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I feel sorry for you guys. I am sorry that the idea that most of creation suffering for ever makes you feel good. It is very telling if your spiritual disposition, and you are completely unaware of it. I love you anyways ...
You have proven nothing but your own desire to deny others the gift of salvation, and that a few early Christians and most pagans in the the times of the apostles and early church agreed with you on the matter. I have proven that the vast majority of the early church fathers and the early church seminaries taught universal reconciliation/apocatastasis. You have done nothing to debunk this fact.
May God have mercy on us all, because it is obvious most humans(especially Christians) don't have it in their hearts to be merciful on others who disagree with their belief system. Good night ...
Here is what you said in the thread 'Here is What the Word Apolumi-Destroy; Means' in Post # 130.
quote It is the doctrine of eternal torment that is the apostate doctrine which was created by the pagan Roman church three hundred years after Christianity had become institutionalized by the Roman state. These are the facts, and what you have been taught about eternal torment is a pagan fable derived first from Egypt, then adopted by the pagan Romans, and then introduced finally into Christianity more than half a millennium after the death of Christ.
These are the facts
unquote
Now, every single one of the early church fathers listed, none later than about 185 A.D. wrote that the unbeliever goes into:
Eternal punishment; everlasting punishment; endless duration: Justin Martyr who makes it plain that he meant eternal as opposed to temporary as Plato had claimed. (First Apology of Justin, Chap. VIII. [about 150 A.D.])
Everlasting fire; be damned forever: Irenaeus of Lyons (Against Heresies, 4:28:2, [about 189 A.D.])
Depart into unquenchable fire: Ignatius of Antioch, (Letter to the Ephesians 16:1-2. [110 A.D.])
What you correctly refer to as eternal torment, is what is taught by these church fathers of the first and second centuries. Long before the half millennium that you claimed, and has been quoted above. Do you deny this? Or do you wish to acknowledge your error?
You can see that it was a typo, if i said that it was Egyptian then roman and then made Christian orthodoxy i didn't mean to say they created it. That would be contradicting myself in the same sentence... So excuse my error, there is you victory, however hollow it is ...
I am tired of arguing with all you people right now. Your all monsters and your false religion is monstrous. May God have mercy on us all ...
I feel sorry for you guys. I am sorry that the idea that most of creation suffering for ever makes you feel good. It is very telling if your spiritual disposition, and you are completely unaware of it. I love you anyways ...
You have proven nothing but your own desire to deny others the gift of salvation, and that a few early Christians and most pagans in the the times of the apostles and early church agreed with you on the matter. I have proven that the vast majority of the early church fathers and the early church seminaries taught universal reconciliation/apocatastasis. You have done nothing to debunk this fact.
May God have mercy on us all, because it is obvious most humans(especially Christians) don't have it in their hearts to be merciful on others who disagree with their belief system. Good night ...
Selah ...
You hypocrite. It is the likes of you who would lure those who are in need of salvation, into the false sense of security that they will be saved regardless of whether they make the choice to believe in Christ or not. And in so doing, some may not make the all important decision, and thereby be lost.
You make the absurd statement, that by warning others of the need to believe in Christ for salvation, that I have a desire to deny others salvation. This is the kind of twisted logic that the universalist employs.
And all you can do in your pathetic effort to defend your position is to do what the universalist does so well. Deny and ignore the facts, twist and distort those same facts, and then pretend that you have proven your position.
To new readers of this thread, make sure to read Post #1 to see that the early church did not teach universal salvation, but rather, they taught the correct Biblical view of eternal condemnation for those who do not believe in Christ.
You hypocrite. It is the likes of you who would lure those who are in need of salvation, into the false sense of security that they will be saved regardless of whether they make the choice to believe in Christ or not. And in so doing, some may not make the all important decision, and thereby be lost.
You make the absurd statement, that by warning others of the need to believe in Christ for salvation, that I have a desire to deny others salvation. This is the kind of twisted logic that the universalist employs.
And all you can do in your pathetic effort to defend your position is to do what the universalist does so well. Deny and ignore the facts, twist and distort those same facts, and then pretend that you have proven your position.
To new readers of this thread, make sure to read Post #1 to see that the early church did not teach universal salvation, but rather, they taught the correct Biblical view of eternal condemnation for those who do not believe in Christ.
Now I know you aren't to familiar with logic or realizations that go against what you are taught... but just grit your teeth and watch this short film....
And all you can do in your pathetic effort to defend your position is to do what the universalist does so well. Deny and ignore the facts, twist and distort those same facts, and then pretend that you have proven your position.
Your position is the least defensible of all presented in this forum. Not only do you profess the existence of a horrendous eternal punishment for what is done in this paltry life of less than 100+ years . . . but you also profess that it is because of an ego-problem that Jesus has for anyone who won't acknowledge Him. Talk about unjust and petty . . . how can anyone profess to believe or care at all about such a psychologically weak and petty God.
Fortunately God is NOT remotely like that. God is Love and merciful and wants us ALL to join Him as successful Spirits after our rebirth at death. Those who fail to make the cut (not enough love or too much hate and evil) will have to get rehabilitated first . . . but we ALL will be with God eventually.
Last edited by MysticPhD; 11-16-2009 at 10:57 PM..
Now I know you aren't to familiar with logic or realizations that go against what you are taught... but just grit your teeth and watch this short film....
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I think Eusebius clammed up.....since I showed his idol of a man was in fact......a preterist!