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Old 11-08-2009, 01:34 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 3,488,995 times
Reputation: 241

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The difference:...
(a true story by Alan, 2009)

4 days ago I was getting dressed for work in my basement laundry room when I noticed the floor was wet.

I considered what the reason might be?
I guessed that the clothes washer might have spilled, or worse yet there might be some type of water line busted.

The next day I again was in the laundry room when I heard a sound of water spraying loudly.
I at first guessed that the water lines running to the back of the washer were disconnected, but after a little checking I noticed that the sound was coming from the other end of the laundry room?

I did not know what to think, so later that night I called an emergency number for a plumber, (oh yes, that was money!money!money!) and he came over to see what was going on.

He had bad news...

He told me that under the cement floor in my basement I had a water leak.
He told me that it would be a ton of money to locate and fix, and that I had to get on this problem right away as it could cause trouble for the whole house if left unfixed for very much longer.

I did not know what to do.

That night I turned off the main water gate, and used a gas saw to cut into the floor where I heard the sound of water the loudest.

Ever cut with a gas saw into a cement floor in a basement?
Good LORD was a mess!

In the morning a had to rent a jack hammer and bust up the floor where I cut it out.

Ever use a jack hammer in a basement?
Good Lord for loud!

I dug out the broken sections and started digging in the clay under the floor.

Ever dig a hole in your basement?
Good Lord what a nightmare!

I found the leak, and I fixed it.
I then turned on the water and to check if everything was fixed now I turned on the clothes washer.
It was then I learned that the sewer drain on my house was plugged and the whole load of water in the washed spilled out onto the floor!

So the problem with the wet floor was totally unconnected to the water leak....(Strange but true it seems.)

So I know where the clean-out to my sewer is in a small room in my basement behind the water heater, and I got a sewer snake to use.
But the spot where I have to work with the snake is 1 foot by one foot, and there is an overhang so I have to squat in this little area to work.

Im working now with the snake, I got raw sewer all over my face and hands, I cant get the snake to make a turn in the pipe, the floor is wet, there is clay all over the carpets, I cant breath, my back is killing me, and the damn phone rings!!!!@$^%^&&**(*(&^%!!!

This is my interpretation of the word "Torment"

I was not being "tortured"
There was no one who knew the trouble I was having that night, There was no one out to cause me any harm.
There was not torturer so there was no one intentionally inflicting pain on me.

But I was in great pain non the less.
My back was killing me, I was miserable!
I could not stand, I could not even craw around after a while as my legs were so cramped up.

So I was truly in great torment.

But there was not any torture.

I was just experiencing the end results of my failing to maintain my sewer I guess...
There is nothing personal from anyone directed at me....

A plugged sewer is indifferent to my sufferings.
So is the everlasting flame in the lake of fire.
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Old 11-08-2009, 01:57 AM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,203,323 times
Reputation: 892
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
The difference:...
(a true story by Alan, 2009)

4 days ago I was getting dressed for work in my basement laundry room when I noticed the floor was wet.

I considered what the reason might be?
I guessed that the clothes washer might have spilled, or worse yet there might be some type of water line busted.

The next day I again was in the laundry room when I heard a sound of water spraying loudly.
I at first guessed that the water lines running to the back of the washer were disconnected, but after a little checking I noticed that the sound was coming from the other end of the laundry room?

I did not know what to think, so later that night I called an emergency number for a plumber, (oh yes, that was money!money!money!) and he came over to see what was going on.

He had bad news...

He told me that under the cement floor in my basement I had a water leak.
He told me that it would be a ton of money to locate and fix, and that I had to get on this problem right away as it could cause trouble for the whole house if left unfixed for very much longer.

I did not know what to do.

That night I turned off the main water gate, and used a gas saw to cut into the floor where I heard the sound of water the loudest.

Ever cut with a gas saw into a cement floor in a basement?
Good LORD was a mess!

In the morning a had to rent a jack hammer and bust up the floor where I cut it out.

Ever use a jack hammer in a basement?
Good Lord for loud!

I dug out the broken sections and started digging in the clay under the floor.

Ever dig a hole in your basement?
Good Lord what a nightmare!

I found the leak, and I fixed it.
I then turned on the water and to check if everything was fixed now I turned on the clothes washer.
It was then I learned that the sewer drain on my house was plugged and the whole load of water in the washed spilled out onto the floor!

So the problem with the wet floor was totally unconnected to the water leak....(Strange but true it seems.)

So I know where the clean-out to my sewer is in a small room in my basement behind the water heater, and I got a sewer snake to use.
But the spot where I have to work with the snake is 1 foot by one foot, and there is an overhang so I have to squat in this little area to work.

Im working now with the snake, I got raw sewer all over my face and hands, I cant get the snake to make a turn in the pipe, the floor is wet, there is clay all over the carpets, I cant breath, my back is killing me, and the damn phone rings!!!!@$^%^&&**(*(&^%!!!

This is my interpretation of the word "Torment"

I was not being "tortured"
There was no one who knew the trouble I was having that night, There was no one out to cause me any harm.
There was not torturer so there was no one intentionally inflicting pain on me.

