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Old 03-05-2010, 02:40 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shibata View Post
One believer trusts that justification is by faith; the other believes that one is justified by works, those works being chiefly those required by the Vatican. Those two views are mutually contradictory, and, at the Reformation, everyone in Europe was very aware of this glaring difference. Anyone who tries to obscure that fundamental difference, and there are many who do that today, is either ignorant, or a liar.
Ah, faith alone or faith and works. I think your reductions might be failing in nuance if this is the fundamental objection. Here's a site that I hope will be of interest to everyone, in order to actually move forward in the discussion.

Catholic Faith and Works vs. Protestant Faith Alone | Fallible Blogma
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Old 03-05-2010, 03:44 PM
 
97 posts, read 97,569 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shibata View Post
For one thing, the word 'Protestant' does not mean 'one who protests'. The word 'protest' in the 16th and 17th centuries meant 'declare' or 'witness'. The meaning of the capitalised word is best understood as 'Declaring the gospel' or 'Witnessing to the gospel' (adjective), and 'Witness to the gospel' (noun). The word is almost synonymous with 'evangelical', and in German the word Evangelische means 'Protestant' in English.

For another thing, no Protestant can possibly believe that a Catholic is a Christian- and no informed Catholic can possibly believe that a Protestant is a Christian. One believer trusts that justification is by faith; the other believes that one is justified by works, those works being chiefly those required by the Vatican. Those two views are mutually contradictory, and, at the Reformation, everyone in Europe was very aware of this glaring difference. Anyone who tries to obscure that fundamental difference, and there are many who do that today, is either ignorant, or a liar.

Certainly, if the word 'Protestant' is taken to mean 'protester', it is fully justified, no matter what one's theology may be. If one is even dimly aware of the scandalised populations of pre-Reformation Europe, one would need to be a highly improper sort of person to deem protest unnecessary in those circumstances. The word should produce a sense of deep shame in many breasts- which probably explains why it has changed its meaning.

If justification is by works, and by the sacraments of the Roman Church, then all, whoever they are, who do not avail themselves of those sacraments, while knowing that they are available, are without hope of salvation, as popes declared with the greatest solemnity for many centuries. That is, until recently, when the Vatican has bowed to global 'PC' criticism of its dogmas. But if salvation comes only to those who believe that they are justified by faith, all Catholics are being deceived by Vatican teaching, and need to know the truth in the interests of their immortal souls. Anyone who attempts to impede Protestants in their attempts to make Catholics aware of the danger they believe Catholics to be in, may be in a danger that cannot be estimated.
Main Entry: 1prot·es·tant
Pronunciation: \ˈprä-təs-tənt, 2 is also prə-ˈtes-\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle French, from Latin protestant-, protestans, present participle of protestari
Date: 1539
1 capitalized a : any of a group of German princes and cities presenting a defense of freedom of conscience against an edict of the Diet of Spires in 1529 intended to suppress the Lutheran movement b : a member of any of several church denominations denying the universal authority of the Pope and affirming the Reformation principles of justification by faith alone, the priesthood of all believers, and the primacy of the Bible as the only source of revealed truth; broadly : a Christian not of a Catholic or Eastern church
2 : one who makes or enters a protest

The above definition is my understanding of the word. I am not that well versed on the history of it, but the word as I know it has a negative conotation. Whether or not it initially had anything to do with a "protest", I do not know, but it certainly means that today if you look in Mirriam Websters Dictionary.
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Old 03-05-2010, 04:25 PM
 
97 posts, read 97,569 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shibata View Post
Did Christians write Mirriam-Webster?
I don't know, and really don't care. What I do know is that most see the definiton of Protestant as the dictionary states it and do not know maybe the original roots or meaning.

My point is that why would a Christian want to be known for being a protestor of Catholics? Is the focus of Christ not then lost?

That is why I really don't care to be known as a Protestant. Even if one of the definitions means evangelist, many others mean protestor.

Do I have something against "Protestants"? NO. I simply don't refer to myself as one.
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Old 03-05-2010, 04:40 PM
 
Location: Way,Way Up On The Old East Coast
2,179 posts, read 1,554,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AKrunner88 View Post
I'm trying to get opinions from Protestants on why Catholic teachings are so far out to them, or wrong, or even in some peoples cases, "evil."

