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Old 01-01-2010, 07:29 PM
 
6,220 posts, read 6,033,395 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
None of these denote plurality - they are simple masuline nouns - αἰών
Every translation has it as plural.

Quote:
My mistake, but you did improperly translate Eph 2:7 which is just age - αἰών
I translated nothing, I simply gave you the text from the NIV.

Quote:
Where, now don't give me your rendered translation, give me the Greek text, and then we can decide.
Again:

KJV:
Eph 2:7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.

YLT:
Eph 2:7that He might show, in the ages that are coming, the exceeding riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus,

Every translation I checked renders Eph 2:7 as ages. PLURAL. This is including NIV, NLT, KJV, YLT, and Concordant literal. Did they all get it all wrong?


Quote:
What wars? Futurism is absurd. Your exegesis plainly is in serious failure.

Go back to Greek school, and come back when you have a grip on it.
LOL. Really this is pointless. I don't care about futurism. You are evading the question and posting irrational responses. Really I cannot see how preterism is rational at all.
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Old 01-01-2010, 07:52 PM
 
6,220 posts, read 6,033,395 times
Reputation: 673
You can call futurism absurd, but how can this not be a future event:

Isaiah 2
1 This is a vision that Isaiah son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem:

2 In the last days, the mountain of the Lord’s house
will be the highest of all—
the most important place on earth.
It will be raised above the other hills,
and people from all over the world will stream there to worship.
3 People from many nations will come and say,
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
to the house of Jacob’s God.
There he will teach us his ways,
and we will walk in his paths.”
For the Lord’s teaching will go out from Zion;
his word will go out from Jerusalem.
4 The Lord will mediate between nations
and will settle international disputes.
They will hammer their swords into plowshares
and their spears into pruning hooks.
Nation will no longer fight against nation,
nor train for war anymore.



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Old 01-01-2010, 08:09 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 11,329,580 times
Reputation: 987
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
I'm sure Eusebius can point this out to you as well, but there are a minimum of at least 5 ages described in scripture:

There are ages past (Col 1:26) - ages is plural indicating at least 2 past ages.
There is this present age (Gal 1:4).

And there are ages (plural) still yet to come:

Eph 2:6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus.

Ages plural indicates there are still at least two ages to come in the future.

Sorry guys, the scriptures clearly establish there are at minimum five ages.
Very good post Legoman.
Too bad they will just mock the truth rather than search it out. Pity.
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Old 01-01-2010, 08:25 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,295 posts, read 4,992,377 times
Reputation: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
You can call futurism absurd, but how can this not be a future event:

Isaiah 2
1 This is a vision that Isaiah son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem:
2 In the last days, the mountain of the Lord’s house
will be the highest of all—
the most important place on earth.
It will be raised above the other hills,
and people from all over the world will stream there to worship.
3 People from many nations will come and say,
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
to the house of Jacob’s God.
There he will teach us his ways,
and we will walk in his paths.”
For the Lord’s teaching will go out from Zion;
his word will go out from Jerusalem.
4 The Lord will mediate between nations
and will settle international disputes.
They will hammer their swords into plowshares
and their spears into pruning hooks.
Nation will no longer fight against nation,
nor train for war anymore.

Fulfilled.
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Old 01-01-2010, 08:27 PM
 
6,220 posts, read 6,033,395 times
Reputation: 673
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
Quote:
Isaiah 2
1 This is a vision that Isaiah son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem:
2 In the last days, the mountain of the Lord’s house
will be the highest of all—
the most important place on earth.
It will be raised above the other hills,
and people from all over the world will stream there to worship.
3 People from many nations will come and say,
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
to the house of Jacob’s God.
There he will teach us his ways,
and we will walk in his paths.”
For the Lord’s teaching will go out from Zion;
his word will go out from Jerusalem.
4 The Lord will mediate between nations
and will settle international disputes.
They will hammer their swords into plowshares
and their spears into pruning hooks.
Nation will no longer fight against nation,
nor train for war anymore.
Fulfilled.
Another bizarre and irrational statement with no explanation. I give up.
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Old 01-01-2010, 08:49 PM
 
136 posts, read 160,124 times
Reputation: 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
Fulfilled.
Isaiah 2
1 This is a vision that Isaiah son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem:
2 In the last days, the mountain of the Lord’s house
will be the highest of all—
the most important place on earth.
It will be raised above the other hills,
and people from all over the world will stream there to worship.
3 People from many nations will come and say,
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
to the house of Jacob’s God.
There he will teach us his ways,
and we will walk in his paths.”
For the Lord’s teaching will go out from Zion;
his word will go out from Jerusalem.
4 The Lord will mediate between nations
and will settle international disputes.
They will hammer their swords into plowshares
and their spears into pruning hooks.
Nation will no longer fight against nation,
nor train for war anymore.

Help us by telling us when this was fulfilled, no where in history has this happened yet.
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Old 01-01-2010, 09:03 PM
 
187 posts, read 250,894 times
Reputation: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by EJScott View Post
Isaiah 2
1 This is a vision that Isaiah son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem:
[color=blue]In the last days,
Help us by telling us when this was fulfilled, no where in history has this happened yet.
However we are to understand this passage it must be kept within the context of "The Last Days."

Is there anywhere in the Bible that tells us when "the last days" were? Yes!!!

In Acts 2 Peter says that the Spirit being poured out was the sign that they were in "the last days." About 35 years later in 1 John we are told that it "was the last hour."

Last days began in AD30.
The last hour was in AD65.

And so no matter how you slice it the "last days," in question were a first century event that culminated in shortly after AD65.

Unless you know of some super special hermeneutic that can stretch the last hour over some 2000+ years.
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Old 01-01-2010, 09:36 PM
 
6,220 posts, read 6,033,395 times
Reputation: 673
And when did nation no longer fight against nation, nor train for war?

Clearly this has not happened yet, since nations still fight each other and train for war...

Therefore:
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Old 01-01-2010, 09:46 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,295 posts, read 4,992,377 times
Reputation: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
And when did nation no longer fight against nation, nor train for war?

Clearly this has not happened yet, since nations still fight each other and train for war...

Therefore:
Again, the context is about the end of the age, the coming of the son of man in judgement, and most distinctly, the destruction of the temple, which all transpired in 70 AD, therefore, the entire Olivet Discourse is about that period and that period only. Denial of these time texts is fruitless.
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Old 01-02-2010, 12:40 AM
 
187 posts, read 250,894 times
Reputation: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
And when did nation no longer fight against nation, nor train for war?

Clearly this has not happened yet, since nations still fight each other and train for war...

Therefore:
Lego...You did actually read Isaiah 2 right?

Who was the passage concerning?

This is a vision that Isaiah son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem:

You may choose to universalize this into something global...However the context of the passage is "Judah and Jerusalem." Something local.

So tell me...How does "Judah and Jerusalem" = All nations!!!
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