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Old 12-28-2009, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Pleasant Shade Tn
2,214 posts, read 4,797,821 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAtheBanker View Post
I've met a lot of JW's from my association with his friend, and they were all miserable. I've also heard more claims of infidelity and divorce between couples than any other religious group I have been around.

I believe the real root of JW's unhappiness stems from the guilt they face from the leaders of the religion. My friend's unhappiness stemmed from his best friend being disfellowshipped and the requirement of "shunning" him. That 10 year friendship was dissolved because their church said it had to be, or else my friend would also face being disfellowshipped. It all went downhill from there, and the more my friend tried to do right, the more miserable he became. All this spiraled into him stopping his church activity and dating outside of the religion.

I'm not saying only JW's have the guilt factor...Mormons have it, too. It's the same concept as Santa Claus--"Be good, or else!" But I find JW's are more extreme than any other group. There is no room for error. Either you're perfect or you can't belong. Those are expectations no one can live up to, and you will always feel inadequate. After all, you aren't one of the "elect" 144,000. You weren't good enough.

That's sad.
Interesting. I have been raised around this organization and those who truly apply bible counsel and stay close to God as a family and as individuals are enviably happy people...I consider myself to be one of those people, actually. After all, how can carrying the very name of God be cause for sadness?

You seem to be putting alot of emphasis on 'leaders' of the organization and 'shunning'. Are you aware Jehovah's Witnesses are simply following the example of the first century congregation in this practice...the very one that Christ himself established. If your friend stopped his attendance at the meetings, that would be a perfect opportunity for bad influences and feeling to corrupt his heart. After all, I can't imagine that he had a very good relationship with God if he was so close to someone that was unrepentant enough to be disfellowshipped. THis activity is a last resort, not a first measure. The congregation I go to has had no one disfellowshipped in many many years. It's not as common as is reported.

Also, I see from your post that you have been misinformed about a few of our beliefs...which also leads me to believe that perhaps the people you knew weren't really Jehovah's Witnesses...but perhaps were just saying that they were. There were false Christians in bible times as well, you know.
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Old 12-28-2009, 01:23 PM
 
Location: Pleasant Shade Tn
2,214 posts, read 4,797,821 times
Reputation: 542
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leilani Vasquez View Post
I found out that dis-fellowship is shunning someone for doing something out their beliefs.

She has slipped into keeping to herself. She refused to come out of her house at Christmas to be around any of us.

I don't know if she actually told them they were "going to hell", but she sure did scare them.

She didnt take part in Christmas activities because as a Witness, she no longer feels that God approves of the traditions associated w/ the holiday. I doubt she is becoming a recluse due to her newfound faith. Actually, she will probably be very vocal about it but hopefully she will not 'scare' anyone else.
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Old 12-28-2009, 01:34 PM
 
Location: East Valley, AZ
3,852 posts, read 7,562,427 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alicenevada View Post
Interesting. I have been raised around this organization and those who truly apply bible counsel and stay close to God as a family and as individuals are enviably happy people...I consider myself to be one of those people, actually. After all, how can carrying the very name of God be cause for sadness?

You seem to be putting alot of emphasis on 'leaders' of the organization and 'shunning'. Are you aware Jehovah's Witnesses are simply following the example of the first century congregation in this practice...the very one that Christ himself established. If your friend stopped his attendance at the meetings, that would be a perfect opportunity for bad influences and feeling to corrupt his heart. After all, I can't imagine that he had a very good relationship with God if he was so close to someone that was unrepentant enough to be disfellowshipped. THis activity is a last resort, not a first measure. The congregation I go to has had no one disfellowshipped in many many years. It's not as common as is reported.
Or, it would be the perfect time for someone who CARES to step in and take him under their wing. That would be either a fellow JW who loves him enough to not care about the "rules" but actually treat him like a human--and imperfect one, at that. OR it would be someone outside of the religion--one who will lead him down a dark road.

I am morally opposed to the practice of shunning, and I don't believe that's how God intended us to interpret it. His declaration of "love one another" did not include such phrases as "only if they're doing what you think they should be doing" or "only if they're just like you" or "only if you think you should". Who are we to judge who is good and who is wicked? And, how do we determine who is wicked--by some rules our church lists?

