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Old 10-29-2009, 02:56 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville,Florida
3,772 posts, read 9,357,165 times
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Another question could be do you have to be Christian to attend a church and the answer is no,God is calling us all to come to Him,no matter who we are that we may accept Him as Lord and Saviour and to know His Son Jesus Christ and what He did for us on the cross.
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Old 10-30-2009, 11:25 PM
 
Location: At the center of the universe!
1,176 posts, read 1,689,822 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristyGrl View Post
Absolutely and Unequivocally....NO. I have grown more spiritually in the last year that I've been away from Institutionalized church than I ever did in the many years going to church. Don't ever let anyone tell you that is a requirement to follow God because it is NOT!!
I agree. Nowhere in the Bible does it say that you have to go to church to go to heaven. You want to know why? Because God would never say such silly things.
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Old 10-31-2009, 02:01 AM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,196,917 times
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How can you got to church if you are the church?

Its like saying ... "i'm going to Ironmaw1776" ...

Does that make any sense?

But if two or more come together in his name, he is in the midst ...

So if i go to my friends house or to a restaurant with my friend or brother who is a Christian, and we speak about Christ or salvation or things of God, are we not coming together in his name?

Even though many of us here disagree on doctrinal points and debate theology and the such, isn't the fact that we are here together in the name of Christ gathering together?

Or is coming together in his name only when people who agree on every point of theology come together in his name? Then isn't that divisions among us? I'm of Paul and your of Peter, my pastor/teacher says this and your pastor/teacher says that, my denomination and your denomination ... Is that the only way to have "true fellowship"?

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Old 12-30-2009, 09:35 AM
 
4 posts, read 2,784 times
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I have walked with the Lord for over 33 years. My personal experience with the “organized church haters” is that they are lazy, uncommitted, sin loving people, who want to fill their bellies with liquor, live outside the bonds of holy matrimony, live in other types of deviant sexual relationships (all of which by the way the Bible speaks against), hate their neighbor, steal from their employer, and keep all that God has given them to themselves. The reason why they didn’t like church when they went is because the preacher pointed out something in their lives that was sin (I know – we don’t use that word any more, but God does). I see it all the time in my line of work. People who want to live the way they want to live; they do not want any kind of spiritual authority, they don’t go to church, they don’t read their Bibles, they very seldom pray, and they certainly do not give to anything that will have a spiritual impact on anyone. Many leave the church because they do not want to be held accountable to any Christian standard. But then they go on various forums and spew out their church hating rhetoric, knowing full well that they are not at all what God wants them to be.

They attack the church and anyone who goes to or pastors one. They set themselves up as judge and proclaim that every “organized” church is full of hypocrites; when they themselves have no more right to say that than I would have a right to say that everyone who does not go to church is as I described above.

What alarms me the most about “organized church haters” is that they refuse to see that there are good honest God loving men and women out there, who are part of an “organized” church that loves Jesus and their neighbor, and they are working and giving of their means to help support ministries that reach out in the community and make a difference in people’s lives. They also deny the Book Acts which speaks of all that God did in the early church which involved God’s people gathering for worship, preaching, praying, and most certainly, serving. They shrug off the idea of going to church to be a part of something bigger than themselves. They deny the importance of gathering together with other believers to be edified and encouraged; to pray with and be prayed for when the storms of life come; and they deny the fact that we are all a part of the Body of Christ, and we all have gifts and talents to be used, and everyone has something to do and a place to minister. And if I have to I can give scripture references for all the above mentioned; my advice however would be to look it up and find it out for yourselves...
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Old 12-30-2009, 10:05 AM
 
702 posts, read 811,783 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kentuckydad95 View Post
I have issues with several denom's, but was wondering if I really have to attend a church?
No, you don't have to attend church to be a Christian, but you do have to attend church out of obedience. Whether that church meets in a special building or in a private home, gathering together with other believers is not an option:

Hebrews 10:25 (NIV): "Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching."

How can Christians encourage one another if they don't meet together?

Hebrews 13:7 (ESV): "Remember your leaders, those who spoke to you the word of God. Consider the outcome of their way of life, and imitate their faith."

How can you consider the outcome of their way of life and imitate their faith if you don't spend time with them on a regular basis?

Hebrews 13:17 (ESV): "Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they are keeping watch over your souls, as those who will have to give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with groaning, for that would be of no advantage to you."

How can you obey and submit to your leaders, and how can they keep watch over your souls, if you don't spend time with them under their care?

Ephesians 4:11-15 (ESV): "And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers, 12 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for the body of Christ, 13until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ, 14so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro by the waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by human cunning, by craftiness in deceitful schemes."

