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If you are Christian and you 100% support gay rights and equality, up to and including marriage, then how do you reconcile that belief with your faith? Do you encounter condemnation from your fellow Christians because of your views?
I am a follower of Christ. I support the rights of Gays to a live of liberty and pursuit of happiness.
There is no conflict whatsoever as my understanding of Christianity derives from the core philosophy that underlies the deeply humanistic teaching of Jesus: love.
Condemnation? Perhaps, but irrelevant. I find more who believe as I do, then swear allegiance to institutions which operate in ways diametrically opposed t the life Jesus led. Let them be conflicted.
S.
Last edited by Sandpointian; 12-28-2009 at 02:07 PM..
Who cares if they marry? It is not my problem. This would take place in a society that "is passing away" and the majority must no longer believe in it anyway (60% divorce even in the church). The real problem is "living together" gays becoming clergy (or co-habiting hetros, fornicators, divorced, the ignorant, stupid, greedy, fat, money lovers, and etc as well). That should not be allowed as married or co-habiting together, especially as they attempt to teach your little darlings about chasity, fornication and such. Marriage is a NT concession. The desirable state in unmarried and serving god. I like women (I am married-I just couldn't control myself) and have to put up with all the babes around me, so why shouldn't homo christians struggle with the same issues?
Not all Christians hold the Bible to be the infallible word of God, but rather the Jewish law and history, poetry, prophecies, the gospels and letters. Rather than relying on writings, some of us more heavily lean on prayer and requests for wisdom and the right use of our God-given ability to reason to be our guidance. I feel that the worship of the bible is akin to idolatry; naturally, I realize that this is a basic difference between fundamentalist and non and ne'er the twain shall meet.
Perhaps I lean toward simplicity. I believe in loving God and loving my neighbor, which is what Jesus said and with which I personally struggle as loving everyone does not come easily to me. There are far too many "planks" in my own eyes. I am not patient. I am not always kind. I judge others far too often. I am working on those things, and perhaps if I live to be 80, I will have conquered them.
As far as our gift of reason, every gay person I've ever known has sensed that they were this way since their childhood, and I truly believe it is the way they were made. Nothing else makes sense.
Lastly, if I were to take up a sword against an evil, there is a long, long list of far more horrifying behaviors on this planet than consensual physical activity between adults that hurts no one and is often a result of real love between the parties.
This is not a civil rights issue.This is nothing compared to the black plight. This a moral issue like it or not and the state has a right to decide which is better for society either for or against.
I do believe this thread calls for a biblical point of view and not personal opinion
I am black and I do have a problem with the hijacking of the term "civil rights" for gay purposes. A man is a man regardless of the color - and should be treated equally with regards to voting, opportunities to better ourselves, etc.
Gays want to be considered as married. You are not being denied access to live your life normally. You can vote and make money. It's not a civil rights issue - it's a preference issue.
Homosexuality deprives our country of its most needed resource - which is people. You can't create life from a homosexual union. I think that's why a normal man-wife marriage has benefits, because people are added to our population, tax credits are given for kids, and so on.
The country does not gain from homosexual unions/marriage, and it runs counter to how God planned for men & women to relate - so I am not for gay marriage.
I am black and I do have a problem with the hijacking of the term "civil rights" for gay purposes. A man is a man regardless of the color - and should be treated equally with regards to voting, opportunities to better ourselves, etc.
Gays want to be considered as married. You are not being denied access to live your life normally. You can vote and make money. It's not a civil rights issue - it's a preference issue.
Homosexuality deprives our country of its most needed resource - which is people. You can't create life from a homosexual union. I think that's why a normal man-wife marriage has benefits, because people are added to our population, tax credits are given for kids, and so on.
The country does not gain from homosexual unions/marriage, and it runs counter to how God planned for men & women to relate - so I am not for gay marriage.
Although I have no problem with gay marriage, I too don't think it's in the same category as civil rights. The Civil Rights movement was to change the laws to recognize a certain segment of our population as human beings, sad as the necessity of that sounds.
The gay marriage movement is different. They already have the recognition of their humanity--it's just a matter of whether others see them socially the way they see themselves.
