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Old 11-28-2009, 11:23 AM
 
Location: Winchester
170 posts, read 168,444 times
Reputation: 43

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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
.....as the Romans barricaded the city of Jerusalem during the Jewish War, women killed their newborn infants and ate them. It's in the history books, all you have to do is read it and see it fulfilled the prophecies that were all pointing to the destruction of the city and temple.
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Whatever attraction preterism offers and even Spurgeon found some good in it, it is not the scriptures that did or which seem to have come to pass in 70ad which make it non viable but the scriptures that very definitely did NOT come to pass that make it impossible. It is impossible for an event like the rapture and the second coming to have escaped the notice of historians. Neither has there been such a person as Antichrist who took his seat in the temple proclaiming himself to be God.
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Old 11-28-2009, 11:56 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,398,344 times
Reputation: 1690
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Totton Linnet View Post
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Whatever attraction preterism offers and even Spurgeon found some good in it, it is not the scriptures that did or which seem to have come to pass in 70ad which make it non viable but the scriptures that very definitely did NOT come to pass that make it impossible. It is impossible for an event like the rapture and the second coming to have escaped the notice of historians. Neither has there been such a person as Antichrist who took his seat in the temple proclaiming himself to be God.
There is no such thing in the bible about a rapture.. that is man's fiction. If you can find it in the bible then you are reading it wrong. Jesus' second coming was to be in judgment not "hey! here I am" because if you remember... Jesus told them many false prophets will come in his name..but don't follow them. Why would he say that if his second coming would be visible? Also there were plenty of Roman leaders who proclaimed to be God... And one in particular who put a statue of himself in the temple...

You cannot say that these things did not happen as I explained above..

Historians noted them.. have you read Josephus lately?
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Old 11-28-2009, 03:53 PM
 
Location: Winchester
170 posts, read 168,444 times
Reputation: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
There is no such thing in the bible about a rapture.. that is man's fiction. If you can find it in the bible then you are reading it wrong. Jesus' second coming was to be in judgment not "hey! here I am" because if you remember... Jesus told them many false prophets will come in his name..but don't follow them. Why would he say that if his second coming would be visible? Also there were plenty of Roman leaders who proclaimed to be God... And one in particular who put a statue of himself in the temple...

You cannot say that these things did not happen as I explained above..

Historians noted them.. have you read Josephus lately?
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The Lord shall descend from heaven with a shout and a trumpet blast
[it has never happened]
The dead in Christ will rise first then we which are alive and remain will be caught up together with them to meet the Lord in the clouds. So shall we ever be with Him

Well bro I do not know how you are going to be feeling when all this takes place but "rapture" sounds like a pretty good descriptive word to me. What are you going to be po faced? hands by your sides? c'mon you have to think about scripture not just read it.

And the bible says when He comes it will be as lightening flashes from east to west, John says every eye shall see Him, the kings of the earth shall run from Him.
These events simply have never happened.

If you say that Antichrist was a statue who took his seat in the temple proclaiming that he is God??? but according to Paul that is when the Lord returns, it did not happen in ad 70 it has never happened.
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Old 11-28-2009, 04:07 PM
 
Location: Winchester
170 posts, read 168,444 times
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And Jesus told about false prophets coming saying He is here or there or in a local place to show that when He does com it will be visible to all unmistakeable, as lightening flashes from east to west. It has never happened.
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Old 11-28-2009, 04:53 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,302 posts, read 5,292,342 times
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We really don't need to read Josephus to determine if these prophecies were fulfilled or not, but it does help the doubting kind.

All the prophecies Christ beckoned concerning His coming were all paralleled with the destruction of the city and temple...this happened in 70 AD, and that is when He came.

Did every eye see Him....not on earth, for the text reads γῆ and not κόσμος, which is the LAND.
The PROMISE LAND...Israel.

