U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
 
Old 12-22-2009, 08:13 AM
 
Location: Florida
30 posts, read 43,332 times
Reputation: 31

Advertisements

THE NATURE OF CHRIST
"We know that, when He appears, we shall be like Him, because we shall see His just as He is" [1 John 3:2]. Christ now, while He is at the right hand of God in Heaven has a spiritual body and this is how we will see Him when He returns. Not the nature He had when He had for about 33 years when He was in the image of Adam (an earthly body as Adam), but the nature He has now while He is at the right hand of God in Heaven. What Christ is like now is what He will be like "when He appears." The body He now has and will have at that time is basis to understand what we shall be after the resurrection.
THE NATURE OF CHRIST BEFORE HE BECAME FLESH, the God who made all things and us.
"Then God said, 'Let Us make man in Our image" [Genesis 1:26].
"IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD [CHRIST], AND THE WORD [CHRIST] WAS WITH GOD, AND THE WORD [CHRIST] WAS GOD. HE [CHRIST] WAS IN THE BEGINNING WITH GOD. ALL THINGS CAME INTO BEING BY HIM [CHRIST], AND APART FROM HIM [CHRIST] NOTHING CAME INTO BEING THAT HAS COME INTO BEING. IN HIM [CHRIST] WAS LIFE, AND THE LIFE WAS THE LIGHT OF MEN...HE [CHRIST] WAS IN THE WORLD AND THE WORLD WAS MADE THROUGH HIM [CHRIST]...AND THE WORD [CHRIST] BECAME FLESH, AND DWELLED AMONG US" [JOHN 1:1-14].
John states three facts in such a simple way that a child could understand them.
(1) "In the beginning was the Word" [John 1:14; 1 John 1:1; Revelation 19:3].
(2) "And the Word was with God"
(3) "And the Word was God."
Then he restates it so that no one could misunderstand what he had said.
(4) "The same was in the beginning with God"
(5) "All things were made through him"
(6) "And without him was not anything made that has been made." "For God did not SEND THE SON INTO THE WORLD to judge the world, but that the world should be saved through Him" [John 3:17]. "FOR I HAVE COME DOWN FROM HEAVEN, not to do My own will, but the will of HIM WHO SENT ME" [John 6:38].
"AND THE WORD BECAME FLESH, AND DWELLED AMONG US" [John 1:14].
"Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily I say unto you, BEFORE ABRAHAM WAS BORN, I AM" [John 8:58]. In John 8 Jesus claims to be one with God about 12 times.
"Christ: for in him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily" [Colossians 2:9].
"For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that you through his poverty might become rich" [2 Corinthians 8:9]
"Not that any man has seen the Father, ACCEPT THE ONE WHO IS FROM GOD; HE HAS SEEN THE FATHER" [John 6:46]. If, as some PreMillennialist teaches that Jesus did not exist before His birth, He had not seen the Father. If PreMillennialist were right, that Jesus did not exist before His birth, then Jesus lied.
"And no one has ascended into heaven, BUT HE THAT DESCENDED OUT OF HEAVEN, even the Son of man" [John 3:13].
"Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into His hands, AND THAT HE CAME FORTH FROM GOD, AND WAS GOING BACK TO GOD" [John 13:3].
"And have believed that I CAME FORTH FROM THE FATHER. I CAME FORTH FROM THE FATHER, AND HAVE COME INTO THE WORLD; I AM LEAVING THE WORLD AGAIN, AND GOING TO THE FATHER" [John 16:27-28].
"For this cause; therefore, the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only brake the Sabbath, but also called God his own father, MAKING HIMSELF EQUAL WITH GOD" [John 5:18].
"Who, existing in the form of God, counted not the BEING ON AN EQUALITY WITH GOD a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, taking the form of a servant" [Philippians 2:6-7].
"When the fullness of time came, God sent forth his Son, born of a woman" [Galatians 4:4].
See Matthew 1:19-25; 20:28; Luke 1:26-38; 19:10.
This proves beyond any doubt that Christ preexisted with the Father in Heaven before He came to earth, in the same form and equal with the Father.
