Originally Posted by lucknow
I don'r really care what Robbins has to say about Sproul. I will let Sproul speak for himself. I don't agree with everything RC teaches either. A totally wrong way to understand the bible is to take one word and use it to try to disprove what the mass of scripture is clearly teaching. In absolutely no way does a limited atonement limit limit the power of God. Nor do they in any way deny the gospel. I will issue a challenge to you. You list the scriptures that clearly teach that atonement is unlimited, there for all to accept or reject out of their human will and I will list the scriptures that very clearly prove that the atonment of Christ is always effectual because it's applied to His people. A people that God CHOOSE before the foundation of the world. I will not have any trouble finding them because they are there in black and white by the hundreds. I'll put this up against one word that is midunderstood any time.
Actually, like you, I'm not concerned what Robbin's has to say about Sproul. You spoke highly of Sproul, so I thought you would like to read an article on how he defines "faith". I'm glad you and I both agree that Sproul's faith is not necessarily faith in the Gospel
. I'm also not challenging you to agree with me on the atonement. But you've asked, so here are my thoughts.
All of the scriptures that speak of the atonement being for a select group are true, and there are many, as you've said. But the truth of that fact does not limit, or diminish the other groups, or take away from the truth of the other groups also being included. For example: The scriptures speak of Christ as being the Savior of Israel:
Act 13:23 Of the seed of this one, according to promise, God raised up to Israel a Savior, Jesus;
But what about the Greeks? Yes, Greeks too:
Act 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue on every sabbath persuading both Jews and Greeks.
But what about other nations? Yes, those too, even to the ends of the earth:
Act 13:47 For so the Lord has commanded us, "I have set You for a Light of nations, that You be for salvation to the end of the earth."
Reformed theology teaches that only some individuals, out of those groups, will be saved. I believe scripture says otherwise. The following scriptures will illustrate who, among those groups, will be saved.
1Ti 2:4 who desires all
men to be saved and to come to a full knowledge of truth.
1Ti 2:6 the One having given Himself a ransom on behalf of all
, the testimony to be given in its own time,
Rom 5:18 So then, as through one deviation it was toward all
men to condemnation, so also through one righteous act toward all
men to justification of life.
Rom 5:19 For as through the one man's disobedience the many
were constituted sinners, so also through the obedience of the One the many
shall be constituted righteous.
1Co 15:22 for as in Adam all
die, so also in Christ all
will be made alive.
1Co 15:23 But each in his own order: Christ, the firstfruit; afterward those of Christ at His coming.
1Co 15:24 Then is the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God, even the Father, when He makes to cease all rule and all authority and power.
Col 1:20 and through Him making peace by the blood of His cross, to reconcile all
things to Himself; through Him, whether the things on the earth, or the things in the heavens.
And there are many more, but those should serve as an example.
If those scriptures actually mean "some", or something out of those groups, why use the term all? There is a Greek word meaning "some" or something. It's used here in our translations:
Rom 3:3 For what if some
did not believe? Will not their unbelief nullify the faith of God?
Rom 3:4 Let it not be! But let God be true, and every man a liar; even as it has been written, "That You should be justified in Your words, and will overcome in Your being judged."
But even those "some", in disobedience (unbelief) obtain mercy, that God may show mercy to all:
Rom 11:30 For as you then also disobeyed God, but now have obtained mercy by the disobedience of these,
Rom 11:31 so also these now have disobeyed, so that they also may obtain mercy by your mercy.
Rom 11:32 For God shut up all into disobedience, that He may show mercy to all
And why is this?
Rom 11:36 Because of Him, and through Him, and to Him are all
things. To Him be the glory forever! Amen.
No one is saved by their own will or desire, but rather Gods:
Joh 1:13 who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but were born of God.
If you feel strongly that I'm wrong, then by all means, proclaim a limited atonement. For me, I'll take the gospel to the world, as Jesus said:
Mar 16:15 And He said to them, Going into all the world, preach the gospel to all the creation.
And the reason I can do so, without reservation, is because I believe it is applicable to all:
1Ti 1:15 Faithful is the Word and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief.
Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation to everyone believing, both to Jew first, and to Greek;
Anyway, it's what I believe
. If we should disagree on this, than carry on. We're both laborers for Christ, are we not?