts, read 7,060,910 times
Reputation: 1609
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
The many false and Satanic spirits that gets people to look inside themselves or to something else other than God's Word the Holy Bible \ "the Scriptures" as Jesus referred to when refuting the satanic spirits.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
This is true. On the other hand that Bible says we are to have a guide (not just 'something inside ourselves') but the Spirit of Truth, and there is more than one description of the results of that guidance and the nature of the wisdom gained from it as well as the nature of God relating to men as taught by Jesus and Paul. Are you and Finn in agreement about the meaning of your "standard" by rhe citations given? Or is it just a matter of doctrines taught and you really HAVE no standard for telling truth? When have I ever urged anything but what is absolutely Biblical in this matter? But you obviously don't believe your Bible.

"False spirit" that gets people to look inside themselves: John 14:17 "the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you." Perhaps you don't like what you see when you "look inside yourself," twin?
Quote:
Originally Posted by wallflash View Post
.........
You don't appear to have the willingness to state your beliefs openly, and hide behind quoting scripture to shield yourself from having to do so. Sounds like a person somewhat ashamed of his beliefs to me .
I think you nailed it.
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Old 04-18-2016, 09:06 PM
 
7,757 posts, read 3,447,338 times
Reputation: 1746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
So you say it's not to be taken literally?

Why not? Why do you doubt the clear Word of God(tm)?
I don't know of any Christian who takes every single word literally.
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Old 04-18-2016, 09:14 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,825 posts, read 9,847,406 times
Reputation: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
You are dodging.

Let's try again.

Do you believe new born babies can talk? Yes, or no?

Have you ever seen/heard a new born baby talk? Yes, or no?
I'm not the one here who is dodging when I trust God when he says they do since the wicked does.
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Old 04-18-2016, 10:16 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,825 posts, read 9,847,406 times
Reputation: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by wallflash View Post
I've got that for all your meaningless and irrelevant insults you can't bring yourself to give a direct answer, but must hide behind quoting scripture for some reason . To say there is no answer is ridiculous . The babies wil go somewhere , or will never exist in the afterlife . If they won't exist then that is the answer . If they will exist in an afterlife , then they will exist somewhere . And either your theology teaches that they will go to Heaven , they will go to Hell, or their fate is uncertain and unknown and so there is a possibility they will go to Hell . This, if you didn't grasp it before, would be the "maybe" option.

For all your talk, you lack the courage to simply answer a question . And all your pathetic attempts at insults won't change that any . You are big on implying an unpleasant fate for babies, but become a big duck and dodge guy when ask for something direct .
In other words you can't figure it out that in multiple posts like #485, #472 which references #448 has your answer to your "eithers".

Ok, for the last time to you
A) If they will exist in an afterlife , then they will exist somewhere .
A: Congratulations. They will exist somewhere.

B) And either your theology teaches that they:
1)will go to Heaven,
2)they will go to Hell,
3)their fate is uncertain and unknown ... so there is a possibility they will go to Hell
A: The closest answer to your scenario (keeping in the sphere of the OP) is modified

Short answer: their fate is certain and known only to God, but not to us.

Long answer: Here is what we know:
1) We know from Godís revelation in the Bible that all people are sinners and in need of forgiveness from the moment of their conception (Psalm 51:5)

2) We know from Godís revelation in the Bible that faith in Jesus Christ saves and unbelief condemns (Mark 16:16).

3) We know from Godís revelation in the Bible that God works saving faith in people through
the gospel.

4) We know from Godís revelation to us in the Bible is that people need to have the gospel of
Jesus Christ to be brought to saving faith in the Lord.

5) Going beyond what God has revealed in the Bible is speculation on our part.

Therefore suffice it to say that the OP question is an incentive for the Christian Church to do what Jesus commanded and left as:
ďGo into all the world and preach the good news to all creationĒ (Mark 16:15)

"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit," (Matthew 28:19)
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Old 04-19-2016, 05:56 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,651 posts, read 32,108,797 times
Reputation: 9442
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
I'm not the one here who is dodging when I trust God when he says they do since the wicked does.
Then answer:

Do you believe new born babies can talk? Yes, or no?

Have you ever seen/heard a new born baby talk? Yes, or no?

Did your own kids talk on day 1? Yes, or no?

You are not trusting God on this one, you are trusting yourself.
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