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Old 12-19-2009, 08:58 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,430 posts, read 7,850,376 times
Reputation: 1680

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What part of the question are people misunderstanding. Christy asked for the scripture that states a person MUST BELIEVE that Jesus is God.

Everyone has presented interesting and entertaining scripture about Jesus being God but none where it states a person must believe in Jesus being God.

Even given the point that Jesus is God... where does it say we must believe that as an essential tenet of faith? It doesn't from what I have read.

So now we have come to stating that the God we worship, of which Jesus is not part, is not the same as the Christian God who is also Jesus.

I can only shake my head.

I think the point of the thread was to show that whether Jesus is God or not God, this is not an essential to being saved or being "Christian." At least as shown in scripture it is not an important part of the Gospel.

 
Old 12-19-2009, 08:59 PM
 
2,945 posts, read 4,555,924 times
Reputation: 1597
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
Obviously, you have not once looked at the texts in question, or for that matter 1 Cor 15, and understood in harmony with all the ROD scriptures, just what it entails.



Why so? You re still in denial, so therefore it is evident it still needs to be continued.



Which has been answered over and over again. let me be blunt again with you SPM, if you deny Christ as deity, then you deny God, because God was manifest in flesh, and denying Him, is denying God, so therefore you cannot be a true Christian. What is so difficult here?



It sounds like yours has deeply...can't stand being corrected I see...multiple times from multiple peoples.....wanting to censor the word of God I see? Christy never won anything...neither did I, but Christ did. He took all the glory here...and your Arianism didn't. Take that to the bank...LOL



Name calling?....you mean being not Christian or uneducated...this is the truth and character analysis based on their posts, as I have showed you and others time and time again. Either learn a little here, or sit down in your student chair. Whichever you prefer.

But it is clear, that you, and everyone else that cannot exegete the scripture properly have failed so in doing just that miserably. Take a greek class...yes you SPM....and everyone else, YOU ARE OUT OF YOUR LEAGUE here when it comes to the study of the greek tenses...as we have seen time and time again...mind you..this isn't name calling...it is stating a fact based on the observation of all here to see. The witnesses have spoken, I being one of them.



Deal with it...I am here to stay. To correct your erred paradigm with the correct and proper ways to exegete the scripture. Sit down and listen up...and learn if you have ears that want to hear...oh but wait, you don't, because your plea for ignorance has shined ever so presently through this thread....Good Grief....BLAH BLAH BLAH SPM.

Remember...I said the Kiddie Gloves were off with you people...now its time for strict lessons in the scripture...put me on ignore, if you want to remain oblivious to the truth behind the language. Suit your self, but if you want to debate with me, be prepared which field you are embarking on, because I have plenty more experience than you ever had.

It's called believing that Christ is God. Fullness in deity, and one with the Father...face to face, before time, and after.

Buy a couple of books on Greeek syntax, read them, spend a year on them...or how about 2, then get back to the debates here, otherwise...stay in your little corner of New Age, and chat away how God is going to save everyone from the fire post mortem, when they rejected the gospel prior to death.

Good grief. Take a Greek class. This above from SPM is what happens when they have realized they are wrong, and they get caught in a corner and cry for relief from their errors. They cry for censorship so that their paradigm gets the upper hand, but you must remember, Christ is on my side here as well as everyone else that supports Him, as I have proved His deity over and over again with the help of all my brothers and sisters here, and the necessity of that belief to be a part of His church.


End of story.
Your frustration is showing more and more. You couldn`t answer the question, so lets move on. I don`t understand your rhetoric about crying for relief and such other immature nonsense. But you couldn`t answer christy`s question.Your frustrated and probably a little embarrassed that you couldn`t. You`ve resorted to immature name calling and several peolple have called you on it. So let`s move on before you get even worse. That`s all I`m saying.
 
Old 12-19-2009, 11:50 PM
 
Location: Flower Mound, Texas
1,837 posts, read 3,436,278 times
Reputation: 564
Yes, I have the third witness that Post number 5 was the answer to her question. I just don't understand what the problem here is? Except to continue with an argument.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
That is two of us that have pointed that out...Do we have a third witness?
 