His claim to being equal with God was even acknowledged by His enemies, but they called it blasphemy [John 5:17; 5:18; 8:58-59; 10:33-36]. If, as some PreMillennialist tells us that Christ did not exist unto His birth, it would have been blasphemy and a sin to make Himself equal with God. Therefore, if He did not exist before His birth, He did blaspheme and He was a sinner just as we are and His death did not save us from our sins. But, some PreMillennialist tells us that Christ did not exist unto His birth!!! Is there anyway God's word could say "the word" preexisted that they would believe? "The word" existed before time began.
1. "And now, glorify Me together with Yourself, Father, with the glory WHICH I HAD WITH YOU BEFORE THE WORLD WAS" [John 17:5]. Christ existed with God before the world was made, long before He became a man.
2. And again Christ says, "I am the Alpha and the Omega, says the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, THE ALMIGHTY" [Revelation 1:8]. Jesus clearly says He is "THE ALMIGHTY."
3. "For by Him [Christ] all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers and authorities--all thing have been created by Him and for Him. AND HE IS BEFORE ALL THING, and in Him all things hold together" [Colossians 1:16-17]. Jesus Christ is the Creator of the universe. Three things are here stated.
(1) "For in Him were all things created"
All things "in the havens and upon the earth"
"Things visible and thing invisible"
"Whether thrones or dominions or principalities or power"
"All things have been created through Him, and for Him"
(2) "And He is before all things"
(3) "And in Him all things hold together"
Christ said, "I AND THE FATHER ARE ONE. The Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, 'Many good works have I showed you from the Father; for which of those works do you stone Me'? The Jews answered him, 'For a good work we stone you not, but for blasphemy; and because that you, being a man, MAKE YOURSELF GOD'" [John 10:30-33]. If Christ is not God, He is an impostor and a liar. The Jews did not understand Christ to be saying He was God's chosen one, as many PreMillennialist say. Without any doubt, they understood Him to be saying He was God.
"A virgin shall conceive and bear a son and shall call his name IMMANUEL" [Isaiah 7:14]. Immanuel means "God with us." Matthew says, "Now all this is come to pass, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophet, saying, Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Immanuel: which is, being interpreted, God with us" [Matthew 1:22-23].
"Looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of OUR GREAT GOD AND SAVIOR, CHRIST JESUS: who gave Himself for us" [Titus 2:13-14].
"Of our GOD AND SAVIOR, CHRIST JESUS" [2 Peter 1:1 New American Standard Version].
"But of the Son he says 'YOUR THRONE, O GOD, is forever and ever'" [Hebrews 1:8].
"Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today, yes and forever" [Hebrews 13:8; also Hebrews 1:12; Psalms 102:25-27].
"Christ Jesus who, existing in the form of God, counted not the being on AN EQUALITY WITH GOD a thing to be grasped" [Philippians 2:5-6].
Also, Revelation 10:6 and 14:6-7
Jesus built all things [John 1:1-3; 1:10; Acts 14:15; Ephesians 3:9; Colossians 1:16; 1 Corinthians 8:6; Revelation 4:11; 10:6].
God built all things [Hebrews 3:4].
Therefore, Jesus and God are one God. "I and the Father are one" [John 10:30].
ONLY GOD IS TO BE WORSHIPED. NO MAN OR ANGEL IS TO BE WORSHIPED, BUT CHRIST IS WORSHIPED [Isaiah 45:21-23; Matthew 2:1; 14:33; 28:9; 28:17; Luke 24:51-52; John 9:37-38; Acts 7:59; 1 Corinthians 16:22; Philippians 2:11-11; 1 Timothy 1:12; Revelation 1:17; 5:8-14; many more]. IF CHRIST WERE NOT GOD, BUT ACCEPTED OR ALLOWED HIMSELF TO BE WORSHIPED, HE WOULD BE PUTTING HIMSELF IN THE PLACE OF GOD WHEN HE WAS ONLY A MAN; IT WOULD HAVE BEEN BLASPHEMING AS THE JEWS FREQUENTLY ACCUSED HIM OF DOING [Mark 2:6-8; John 5:18].
JESUS IS THE "I AM"
"Before Abraham was born, I AM" [John 8:58].
"But he said unto them, I AM, be not afraid" [John 6:20; Matthew 14:27; Mark 6:50].

