Mother’s milk, and Father’s meat (doctrine, believe, dogma)

[ScarletWren]

Yep, it's a good thing we aren't burned any more for seeing things differently.

[spm62]

Originally Posted by Alpha8207

Many people here claiming to be Christians believe they've received special enlightenment that has elevated them and their "knowledge" above what God's Word says about matters (they are really Gnostics). If what they are saying, teaching, and professing is counter to what God's Word says, they are liars. And they are a perfect example of the dangers associated with the arrogant idea held forth in the OP.

"Did God really say......?"

Yes, He did!

But that is the point for me. You,alpha,personally believe that your beliefs line up with scripture. You would say that others who disagree with your interpretations are not christians. Others will say their interpretations line up with scripture and yours do not.
So you label others that disagree with you with this name or that name, and of course those that hold the same view as you will pat you on the back and say you are so right,etc. etc. But when you start accusing others of not having the truth then you are walking a fine line. Because others who read the bible and pray daily turn around and say you don`t have the truth and you are blinded. You spout out a few scriptures that seem,on the surface to support your view. The others spout out a few scriptures that seem to support their view. You call them deceived. They call you deceived. You think you have spiritual enlightenment.They think they have spiritual enlightenment. You say they are arrogant,they say you are arrogant.
So when you accuse them of saying they have special knowledge above what God`s word says on matters,what you are really saying is what you believe or have been taught God`s word says about certain matters. You will disagree and then give a few scriptures and then so will they and the whole circle starts all over again. You accuse them of being liars because YOU BELIEVE what they are teaching and saying is contrary to the word of God. But it is only contrary to your level of understanding of the word of God. I`m sure there are probably some things you believe to be true now,that maybe 5 years ago you felt differently. So be careful about calling people liars and saying they don`t have the truth. Truth ,when it comes to spiritual things,could be a hard thing to grasp and think you have a handle on.
You do the exact same thing you accuse others of. You think you and other church goers like yourself have the handle on the truth. You think you have been enlightened. You think you understand about the sprititual things. You think you are so sure about what God means in this verse or that verse. You think you are qualified to say who is a christian and who isn`t,but it `s all based on your own personal interpretation of God`s word that you believe gives you the right to condemn others. But when others believe the same thing about themselves and say you are the one who is actually deceived,then you say they are arrogant, liars, and not christian.

[Alpha8207]

Originally Posted by spm62

But that is the point for me. You,alpha,personally believe that your beliefs line up with scripture. You would say that others who disagree with your interpretations are not christians. Others will say their interpretations line up with scripture and yours do not.
So you label others that disagree with you with this name or that name, and of course those that hold the same view as you will pat you on the back and say you are so right,etc. etc. But when you start accusing others of not having the truth then you are walking a fine line. Because others who read the bible and pray daily turn around and say you don`t have the truth and you are blinded. You spout out a few scriptures that seem,on the surface to support your view. The others spout out a few scriptures that seem to support their view. You call them deceived. They call you deceived. You think you have spiritual enlightenment.They think they have spiritual enlightenment. You say they are arrogant,they say you are arrogant.
So when you accuse them of saying they have special knowledge above what God`s word says on matters,what you are really saying is what you believe or have been taught God`s word says about certain matters. You will disagree and then give a few scriptures and then so will they and the whole circle starts all over again. You accuse them of being liars because YOU BELIEVE what they are teaching and saying is contrary to the word of God. But it is only contrary to your level of understanding of the word of God. I`m sure there are probably some things you believe to be true now,that maybe 5 years ago you felt differently. So be careful about calling people liars and saying they don`t have the truth. Truth ,when it comes to spiritual things,could be a hard thing to grasp and think you have a handle on.
You do the exact same thing you accuse others of. You think you and other church goers like yourself have the handle on the truth. You think you have been enlightened. You think you understand about the sprititual things. You think you are so sure about what God means in this verse or that verse. You think you are qualified to say who is a christian and who isn`t,but it `s all based on your own personal interpretation of God`s word that you believe gives you the right to condemn others. But when others believe the same thing about themselves and say you are the one who is actually deceived,then you say they are arrogant, liars, and not christian.

Maybe. But I've found that folks who may have a different interpretation than I do usually agree on most. However, mystics, gnostics, and universalists discredit the bible in general. They say it can't be trusted. Isn't infallible. Isn't reliable. Is derived as a way to control people instead of show people the way back to God.

I haven't once in this thread asked anyone to believe MY interpretation of the scriptures. I have asked them to believe the scriptures though....and there's a difference.

In other words, there is no scripture I am aware of that encourages what the OP suggests. There are multiple ones that warn of it.

So don't believe Alpha's words....but please believe God's.