Old 12-19-2009, 11:59 PM
 
Location: Flower Mound, Texas
1,837 posts, read 3,436,278 times
Reputation: 564
IF JESUS IS NOT GOD THAN EXPLAIN TO ME HOW HE COULD HAVE BEEN CRUCIFIED AND RAISED AGAIN FROM THE DEAD? DOES CHRISTY THEN BELIEVE THAT CHRIST IS JUST A MERE MAN? HOW CAN A MAN SAVE MANKIND? THAT JUST DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE TO ME. THE ANSWER IS ALL THROUGH OUT THE BIBLE AND IT IS JUST PLAIN COMMON SENSE THAT JESUS IS GOD AND THAT THE ANSWER IS IN POST NUMBER 5. ALSO JOHN 14:10 CLEARLY IMPLIES THAT JESUS AND THE FATHER ARE ONE. PLEASE PEOPLE READ YOUR BIBLES AND ASK GOD FOR A REVELATION. THIS DISCUSSION IS GETTING OLD.

Nobody is misunderstand the question but the OP is not understanding the answer which is in many scriptures.


Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
What part of the question are people misunderstanding. Christy asked for the scripture that states a person MUST BELIEVE that Jesus is God.

Everyone has presented interesting and entertaining scripture about Jesus being God but none where it states a person must believe in Jesus being God.

Even given the point that Jesus is God... where does it say we must believe that as an essential tenet of faith? It doesn't from what I have read.

So now we have come to stating that the God we worship, of which Jesus is not part, is not the same as the Christian God who is also Jesus.

I can only shake my head.

I think the point of the thread was to show that whether Jesus is God or not God, this is not an essential to being saved or being "Christian." At least as shown in scripture it is not an important part of the Gospel.
 
Old 12-20-2009, 12:15 AM
 
3,553 posts, read 4,168,034 times
Reputation: 579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raelyn28 View Post
IF JESUS IS NOT GOD THAN EXPLAIN TO ME HOW HE COULD HAVE BEEN CRUCIFIED AND RAISED AGAIN FROM THE DEAD? DOES CHRISTY THEN BELIEVE THAT CHRIST IS JUST A MERE MAN? HOW CAN A MAN SAVE MANKIND? THAT JUST DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE TO ME. THE ANSWER IS ALL THROUGH OUT THE BIBLE AND IT IS JUST PLAIN COMMON SENSE THAT JESUS IS GOD AND THAT THE ANSWER IS IN POST NUMBER 5. ALSO JOHN 14:10 CLEARLY IMPLIES THAT JESUS AND THE FATHER ARE ONE. PLEASE PEOPLE READ YOUR BIBLES AND ASK GOD FOR A REVELATION. THIS DISCUSSION IS GETTING OLD.

Nobody is misunderstand the question but the OP is not understanding the answer which is in many scriptures.
Caplock ftl.

I would ask you if Jesus IS God how COULD HE HAVE BEEN CRUCIFIED AND RAISED FROM THE DEAD?

CAN GOD DIE?
 
Old 12-20-2009, 12:51 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,295 posts, read 4,995,798 times
Reputation: 420
Quote:
I think the point of the thread was to show that whether Jesus is God or not God, this is not an essential to being saved or being "Christian." At least as shown in scripture it is not an important part of the Gospel.

I have..with John 1...deal with it, or not....but the study I presented is in line with the language and text. Deal with it...or not, but you, and everyone else that questions His deity, is wrong.

If you believe that Christ is not God, then you deny God, because in John 1, and many others, God is presented as manifesting into the flesh, therefore He is God...rejecting that, determines you a Non Christian, because you deny not only Christ, but God. Simple as that.

Geesh...Arianists...get a grip...you are all wrong.