I've been a Catholic now for a couple years, and while at first it was hard to accept certain teachings, after understanding them in relation to scripture I definitely feel as though I am more well versed in matters of faith than I have ever been before.
AKrunner88 !!! ...

I commend you for a truly great thread idea !

The Catholic Church is facinating subject matter.

I am not Catholic but I do know several wonderful Catholic families in my community.

These great folks spend a lot more time attending their many church functions than I do at my church.

I have often wondered if this is atypical participation for the Catholics as they do appear most dedicated to the Church.

The Catholic Church is definitely not "Evil" and only those whom would choose to persecute the Church would state this nonsense !!!

Thank You / Lamar
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Old 03-05-2010, 05:03 PM
 
1,243 posts, read 1,238,492 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by byebyeducky View Post
I don't know, and really don't care.
You don't care as long as you can find fault with your supposed Christian brothers?

Quote:
My point is that why would a Christian want to be known for being a protestor of Catholics?
Would they want to be so known? I don't know any person who claims to be a Christian who goes to a dictionary to find what's what in Christian matters. It's not the allegation of anyone but internet Catholics that Protestants protest against Catholics, in my experience. It may be that dictionary publishers (like most publishing concerns, imv) and/or the supposed scholarship that passes on from dictionary to dictionary is/are anti-Protestant.

Quote:
That is why I really don't care to be known as a Protestant. Even if one of the definitions means evangelist, many others mean protestor.
A lot of Catholics have protested with their feet and left the RCC in recent years. And their reasons are little different from those that left Europe seething with anger at the Vatican's evils. Maybe failure to protest is the greatest personal indictment possible.

Last edited by shibata; 03-05-2010 at 05:12 PM..
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Old 06-12-2010, 11:53 AM
 
2,359 posts, read 7,808,476 times
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A Catholic Church teaching that has been forgotten since the era of Antipopes and Vatican II is that the Catholic Church has condemned the practice of circumcision.

TheCatholicFaith.info: Circumcision Is Condemned By the Catholic Church (http://www.thecatholicfaith.info/Circumcision_Is_Condemned.htm - broken link)
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Old 06-12-2010, 12:09 PM
 
223 posts, read 235,117 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caucazhin View Post
All large organization have leaders, so why can't a religion ???

Because Peter the supposed 1st pope refused any kind of such idea..
So why do catholics bow to the pope & bishops when peter himself turned away any such notion whatsoever ???

ACTS 10
25 And when it came to pass that Peter entered, Cornelius met him, and fell down at his feet, and worshipped him.
26 But Peter raised him up, saying, Stand up; I myself also am a man.

http://www.intercontinentalcog.org/b...dies17pf.shtml
The ANGEL told John to get up from his knees and NOT worship ANGEL'S.
Revelation 22:8-9 (King James Version)


CLICK> Revelation 22:8-9 - Passage*Lookup - King James Version - BibleGateway.com
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Old 06-12-2010, 12:22 PM
 
223 posts, read 235,117 times
Reputation: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by AKrunner88 View Post
I'm trying to get opinions from Protestants on why Catholic teachings are so far out to them, or wrong, or even in some peoples cases, "evil."

I've been a Catholic now for a couple years, and while at first it was hard to accept certain teachings, after understanding them in relation to scripture I definitely feel as though I am more well versed in matters of faith than I have ever been before.
HERES A FEW REASONS WHY:

1. The Bible says call NO man FATHER [Mat 23: 9]

2. There is no Purgotary. Its either SAVED or LOST and NO in between [no lukewarm]

3. The Pope calls himself HOLY FATHER. Theres ONLY ONE HOLY FATHER!! GOD!! The Pope is a SINNER!! and needs the BLOOD of CHRIST for his ATONEMENT. IF he is HOLY then he does NOT need the blood of the lamb.

4. The Pope says he is INFALABLE. Only GOD is INFALABLE.

5. The POPE says he represents JESUS NOT PETER!! Sometimes he forgets and SAYS he represents PETER!!

6. The priest has been given power by the HOLY POPE to turn a piece of BREAD into the BODY of jesus and a cup of wine into the BLOOD of jesus.
A man creating jesus at MASS SERVICE!!


7. The PAPACY has tampered with GOD's 10 commandments!! Check the commandments of GOD in EXO 20 and compare them to your catachism.

8. The POPE teach that MARY is also an intessesor.

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