We must view Revelaton 1:7 in a covenantal light, not a cosmological light.
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Old 11-28-2009, 05:03 PM
 
7,871 posts, read 6,682,198 times
Reputation: 1373
Default No abuse here

No spiritual abuse here I do not believe in the pre-tribulation rapture, But I do believe the rapture is before the bowls judgement because Revelation 15:51-52 tells when the rapture is On the last trumpet. That means believer will go through the seals judgement and the trumpet Judgement. Do we have nothing to fear NO for if we fear we have no faith in Jesus word and heaven will not help us. We must never fear. Another part of Revelations that confirms the Rapture is the virgin about to give birth, and God hides her in the wilderness for the duration of three and one half years. Who is the virgin about to give birth? That is the believers of Children of God, The virgin is like the ten virgins, and about to give birth is, the Great commission of souls or the work of Jesus. When Jesus comes rejoice for the victory is ours, Jesus said ``Cheer up for I have overcome the world``. When God hides his children in wilderness, See during when Moses went to the wilderness Great miracles ocurred, Red sea separated, pillars of fire protect them. clouds of Glory lead their way. manna food for their lives, great plagues of Egypt. Well during the time when the Lord God sends us into the Wilderness the Greatest Miracles will happen never seen on the history or unknown history of Heaven and the earth , the resurrection of the body of Christ Miracle.
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Old 11-28-2009, 05:21 PM
 
Location: Winchester
170 posts, read 168,444 times
Reputation: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
We really don't need to read Josephus to determine if these prophecies were fulfilled or not, but it does help the doubting kind.

All the prophecies Christ beckoned concerning His coming were all paralleled with the destruction of the city and temple...this happened in 70 AD, and that is when He came.

Did every eye see Him....not on earth, for the text reads γῆ and not κόσμος, which is the LAND.
The PROMISE LAND...Israel.

We must view Revelaton 1:7 in a covenantal light, not a cosmological light.
*
You don't half bend scripture don't you, it says every eye shall see Him and those who pierced Him, that is not land, and Thessalonians which tells perfectly plainly about His coming states clearly that the dead shall rise first then we who are alive remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds, so shall we always be with the Lord, this Paul declares will be after He has detroyed Antichrist with the breath of His nostrils. When have ANY of these events taken place. If they had we wouldn't be here.
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Old 11-28-2009, 05:47 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,302 posts, read 5,292,342 times
Reputation: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Totton Linnet View Post
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You don't half bend scripture don't you, it says every eye shall see Him and those who pierced Him, that is not land, and Thessalonians which tells perfectly plainly about His coming states clearly that the dead shall rise first then we who are alive remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds, so shall we always be with the Lord, this Paul declares will be after He has detroyed Antichrist with the breath of His nostrils. When have ANY of these events taken place. If they had we wouldn't be here.
You have much to learn about the scriptures friend in Christ.
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Old 11-28-2009, 05:54 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,398,344 times
Reputation: 1690
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Totton Linnet View Post
*
You don't half bend scripture don't you, it says every eye shall see Him and those who pierced Him, that is not land, and Thessalonians which tells perfectly plainly about His coming states clearly that the dead shall rise first then we who are alive remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds, so shall we always be with the Lord, this Paul declares will be after He has detroyed Antichrist with the breath of His nostrils. When have ANY of these events taken place. If they had we wouldn't be here.
So where do the dead rising in Matt. 27:52 fit in with your view of the end times?

Is that not the dead rising?
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Old 11-28-2009, 06:33 PM
 
392 posts, read 469,761 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
So where do the dead rising in Matt. 27:52 fit in with your view of the end times?

Is that not the dead rising?
Gideon said,
Oh ye of little faith; don’t you understand, that the power of the resurrection was being demonstrated by God when the dead rose. This is not the first resurrection, but merely a foreshadow of what is to come. Those saints that rose, as Lazarus, rose to demonstrate the power of Christ resurrection which would follow three days later. All these saints that rose, including Lazarus, whom rose when Christ was alive and ministering, lived natural lives and died. Jesus raised many and healed many; this is just another event he did to boggle the hearts and minds of the saints. I am sure it increased their faith greatly. He had atoned for the sins of the world. That is why the veil was rent down the middle our high priest entered the Holy of Holies and there was no more need for sacrifices; it was finished as He said. A few saints rose because what he had obviously done was a very powerful event and it even leads others to Christ; that was an act of mercy by God.

Now I do not understand your reasoning; either you are very confused or you enjoy mocking God's word. This is not the resurrection of the saints, the first resurrection; it is a small foreshadow of what is to come. The first resurrection, which is of all the righteous down through the ages, will occur on the last day, at the end of the GT, as Christ proclaims his Lordship and reign on earth with His saints whom He will immortalize on that last day. The last trumpet will sound by the seventh angel to signify and mark all the events that will occur as Christ is revealed at His apokolypcia, when he returns as the omnipotent God that He is to raise all his saints from the dead and to newness of life.

And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.


50Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
51And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; 52And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
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