You people do realize that according to the law of God homosexuals should be put to death, so I think we are being very tolerant by allowing them to live. This said according to the word of God homsexuals are equal to murder and therefor have no civil right.
Seperation of Church and state is meant to keep the state out of church buisness and to ensure the Churches free reign, not the state free reign. I beleive many have it backwards.
You people do realize that according to the law of God homosexuals should be put to death, so I think we are being very tolerant by allowing them to live. This said according to the word of God homsexuals are equal to murder and therefor have no civil right.
Seperation of Church and state is meant to keep the state out of church buisness and to ensure the Churches free reign, not the state free reign. I beleive many have it backwards.
Just for reference, I'm sure we could find one of the myriad of laws in the OT to put both you and myself to death - and if not, then proceed to the Sermon on the Mount in Matt. 5 and see if you can pass those tests. So I don't think your first sentence is a fair statement.
I am a Christian, and I support gay marriage. Even if same-sex marriage was available in all 50 of the United States, those who find same-sex marriage to be immoral would not be required to participate in one. I believe in the separation of church and state. It would not be much of a free nation if the majority could impose religious law upon the minority.
Furthermore, I believe the teachings of the Bible about same-sex sexual practices have been misinterpreted. Jesus never spoke about same-sex sex. Also, the Bible does not discuss same-sex relationships as we understand them today. In fact, some believe that passages cited against homosexuality in context seem to actually be condemning male-on-male rape. Rape has nothing to do with the loving, committed relationships that occur in our modern world between same-sex partners.
Overwhelmingly, Jesus was about love. Focusing on the minutiae of human sexuality seems to miss the big picture. Here is a good resource about the Bible and homosexuality: What the Bible Says - And Doesn't Say - About Homosexuality (http://www.soulforce.org/article/homosexuality-bible-gay-christian - broken link) I do believe that same-sex couples can glorify God together in a loving, sacred union.
I also believe that sexual orientation is biological and immutable. Therefore, I do believe that God created some people to be gay. I know some wonderful gay couples. Some of them are foster parents, taking care of children that were abused by their straight parents. I find it sad when any immutable characteristic becomes the basis for judgment.
Yes, I have been treated poorly by many Christians who do not agree with my views on same-sex rights. I have been told that I am not a "real" Christian, that I must be "picking and choosing" my beliefs, or even that I am a "Satanist". It is unfortunate that they feel that way. But I can only follow where my studies and prayers have led, even if it means that I am exiled by some of my fellow Christians.
[mod]personal attaxk [/mod]
There are those who like to say that the Bible does not condemn homosexuality. Various verses are cited (out of context) and the verses that people use to show that homosexuality is wrong are explained away. The world wants to change God's words and meanings into something more suitable to its sinful desires. Nevertheless, the truth stands: The Bible condemns homosexuality as a sin. Let's look at what it says.[INDENT][URL="http://bible.logos.com/passage/nasb/Lev.%2018.22"]Lev. 18:22[/URL], "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination." that passage says nothing about rape. i cited this from the webpage [URL]http://www.carm.org/homosexuality[/URL]
[mod] personal attack [/mod]
[/INDENT]
Last edited by Miss Blue; 12-31-2009 at 06:08 PM..
Reason: attack the idea NOT the person
You people do realize that according to the law of God homosexuals should be put to death, so I think we are being very tolerant by allowing them to live. This said according to the word of God homsexuals are equal to murder and therefor have no civil right.
Seperation of Church and state is meant to keep the state out of church buisness and to ensure the Churches free reign, not the state free reign. I beleive many have it backwards.
i dont think that Gods law meant to literally kill them, more that they will perish in the fires of hell thus causing thier souls to (in the eyes of God) be put to death. but thats my interpretation.
Rom 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another (notice it is mutual not rape); men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
Rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Rom 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Rom 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
Rom 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
Rom 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
You can not be a Christian and support the sin of homosexuality. Those who practice such are going to suffer the same punishment as murders, liars, haters of God, etc. We love them and so does God but they are sinning.
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