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Old 10-23-2009, 06:47 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
No, that is why He was born by means of a virgin birth, so that He could come into the world without a sin nature. ''In the likeness of sinful flesh''. He wasn't absolutely like us, in that He, and He alone was born without a sin nature.
Then he could not be a proper sacrifice... Animals were to be spotless yet not an acceptable sacrifice because it had to be done over and over. Jesus was a sinless man who was of sin nature. He had the same desires as we do...

Heb. 4:15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are--yet was without sin.

He had to desire to sin in some way or he wouldn't have been tempted. Therefore you cannot say he was not of sin nature. The point was that he overcame the sin nature in that he was still sinless.
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Old 10-23-2009, 06:50 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
Jesus is now and will always be fully 100% human.
Now I would not want to say that the 'real" name of Jesus is how I say the word "Jesus", but aside from the different ways to say His name, it is still His name!

The humanity of Jesus is still there with the father in heaven...
Then they are not one and the same... They are still separate. If you say that they are separate forever in heaven then they are separate and can't be one.
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Old 10-23-2009, 06:53 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
They are 3 separate persons.

all are called God
all are equal to each other in nature, and yet have different positions in their relationship to each other.
You aren't saying that though.. you are saying that God is in Jesus in the flesh yet still in the flesh in heaven next to God. That is a different BEING not just a different position!

So there are three gods... I am one with my husband yet we are two people.. I am not my husband. I am separate. These things are clear. God is not three BEINGS.. It is clear that he is ONE GOD, not three.

I could see if you claimed he was back to God in heaven but you don't because you say he is still in the flesh and we will be like that when we reach heaven so are we also God? What makes him God in the flesh in heaven? Because you say so?
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Old 10-23-2009, 07:44 PM
 
3,067 posts, read 3,488,585 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
I know its a feel good thing to suppose that your God died for you,
Yes,,,it is a stunning thing that God did for humans.

God is a God that can't die, yet he found a way to die the same death that we humans die....

That is the very heart of the incarnation...
That God become flesh and died on a cross...that we might live.
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Old 10-23-2009, 07:49 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
you say he is still in the flesh and we will be like that when we reach heaven ...
That is what the Bible teaches...
We will be like him (1 John 3:2 )
Jesus is fully Human.
He died a normal human death.
God rose him from the dead in an everlasting body of flesh and bone.

Some day I too will rise from the dead in the same type of human body.
I too will rise up off the earth as Jesus did, and I too will meet the Lord in the air.

This is the Christian message of the Resurrection.
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Old 10-23-2009, 07:58 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Then they are not one and the same... They are still separate. If you say that they are separate forever in heaven then they are separate and can't be one.
They were never the same person...

John 1:1 - The Word was WITH God remember?

The Son was never the Father.
The Son has the same nature as the father
The son and the Father are equal in their nature, (their nature is the one true God)
But that have been, are now, and will always be separate persons within the united Trinity
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Old 10-23-2009, 08:02 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
You aren't saying that though.. you are saying that God is in Jesus in the flesh yet still in the flesh in heaven next to God.
I believe what i have said is what I have always said...and that would be the following:
That God is the Word.
That the Word became flesh
That the Word died on a cross
That the word rose from the dead in an everlasting body of flesh and bone.
That one day I too will rise in a human body with the same nature as the body Christ has now.

That Jesus is now, and will always be human.
This is why we can call Jesus our "brother" because we share the same human nature.

I cant call "God" my brother because I do not share the nature of God.
But I can call Jesus my brother because he is 100% human.
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Old 10-23-2009, 08:04 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
What makes him God in the flesh ....
The Word became flesh...
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Old 10-24-2009, 05:00 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
The Word became flesh...
I have said it over and over..

Are you having trouble understanding what I am saying or what?

Many people said the earth was flat.. now we know it is round. Many people thought the Sun rose and set.. yet we know that it is the earth that turns....

Yet you are one of those flat earth, sun moving type people still. No matter what I say you don't respond you just spew the same rhetoric as before.

Answer me this if you will..

Did God die on the cross?

Don't separate Jesus from God.. because you say they are one and the same..

Do you believe that God died on the cross?
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Old 10-24-2009, 05:19 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,391,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
They were never the same person...

John 1:1 - The Word was WITH God remember?

The Son was never the Father.
The Son has the same nature as the father
The son and the Father are equal in their nature, (their nature is the one true God)
But that have been, are now, and will always be separate persons within the united Trinity
Well then I think it is safe to say that you worship three Gods.. You say they are separate so there is no other conclusion.

Here is an interesting tidbit for you:
Tyndale's translation of John 1:3-4 reads,
John 1:3,4 - All things were made by it, and without it, was made nothing that was made. In it was life, and the life was the light of men.
As you can see, Tyndale used "it" instead of "him." "It" is a translation of the Greek "autou" meaning he, she, or it. What this tells us is that Tyndale did not read Messiah into the "logos" or "word" of verse 1 and he was not influenced by the Latin Vulgate or Wycliffe. (http://www.torahofmessiah.com/enyjohn134.html)


You and others put Christ in the text when there is no cause at all... If you knew and study the teachings of the Jewish faith you would understand that John would never have understood logos to mean a person.. Logos is the spoken word of God. God spoke the earth into existence, he also spoke his son into existence.


I am also of the nature of God. I am a child of God. Yet I am not GOD! You are the son of God.. yet you are not God. You are trying to explain the WORD of God to me.. you and I both carry the Word of God, yet we are not God!

Think of it this way.. what if you are wrong and you blaspheme the Holy Spirit by worshiping Jesus as God when he is not?

That would be tragic. Don't think you can lay the blame on your teachers either. I have clearly shown there is error in the logic of the trinity, and you are blind to it. You can't even refute it without repeating the same phrases over and over.

See the next post.
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