God gave shepherds and teachers to the church as gifts for her unity in the faith, for equipping her for the work of the ministry, and for her maturity. If we are part of the body of Christ, and these men were given to the body of Christ to accomplish the tasks listed in the passage, then it is wrong to shun them.
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Old 12-30-2009, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Prattville, Alabama
4,883 posts, read 5,115,922 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by ServingHim View Post
I have walked with the Lord for over 33 years. My personal experience with the “organized church haters” is that they are lazy, uncommitted, sin loving people, who want to fill their bellies with liquor, live outside the bonds of holy matrimony, live in other types of deviant sexual relationships (all of which by the way the Bible speaks against), hate their neighbor, steal from their employer, and keep all that God has given them to themselves. The reason why they didn’t like church when they went is because the preacher pointed out something in their lives that was sin (I know – we don’t use that word any more, but God does). I see it all the time in my line of work. People who want to live the way they want to live; they do not want any kind of spiritual authority, they don’t go to church, they don’t read their Bibles, they very seldom pray, and they certainly do not give to anything that will have a spiritual impact on anyone. Many leave the church because they do not want to be held accountable to any Christian standard. But then they go on various forums and spew out their church hating rhetoric, knowing full well that they are not at all what God wants them to be.

They attack the church and anyone who goes to or pastors one. They set themselves up as judge and proclaim that every “organized” church is full of hypocrites; when they themselves have no more right to say that than I would have a right to say that everyone who does not go to church is as I described above.

What alarms me the most about “organized church haters” is that they refuse to see that there are good honest God loving men and women out there, who are part of an “organized” church that loves Jesus and their neighbor, and they are working and giving of their means to help support ministries that reach out in the community and make a difference in people’s lives. They also deny the Book Acts which speaks of all that God did in the early church which involved God’s people gathering for worship, preaching, praying, and most certainly, serving. They shrug off the idea of going to church to be a part of something bigger than themselves. They deny the importance of gathering together with other believers to be edified and encouraged; to pray with and be prayed for when the storms of life come; and they deny the fact that we are all a part of the Body of Christ, and we all have gifts and talents to be used, and everyone has something to do and a place to minister. And if I have to I can give scripture references for all the above mentioned; my advice however would be to look it up and find it out for yourselves...
That is the biggest crock of poopie I have ever seen posted on this forum....while there may be some who are as you described....it is not all of us.

The very things you've accused "organized church haters" of are the very things I saw happening in the church, while the pastors just stood by and let it happen...without doing their jobs and putting a stop to it. How many churches actually preach about SIN and how UNACCEPTABLE IT IS????? Not one that I've been to in the last 10 years and I live smack in the bible belt....but there is plenty of that "feel good" message. If they actually preached God standards of living....it would be an empty church because no one wants to hear that. How many churches HORDE the money given to them (WHICH SHOULD BE USED STRICTLY FOR THE POOR, WIDOWS AND ORPHANS) so they can build their new sanctuaries and entertainment centers for themselves??? I saw, firsthand, a widow with 3 children not given a dime because the church just did not have a fund set up for that...what a frickin JOKE!!! Jesus said, you will know them by their fruit and if their fruit is rotten, then the whole tree is rotten....who wants to be a part of that?

I've never said that there aren't loving, Godly people in churches....but unlike them, I refuse to compromise Gods standards to go along with the churches worldly standards...and what alarms me the most is that many of these so called Godly people do just that to fit in with the "in crowd". I have plenty of fellowship with fine Christian people and just because it does not occur in a building called a church doesn't mean it isn't edifying and encouraging for us. Some of us "church haters" think it is better to please God than please man....and we have very good and legitimate reasons for leaving Organized Churchianity and all it's trappings.

So please do not lump all of us in one pile with the rest of fallen humanity that does not attend a building called a church just because we refuse to compromise with the world called "Churchianity". When the blind lead the blind, they both fall into a pit. I think I'll stay on the straight and narrow with God and live by His standards and not the standards of people who go to a building called a church on Sunday.
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Old 12-30-2009, 11:04 AM
 
Location: RV Park
7,543 posts, read 11,548,929 times
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The question is "do you have to attend a church to be a Christian?", but the real issue is how many people are looking and ready to receive of the Lord, but can't find that bread of life? The answer is "a multitude without number". There's such a need for His body to be manifested in the earth - and there's a lot of those being prepared out of the spotlight to bring an anointing not seen in churches today...
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Old 12-30-2009, 11:12 AM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,196,917 times
Reputation: 892
Quote:
Originally Posted by ServingHim View Post
I have walked with the Lord for over 33 years. My personal experience with the “organized church haters” is that they are lazy, uncommitted, sin loving people, who want to fill their bellies with liquor, live outside the bonds of holy matrimony, live in other types of deviant sexual relationships (all of which by the way the Bible speaks against), hate their neighbor, steal from their employer, and keep all that God has given them to themselves. The reason why they didn’t like church when they went is because the preacher pointed out something in their lives that was sin (I know – we don’t use that word any more, but God does). I see it all the time in my line of work. People who want to live the way they want to live; they do not want any kind of spiritual authority, they don’t go to church, they don’t read their Bibles, they very seldom pray, and they certainly do not give to anything that will have a spiritual impact on anyone. Many leave the church because they do not want to be held accountable to any Christian standard. But then they go on various forums and spew out their church hating rhetoric, knowing full well that they are not at all what God wants them to be.