But I was in great pain non the less.
My back was killing me, I was miserable!
I could not stand, I could not even craw around after a while as my legs were so cramped up.

So I was truly in great torment.

But there was not any torture.

I was just experiencing the end results of my failing to maintain my sewer I guess...
There is nothing personal from anyone directed at me....

A plugged sewer is indifferent to my sufferings.
So is the everlasting flame in the lake of fire.
I see you decided to start a new thread in regard what we were discussing in the "after death" thread ...


This was my response in that thread and remains my response in this thread ...

Quote:
That's a very interesting story ... Very interesting, and i am sorry for your difficulties ... But this has nothing to do with what the bible says about those who are "cast into the lake of fire" ...

Did someone "cast you" into the sewage? No ... Will someone "Cast" these people into the lake of fire according to the bible?

Lets see ...

Rev 20:15
And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Hmm ... Big difference huh? So if you take the lake of fire as a literal form of tormenting/torturing/executing people then these people are forced to be tormented or tortured or executed by being burned alive according to your interpretation of the bible. It doesn't say that they "Jump" into the lake of fire now does it? Whatever the case may be concerning the meaning of the lake of fire, it is clear that these people are being made to suffer it against their will ...

How do i understand the lake of fire? The judgment of the lake of fire is symbolic ... Its for their own Good. So that they can be purified and sanctified and so that they can learn righteousness and be healed thereby ... Will the experience be pleasant? Not by any means ... Will they be better for it in the end? Absolutely ...
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Old 11-08-2009, 02:07 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 3,488,995 times
Reputation: 241
Sewer and fire, are indifferent to humans sufferings.

You get no pity from them
You don't get credit for learning your lesson from them
They don't cut you any slack for time served.

They are without passion.

They don't care that you feel great pain
They are unconcerned with the length of your sufferings
They don't tell time,
Nor are even aware of the passing of time.
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Old 11-08-2009, 02:17 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 3,488,995 times
Reputation: 241
Too many people try to reason with the fire.
They ask:"How can people burn for 100 billion years for the sin of one lifetime of only 65 years?
How can that be seen as fair?"


But as I learned first hand as I struggled with the water leak and the plugged sewer this weekend,
A sewer (as well as the bible's fire) is without compassion for our sufferings.

They don't care that I think of myself as "a good person"
They are unconcerned that they look fair to me.
They don't attempt to justify themselves to me.
They have no anger directed toward me
They have no intent to cause me harm
It's not personal to them.
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Old 11-08-2009, 02:21 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 3,488,995 times
Reputation: 241
You cant ask the sewer or the fire questions
You cant demand an answer from them
You cant request an explanation as to their actions
You cant reason with them
You cant barter with them
You cant make a deal with them
They are unconcerned with your past, present or future
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Old 11-08-2009, 02:23 AM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,203,323 times
Reputation: 892
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
Too many people try to reason with the fire.
They ask:"How can people burn for 100 billion years for the sin of one lifetime of only 65 years?
How can that be seen as fair?"


But as I learned first hand as I struggled with the water leak and the plugged sewer this weekend,
A sewer (as well as the bible's fire) is without compassion for our sufferings.

They don't care that I think of myself as "a good person"
They are unconcerned that they look fair to me.
They don't attempt to justify themselves to me.
They have no anger directed toward me
They have no intent to cause me harm
It's not personal to them.
I don't think you know the first thing about compassion. It is not the fire that casts anyone into itself. It is God, or his angels at his behest. They do not jump in of their own volition. They are thrown in against their will. So they are in effect being tortured by God and his angels if you believe this to be a literal lake of fire where most of Gods creation will suffer for ever, and God is in effect no better than Nebuchadnezzar(indeed infinitely worse) who cast Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego into the fiery furnace for not bowing down and worshiping the graven image of his God, or those people who sacrificed their children to Molech in the valley of Hinnom by burning them alive for that matter. You can try to explain it away however you will, it only proves your self deception.

Last edited by Ironmaw1776; 11-08-2009 at 02:55 AM..
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Old 11-08-2009, 03:09 AM
 
Location: Germany
1,647 posts, read 1,709,256 times
Reputation: 842
if you couldn't bear that torment any longer, you could have blown your head off, why does God not allow the people in the lake of fire to blow their head off? - don't you believe in free will?
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Old 11-08-2009, 03:15 AM
 
Location: Texas
4,346 posts, read 5,570,351 times
Reputation: 843
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad View Post
Sewer and fire, are indifferent to humans sufferings.
You are assuming God would subject humans to the possibility of endless torment at the mercy of an indifferent tormentor and that He would never under any circumstances rescue that person from said torment.

This is a ridiculous assumption.

Glad you are getting your water and waste systems fixed though - very important!
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Old 11-08-2009, 03:28 AM
 
3,067 posts, read 3,488,995 times
Reputation: 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by svenM View Post
if you couldn't bear that torment any longer, you could have blown your head off, why does God not allow the people in the lake of fire to blow their head off? - don't you believe in free will?
guns are not spoken of in the lake of fire,
My guess is that they would prove to be to dangerous...what with mixing gun power and all the red hot fire...
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