robertwr.com
Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-22-2009, 08:21 AM
 
Location: Out of Florida........
4,309 posts, read 5,190,015 times
Reputation: 933
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertwr View Post
THE NATURE OF CHRIST
"We know that, when He appears, we shall be like Him, because we shall see His just as He is" [1 John 3:2]. Christ now, while He is at the right hand of God in Heaven has a spiritual body and this is how we will see Him when He returns. Not the nature He had when He had for about 33 years when He was in the image of Adam (an earthly body as Adam), but the nature He has now while He is at the right hand of God in Heaven. What Christ is like now is what He will be like "when He appears." The body He now has and will have at that time is basis to understand what we shall be after the resurrection.
THE NATURE OF CHRIST BEFORE HE BECAME FLESH, the God who made all things and us.
"Then God said, 'Let Us make man in Our image" [Genesis 1:26].
"IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD [CHRIST], AND THE WORD [CHRIST] WAS WITH GOD, AND THE WORD [CHRIST] WAS GOD. HE [CHRIST] WAS IN THE BEGINNING WITH GOD. ALL THINGS CAME INTO BEING BY HIM [CHRIST], AND APART FROM HIM [CHRIST] NOTHING CAME INTO BEING THAT HAS COME INTO BEING. IN HIM [CHRIST] WAS LIFE, AND THE LIFE WAS THE LIGHT OF MEN...HE [CHRIST] WAS IN THE WORLD AND THE WORLD WAS MADE THROUGH HIM [CHRIST]...AND THE WORD [CHRIST] BECAME FLESH, AND DWELLED AMONG US" [JOHN 1:1-14].
John states three facts in such a simple way that a child could understand them.
(1) "In the beginning was the Word" [John 1:14; 1 John 1:1; Revelation 19:3].
(2) "And the Word was with God"
(3) "And the Word was God."
Then he restates it so that no one could misunderstand what he had said.
(4) "The same was in the beginning with God"
(5) "All things were made through him"
(6) "And without him was not anything made that has been made." "For God did not SEND THE SON INTO THE WORLD to judge the world, but that the world should be saved through Him" [John 3:17]. "FOR I HAVE COME DOWN FROM HEAVEN, not to do My own will, but the will of HIM WHO SENT ME" [John 6:38].
"AND THE WORD BECAME FLESH, AND DWELLED AMONG US" [John 1:14].
"Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily I say unto you, BEFORE ABRAHAM WAS BORN, I AM" [John 8:58]. In John 8 Jesus claims to be one with God about 12 times.
"Christ: for in him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily" [Colossians 2:9].
"For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that you through his poverty might become rich" [2 Corinthians 8:9]
"Not that any man has seen the Father, ACCEPT THE ONE WHO IS FROM GOD; HE HAS SEEN THE FATHER" [John 6:46]. If, as some Pre-Millennialist teaches that Jesus did not exist before His birth, He had not seen the Father. If Pre-Millennialist were right, that Jesus did not exist before His birth, then Jesus lied.
"And no one has ascended into heaven, BUT HE THAT DESCENDED OUT OF HEAVEN, even the Son of man" [John 3:13].
"Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into His hands, AND THAT HE CAME FORTH FROM GOD, AND WAS GOING BACK TO GOD" [John 13:3].
"And have believed that I CAME FORTH FROM THE FATHER. I CAME FORTH FROM THE FATHER, AND HAVE COME INTO THE WORLD; I AM LEAVING THE WORLD AGAIN, AND GOING TO THE FATHER" [John 16:27-28].
"For this cause; therefore, the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only brake the Sabbath, but also called God his own father, MAKING HIMSELF EQUAL WITH GOD" [John 5:18].
"Who, existing in the form of God, counted not the BEING ON AN EQUALITY WITH GOD a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, taking the form of a servant" [Philippians 2:6-7].
"When the fullness of time came, God sent forth his Son, born of a woman" [Galatians 4:4].
See Matthew 1:19-25; 20:28; Luke 1:26-38; 19:10.
This proves beyond any doubt that Christ preexisted with the Father in Heaven before He came to earth, in the same form and equal with the Father.