[little elmer]

Originally Posted by Alpha8207

universalists discredit the bible in general. They say it can't be trusted. Isn't infallible. Isn't reliable.

Try me - I interpret it spiritually where you see it naturally.

[little elmer]

Miss Blue and June - we love you dearly for your patience! I believe this thread has merit as to the differences we "share", and may help explain our journeys.

Please put the safety on.

http://ts4.mm.bing.net/images/thumbnail.aspx?q=1387839235287&id=4140475c5bf75a87 855c0a198c497d04&url=http%3a%2f%2fsite.airgundepot .com%2fimages%2fRandy%2ftriggerguardsafety.jpg (broken link)

[spm62]

Originally Posted by Alpha8207

Maybe. But I've found that folks who may have a different interpretation than I do usually agree on most. However, mystics, gnostics, and universalists discredit the bible in general. They say it can't be trusted. Isn't infallible. Isn't reliable. Is derived as a way to control people instead of show people the way back to God.

See, this is exactly what I mean. You start out saying universalist discredit the bible. This is nothing but a load of bunk. What you really mean is, they don`t believe it to mean what I do. You,as a christian, can accuse people of whatever you want. You,as a christian, can label them howevever you want. But it always comes back to, they don`t believe as you do, so they are wrong.They don`t interpret a scripture the way you do so they are this(insert name) or they are that(insert label) or they aren`t christian..blah blah blah. I coming to believe fundamentilist christianity is more cultish than I ever realized. They don`t hold the same view we do so lets call them names,put lables on them,and say they are going to be tortured and burned alive.

I haven't once in this thread asked anyone to believe MY interpretation of the scriptures. I have asked them to believe the scriptures though....and there's a difference.

Again,you`re making my point. Christian unversalist do believe the scriptures. Again, what you really mean is, they don`t believe your interpretation of it. That`s what it always comes back to no matter how much you try say it doesn`t.

In other words, there is no scripture I am aware of that encourages what the OP suggests. There are multiple ones that warn of it.

So don't believe Alpha's words....but please believe God's.

I do. I would also suggest that you stop following man and start following God. See how we always come back full circle?

[Alpha8207]

Originally Posted by spm62

See, this is exactly what I mean. You start out saying universalist discredit the bible. This is nothing but a load of bunk. What you really mean is, they don`t believe it to mean what I do. You,as a christian, can accuse people of whatever you want. You,as a christian, can label them howevever you want. But it always comes back to, they don`t believe as you do, so they are wrong.They don`t interpret a scripture the way you do so they are this(insert name) or they are that(insert label) or they aren`t christian..blah blah blah. I coming to believe fundamentilist christianity is more cultish than I ever realized. They don`t hold the same view we do so lets call them names,put lables on them,and say they are going to be tortured and burned alive.

Again,you`re making my point. Christian unversalist do believe the scriptures. Again, what you really mean is, they don`t believe your interpretation of it. That`s what it always comes back to no matter how much you try say it doesn`t.


I do. I would also suggest that you stop following man and start following God. See how we always come back full circle?

I've had many conversations on this board with many Universalists (by the way, ChristyGrl is one and she's done exactly what I'm talking about in this thread). Inevitably the conversation always comes back to the reliability of the scriptures. It doesn't bother me that you think I'm doing the same thing. I can tell you that I am doing all I can to hear God's calling on and in my life. I have considered whether I was right or wrong on many issues (particularly Universalism) and am confident that my beliefs (on Universalism) are accurate.

And if I'm wrong, God wants me to be wrong, right? Because Universalists don't believe I have free will anyway.....so take it up with God.

[Cyber Munchkin]

Originally Posted by little elmer

Try me - I interpret it spiritually where you see it naturally.

.....

Hmmmm....and we know the spirit that tries to stand on the same level of the throne of God....
He always comes as the light and sooner or later the dead give away is "self-righteousness" ....the delusion of pride, masquerading around, puffed up in "self" to be more enlighten and spiritual then others!!!

[little elmer]

Originally Posted by Latte'Chic

.....

Hmmmm....and we know the spirit that tries to stand on the same level of the throne of God....
He always comes as the light and sooner or later the dead give away is "self-righteousness" ....the delusion of pride, masquerading around, puffed up, in self to be more enlighten and spiritual then others!!!

I'm nothing, and He is everything - how's that for self righteousness?

[Cyber Munchkin]

Originally Posted by little elmer

I'm nothing, and He is everything - how's that for self righteousness?

Hmmmm......
Well apparently you think you are something by the statement that YOU made below in your reply to Alpha....shows the very spirit of self-righteousness...

Originally Posted by little elmer
Try me - I interpret it spiritually where you see it naturally.