They attack the church and anyone who goes to or pastors one. They set themselves up as judge and proclaim that every “organized” church is full of hypocrites; when they themselves have no more right to say that than I would have a right to say that everyone who does not go to church is as I described above.

What alarms me the most about “organized church haters” is that they refuse to see that there are good honest God loving men and women out there, who are part of an “organized” church that loves Jesus and their neighbor, and they are working and giving of their means to help support ministries that reach out in the community and make a difference in people’s lives. They also deny the Book Acts which speaks of all that God did in the early church which involved God’s people gathering for worship, preaching, praying, and most certainly, serving. They shrug off the idea of going to church to be a part of something bigger than themselves. They deny the importance of gathering together with other believers to be edified and encouraged; to pray with and be prayed for when the storms of life come; and they deny the fact that we are all a part of the Body of Christ, and we all have gifts and talents to be used, and everyone has something to do and a place to minister. And if I have to I can give scripture references for all the above mentioned; my advice however would be to look it up and find it out for yourselves...

There is a difference between fellowship and organized religion. The type of worship you are referring to is Babylonian. Its like th synagogue system. All the people sit and listen the pastor teachers preach a sermon and sing songs etc etc. And give offerings. Paul himself was not willing to receive payment for his services rendered in the ministry of the gospel. He was a tent maker.

I think its funny how you charge people who do not go to church with such things. When i went to church during my youth, as my father was a pastor teacher for many many years, i saw more backstabbing and two faced gossiping and sin then i have just about any where else. Self righteous, false piety and sanctimonious behavior ... The last time i went to church is was practically the same thing. So many people who have very little knowledge of things spiritual or scriptural gathering in the hen house.


Perhaps you are not like these others, but something tells me that perhaps you are. Especially the way you slander those who do not practice organized religion.
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Old 12-30-2009, 11:22 AM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,196,917 times
Reputation: 892
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristyGrl View Post
That is the biggest crock of poopie I have ever seen posted on this forum....while there may be some who are as you described....it is not all of us.

The very things you've accused "organized church haters" of are the very things I saw happening in the church, while the pastors just stood by and let it happen...without doing their jobs and putting a stop to it. How many churches actually preach about SIN and how UNACCEPTABLE IT IS????? Not one that I've been to in the last 10 years and I live smack in the bible belt....but there is plenty of that "feel good" message. If they actually preached God standards of living....it would be an empty church because no one wants to hear that. How many churches HORDE the money given to them (WHICH SHOULD BE USED STRICTLY FOR THE POOR, WIDOWS AND ORPHANS) so they can build their new sanctuaries and entertainment centers for themselves??? I saw, firsthand, a widow with 3 children not given a dime because the church just did not have a fund set up for that...what a frickin JOKE!!! Jesus said, you will know them by their fruit and if their fruit is rotten, then the whole tree is rotten....who wants to be a part of that?

I've never said that there aren't loving, Godly people in churches....but unlike them, I refuse to compromise Gods standards to go along with the churches worldly standards...and what alarms me the most is that many of these so called Godly people do just that to fit in with the "in crowd". I have plenty of fellowship with fine Christian people and just because it does not occur in a building called a church doesn't mean it isn't edifying and encouraging for us. Some of us "church haters" think it is better to please God than please man....and we have very good and legitimate reasons for leaving Organized Churchianity and all it's trappings.

So please do not lump all of us in one pile with the rest of fallen humanity that does not attend a building called a church just because we refuse to compromise with the world called "Churchianity". When the blind lead the blind, they both fall into a pit. I think I'll stay on the straight and narrow with God and live by His standards and not the standards of people who go to a building called a church on Sunday.
Another thing i noticed in "organized Church" is that the ones who make the biggest contributions, that is to say the more wealthy laity, are the ones who usualy control the finances and thus the ministry itself. It a big business after all ...
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Old 12-30-2009, 11:33 AM
 
Location: Prattville, Alabama
4,883 posts, read 5,115,922 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776 View Post
Another thing i noticed in "organized Church" is that the ones who make the biggest contributions, that is to say the more wealthy laity, are the ones who usualy control the finances and thus the ministry itself. It a big business after all ...
Ain't that THE TRUTH!!!!
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