His claim to being equal with God was even acknowledged by His enemies, but they called it blasphemy [John 5:17; 5:18; 8:58-59; 10:33-36]. If, as some Pre-Millennialist tells us that Christ did not exist unto His birth, it would have been blasphemy and a sin to make Himself equal with God. Therefore, if He did not exist before His birth, He did blaspheme and He was a sinner just as we are and His death did not save us from our sins. But, some Pre-Millennialist tells us that Christ did not exist unto His birth!!! Is there anyway God's word could say "the word" preexisted that they would believe? "The word" existed before time began.
1. "And now, glorify Me together with Yourself, Father, with the glory WHICH I HAD WITH YOU BEFORE THE WORLD WAS" [John 17:5]. Christ existed with God before the world was made, long before He became a man.
2. And again Christ says, "I am the Alpha and the Omega, says the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, THE ALMIGHTY" [Revelation 1:8]. Jesus clearly says He is "THE ALMIGHTY."
3. "For by Him [Christ] all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers and authorities--all thing have been created by Him and for Him. AND HE IS BEFORE ALL THING, and in Him all things hold together" [Colossians 1:16-17]. Jesus Christ is the Creator of the universe. Three things are here stated.
(1) "For in Him were all things created"
All things "in the havens and upon the earth"
"Things visible and thing invisible"
"Whether thrones or dominions or principalities or power"
"All things have been created through Him, and for Him"
(2) "And He is before all things"
(3) "And in Him all things hold together"
Christ said, "I AND THE FATHER ARE ONE. The Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, 'Many good works have I showed you from the Father; for which of those works do you stone Me'? The Jews answered him, 'For a good work we stone you not, but for blasphemy; and because that you, being a man, MAKE YOURSELF GOD'" [John 10:30-33]. If Christ is not God, He is an impostor and a liar. The Jews did not understand Christ to be saying He was God's chosen one, as many Pre-Millennialist say. Without any doubt, they understood Him to be saying He was God.
"A virgin shall conceive and bear a son and shall call his name IMMANUEL" [Isaiah 7:14]. Immanuel means "God with us." Matthew says, "Now all this is come to pass, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophet, saying, Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Immanuel: which is, being interpreted, God with us" [Matthew 1:22-23].
"Looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of OUR GREAT GOD AND SAVIOR, CHRIST JESUS: who gave Himself for us" [Titus 2:13-14].
"Of our GOD AND SAVIOR, CHRIST JESUS" [2 Peter 1:1 New American Standard Version].
"But of the Son he says 'YOUR THRONE, O GOD, is forever and ever'" [Hebrews 1:8].
"Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today, yes and forever" [Hebrews 13:8; also Hebrews 1:12; Psalms 102:25-27].
"Christ Jesus who, existing in the form of God, counted not the being on AN EQUALITY WITH GOD a thing to be grasped" [Philippians 2:5-6].
Also, Revelation 10:6 and 14:6-7
Jesus built all things [John 1:1-3; 1:10; Acts 14:15; Ephesians 3:9; Colossians 1:16; 1 Corinthians 8:6; Revelation 4:11; 10:6].
God built all things [Hebrews 3:4].
Therefore, Jesus and God are one God. "I and the Father are one" [John 10:30].
ONLY GOD IS TO BE WORSHIPED. NO MAN OR ANGEL IS TO BE WORSHIPED, BUT CHRIST IS WORSHIPED [Isaiah 45:21-23; Matthew 2:1; 14:33; 28:9; 28:17; Luke 24:51-52; John 9:37-38; Acts 7:59; 1 Corinthians 16:22; Philippians 2:11-11; 1 Timothy 1:12; Revelation 1:17; 5:8-14; many more]. IF CHRIST WERE NOT GOD, BUT ACCEPTED OR ALLOWED HIMSELF TO BE WORSHIPED, HE WOULD BE PUTTING HIMSELF IN THE PLACE OF GOD WHEN HE WAS ONLY A MAN; IT WOULD HAVE BEEN BLASPHEMING AS THE JEWS FREQUENTLY ACCUSED HIM OF DOING [Mark 2:6-8; John 5:18].
JESUS IS THE "I AM"
"Before Abraham was born, I AM" [John 8:58].
"But he said unto them, I AM, be not afraid" [John 6:20; Matthew 14:27; Mark 6:50].