Last edited by sciotamicks; 12-20-2009 at 12:53 AM.. Reason: typo
 
Old 12-20-2009, 01:34 AM
 
Location: Flower Mound, Texas
1,837 posts, read 3,436,278 times
Reputation: 564
Jesus was God/Man born of the virgin Mary...Hello how did Mary have a child if it wasn't God that created Jesus or part of Himself.. So Jesus did die in the flesh but the Spirit of God which was also Jesus lived... What is so hard about this? Is the glass half full or half empty...both.

And as far as your question, CAN GOD DIE. He can do anything that He wants because He is God... Read Job. How can you question what God can and cannot do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HotinAZ View Post
Caplock ftl.

I would ask you if Jesus IS God how COULD HE HAVE BEEN CRUCIFIED AND RAISED FROM THE DEAD?

CAN GOD DIE?
 
Old 12-20-2009, 01:57 AM
 
2,945 posts, read 4,555,924 times
Reputation: 1597
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
What part of the question are people misunderstanding. Christy asked for the scripture that states a person MUST BELIEVE that Jesus is God.

Everyone has presented interesting and entertaining scripture about Jesus being God but none where it states a person must believe in Jesus being God.

Even given the point that Jesus is God... where does it say we must believe that as an essential tenet of faith? It doesn't from what I have read.

So now we have come to stating that the God we worship, of which Jesus is not part, is not the same as the Christian God who is also Jesus.

I can only shake my head.

I think the point of the thread was to show that whether Jesus is God or not God, this is not an essential to being saved or being "Christian." At least as shown in scripture it is not an important part of the Gospel.
Exactly. A lot of scripture was given,but none that point blank says what she asked. This has turned into whether Jesus is deity or not. It`s obvious nobody`s mind is being changed. We`ve taken this as far as it can go. The only thing left is people saying others are blind because they don`t see the others point of view. Or others saying please read your bible.. as if noone here reads the bible. It`s just another way of saying,you must not be reading your bible if you don`t agree with my interpretation. That kind of talk always leads down the wrong road because of what it is implying... which is usually always the case, I might add.
What people need to understand is, there is ALWAYS going to be disagreement about scripture..ALWAYS!! Acting as if others don`t read their bibles or calling others names,etc becasue they don`t see it the way you do does not solve anything. Just agree to disagree and move on.Why the mods don`t shut down this thread is beyond me.
 
Old 12-20-2009, 02:20 AM
 
3,448 posts, read 2,391,628 times
Reputation: 478
Having a absolutely drenched bible guy brother ...I have easily come to the conclusion that the question....Where does it say you have to believe that Jesus is God ? is a question that relative to God himself would rather see the followers
spend time on works of charity. So, thats my answer, I think there are so many
independant Bible preachers that they read, read, and then wave their fist at you.
It always comes with a wave of the fist and the mentioned Divinity Of Christ which probably and I believe true, isn't the point of the message. The message is
try to get along, and help one another.
 
Old 12-20-2009, 02:53 AM
 
Location: Florida
594 posts, read 659,966 times
Reputation: 266
Default Belief that Jesus is God is mandatory to be a Christian?

Naturally you will always get an indirect answer as God didn't have his men
transcriptionists to define A christian in the first place. He did say unless
one believes on His son he/she is "not" a "child of God" The later category
given to all mankind by secular society. The Jesus is God senario obvious-
ly ties into the triune concept of God (or three manifestations of God being co-equal yet ONE) Religion has their take,evangelicals theirs and
spirit fill fellowships theirs ,but remarkably these entities are on the same
page in recognizing Jesus as God ( inspite of role differences). There are
too many references of God (OT) Jesus (NT) and apostals (NT) that ack-
nowledges Jesus as God not withstanding the Word(God) was made flesh
(Jesus)
John 17:11 " Holy Father protect them by the power of you name the name you gave me so that they may be as one as we are one". Titus 2:13 " While we wait for the blessed hope the glorious appearance of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ". " If you have seen
me you have seen the Father". So we see a consensus among our chritian religions and fellowships that are all on the same page. Anything
to the contrary who make a person suspect of being a spiritualist or person "seeking truth" a unbeliever.
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