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Old 10-18-2009, 05:06 PM
 
5,749 posts, read 4,597,795 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
Its like this...

When someone is in the hospital and is sick and will not get better they have a thing called the "Do Not Resuscitate" form for the family to sign.

They do not have a "Do Not Resurrect" form to sign...

see the difference?
Yes, but I think I pointed that out already.

Resuscitate... there is some (minute?) shred of life somewhere still left in the body to latch onto and bring back despite there being no observable signs of life. Decomposition has not started.

Resurrect... someone is DEAD. Deader than dead. The body is in the decomposition process.


If you're talking about hanging up signs...
A "Do not resuscitate" is what you would hang on a hospital bed.
A "Do not ressurect" sign is what you would hang on a tombstone.
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Old 10-18-2009, 05:09 PM
 
3,067 posts, read 3,493,511 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post

I admitted it.. you don't have to bash me over the head for me to see the error!

I hope you will join me in my NEW thread
Besides, that's my job.
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Old 10-18-2009, 05:11 PM
 
5,749 posts, read 4,597,795 times
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And just to add... I do understand what you are saying based on your definitions of resuscitate and resurrect. And it makes sense.
I can understand what you are saying from your point of view.
I just don't think I share the same definitions.
So we just have different views.
no big deal.
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Old 10-18-2009, 05:24 PM
 
3,067 posts, read 3,493,511 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .sparrow. View Post
Yes, but I think I pointed that out already.

Resuscitate... there is some (minute?) shred of life somewhere still left in the body to latch onto and bring back .
Nope, to resuscitate is to bring back to normal life...has nothing to do with the smell of the person as this is a miracle...this is not just good doctoring...

Resurrection means to transform the body to a new nature....

Only Jesus has been resurrected...
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Old 10-19-2009, 06:12 AM
 
16,438 posts, read 18,570,899 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
It does not sleep. And I have given the passages that prove it.
You have given good passages to support it, but there are others that support the contrary. I'm not sure it's "proveable" either way.
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Old 10-19-2009, 08:50 AM
 
20,333 posts, read 15,709,470 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bideshi View Post
You have given good passages to support it, but there are others that support the contrary. I'm not sure it's "proveable" either way.
The Bible does not contradict itself. The soul of the believer is shown to be in Heaven after death. The soul of the unbeliever is shown to be in Hades. The verses that talk about death as sleep are talking about the body. Not the soul. Do you not think that Paul knew what he was talking about? He had been given more knowledge of church age doctrine that any of the other Apostles. He had been in Heaven. Perhaps it was a vision, or he might have actually been in Heaven. Paul himself wasn't sure.The experience might have occured at the time that he was stoned. It's possible that he actually briefly died during the stoning and was resuscitiated by God.(Acts 14:19) Either way, he heard and saw things in Heaven that a man is not permitted to speak. 2 Corinthians 12:1-6.

Be assured. God has better things in mind for the believer immediately after death than soul-sleep. The church is described as God's heavenly people. (Hebrews 3:1) The moment after death, the believer is taken home to be with the Lord. ''For our citizenship is in heaven...''(Phil.3:20) And the believer is a stranger in this world. ''Beloved, I call upon you as strangers and sojurners, to keep from the fleshly desires, that war against the soul.'' (1 Peter 2:11)
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Old 10-19-2009, 10:46 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,408,340 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
The Bible does not contradict itself. The soul of the believer is shown to be in Heaven after death. The soul of the unbeliever is shown to be in Hades. The verses that talk about death as sleep are talking about the body. Not the soul. Do you not think that Paul knew what he was talking about? He had been given more knowledge of church age doctrine that any of the other Apostles. He had been in Heaven. Perhaps it was a vision, or he might have actually been in Heaven. Paul himself wasn't sure.The experience might have occured at the time that he was stoned. It's possible that he actually briefly died during the stoning and was resuscitiated by God.(Acts 14:19) Either way, he heard and saw things in Heaven that a man is not permitted to speak. 2 Corinthians 12:1-6.

Ecc. 9:5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten.

So although I don't believe in soul sleep (for different reasons than you do) it is clear that it was taught in the bible. In fact you take this passage in obscurity and make a case against it with so much evidence to the contrary... See Genesis 3:19, 6:3, 18:27, Job 7:21, 21:26, 34:14-15, Psalm 37:20, 49:10-14, 55:23, 76:12, 88:5, 90:3-6, 103:14, 104:29, 112:10, 140:10, 146:4, Ecclesiastes 3:19-20*, 12:7*, Isaiah 26:14, 43:17, 51:39, Ezekiel 18:4, Nahum 3:18, John 6:49, Romans 5:12-14, James 2:26.
See 2 Samuel 7:12, and likewise 1 Kings 2:10, 11:43, 14:20, 31, 15:8, 24, 16:6, 28, 22:40, 50 etc. etc., Job 10:21, 13:12-15, 14:21, Psalm 6:5, 13:3, 30:9, 31:17, 49:17-20, 88:10-11, 115:17, Ecclesiastes 9:4-6, 10, Isaiah 38:18, John 3:13, 11:11-13, Acts 2:29,34, 13:36, 1 Corinthians 15:51.

Again you say that the body sleeps but the soul never does... The soul is another word for life. I've explained this before that the breath (spirit) of God entered the body and it became a living soul... Gen. 2:7

It is very clear. So when you take separate the body and spirit there is no life/soul.

Quote:
Be assured. God has better things in mind for the believer immediately after death than soul-sleep. The church is described as God's heavenly people. (Hebrews 3:1) The moment after death, the believer is taken home to be with the Lord. ''For our citizenship is in heaven...''(Phil.3:20) And the believer is a stranger in this world. ''Beloved, I call upon you as strangers and sojurners, to keep from the fleshly desires, that war against the soul.'' (1 Peter 2:11)
Again.. when you read "soul" look at the original language.. it means LIFE not anything else!

Also God does have better things in mind for the believer and non-believer after death because he already came back, the resurrection has taken place so everyone enters the presence of God upon death... but that is another thread altogether.
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