robertwr.com

Let the people say......Amen.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-22-2009, 08:41 AM
 
Location: In God's Hand
1,315 posts, read 1,450,082 times
Reputation: 143
Amen
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-22-2009, 11:32 AM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,173,700 times
Reputation: 325
Quote:
Originally Posted by Betsey Lane View Post
Let the people say......Amen.
And the people said: "Amen"!


Another clear testimony to Christ being overall, but often overlooked, is Romans 9:5:

5whose [are] the fathers, and of whom [is] the Christ, according to the flesh, who is over all, God blessed to the ages. Amen.

Some think it says that Christ was blessed by God. To the contrary, it says Christ is over all, God (with the doxology added) blessed to the ages.

Merry Christmas all, from sweet home Alabama!
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-22-2009, 11:37 AM
 
Location: Vancouver, BC
823 posts, read 1,004,978 times
Reputation: 167
This was already discussed by both sides at great depth by a thread started by ChristyGrl and then closed by a moderator.

Thank God for Jesus that he brought us God's message for salvation. I love Jesus and pray to God.

God Bless you all.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-22-2009, 12:19 PM
 
3,225 posts, read 190,485 times
Reputation: 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by SisterKat View Post
This was already discussed by both sides at great depth by a thread started by ChristyGrl and then closed by a moderator.

Thank God for Jesus that he brought us God's message for salvation. I love Jesus and pray to God.

God Bless you all.
I agree ......I was wondering how we could put the worms back in to the can
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-22-2009, 12:25 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,430 posts, read 7,851,724 times
Reputation: 1680
Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
I agree ......I was wondering how we could put the worms back in to the can
I think it was sufficiently established that it does not state in scripture that a belief in Jesus being God is not required for salvation..

And also that Jesus never claimed to be God on several threads. What is new about this thread?
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-22-2009, 12:34 PM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,173,700 times
Reputation: 325
Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
I agree ......I was wondering how we could put the worms back in to the can
That wasn't very nice...LOL Does this mean I have to pick-up my marbles and go home?..LOL Even Mike won't play with me...
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-22-2009, 12:44 PM
 
3,225 posts, read 190,485 times
Reputation: 351
If you pick up your marbles ---- I'll pick up my bat and ball

I was thinking ahead to 20 pages ending in a lock.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-22-2009, 12:46 PM
 
3,225 posts, read 190,485 times
Reputation: 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlabamaStorm View Post
Even Mike won't play with me...
I had noticed the boxing gloves out.
Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


 
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:
Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2017, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32 - Top