The fact of the matter is my friend needed someone at the most vulnerable time in his life. He didn't feel he could turn to his JW family and friends, so he turned elsewhere. Now he'll never be "worthy" again.
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Old 12-28-2009, 01:47 PM
 
Location: Pleasant Shade Tn
2,214 posts, read 4,797,821 times
Reputation: 542
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAtheBanker View Post
Or, it would be the perfect time for someone who CARES to step in and take him under their wing. That would be either a fellow JW who loves him enough to not care about the "rules" but actually treat him like a human--and imperfect one, at that. OR it would be someone outside of the religion--one who will lead him down a dark road.

I am morally opposed to the practice of shunning, and I don't believe that's how God intended us to interpret it. His declaration of "love one another" did not include such phrases as "only if they're doing what you think they should be doing" or "only if they're just like you" or "only if you think you should". Who are we to judge who is good and who is wicked? And, how do we determine who is wicked--by some rules our church lists?

The fact of the matter is my friend needed someone at the most vulnerable time in his life. He didn't feel he could turn to his JW family and friends, so he turned elsewhere. Now he'll never be "worthy" again.
Hmmm, again, I think you misunderstand what happens when someone practices wrongdoing. They aren't immediately 'kicked out'. There is much discussion, encouragement, and compassion shown before this decision is made. The scriptures are very clear about how we should treat those who leave the faith and live immoral lives...as a matter of fact, I don't know how else God could expect us to understand the verse that states 'we should not even eat with such a man'. Evidently, the purpose of this activity is to prevent the congregation itself losing God's spirit and becoming corrupted...and if you check out the history of the Christian congregation, that is precisely how they understood it as well.

The bible says that we are to 'remove the wicked man from among yourselves'. If that is the case, there would have to be guidelines to determine what qualifies as such...and thankfully, the scriptures give us those guidelines so we don't have to make the call. Wickedness, it seems, is simply the continued practice of sin with total disregard for God's laws. Thankfully, most wrongdoing doesnt fall into that category, which is why disfellowshipping is not very common.

And I must say I think it is a shame you would say that your friend will never be worthy again..?? The prodigal son was deemed worthy when he repented...why would your friend be beyond God's forgiveness? I personally have been at weak and vulnerable times in my life as well...so i can identify with him. Strangely, I drew closer to God and to the congregation during that time. It never occurred to me to turn my back on them.
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Old 12-29-2009, 07:16 AM
 
810 posts, read 1,195,839 times
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Alicenevada!! SO good to see you again!! I'm hardly ever on anymore...back to teaching fulltime. You are so right about JW's being a happy people. Quite honestly too, I feel that I have had people distance themselves from me rather than me distancing myself from them because of my beliefs. It just kind of happens.

I think that disfellowshipping/shunning/excommnuicating happens in many facets of our lives to preserve any particular environment. In schools, we suspend students...in the work place people get fired..., just like you said it protects the congregation from someone who is willfully and unrepentently engaging in spiritually damaging behavior.
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Old 12-29-2009, 09:32 AM
 
313 posts, read 695,117 times
Reputation: 173
Great explanations from you both- thanks!
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Old 01-01-2010, 01:20 PM
 
2,558 posts, read 4,811,515 times
Reputation: 954
Lot's of information here.


From Jehovah's Witness to Protestant
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Old 01-01-2010, 02:13 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, BC
823 posts, read 996,848 times
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I have many friends and family who practice different religions. Most are wonderful people. We all but are on a different pathway to God and it is my belief that with so many contradictions it is not easy to know the true path. I have family that are Catholic (I was once a practicing Catholic), my youngest son is a born again Christian (he believes Jesus is God) I know of people who are JW's and they are good people, I work with a few Muslim people who are wonderful, my boss' employers are Jewish and we often get together in friendship with them. These are wonderful human beings that Love God. They are my family and they are my friends. I am sorry but I do not believe in the JW belief of not associating with anyone other than. For me, this is a large misinterpretation of God's Word.

I do not make a habit however, of associating with people that do illigal type of activities as this is more in line with what God would not want us to do. Not to cast away a good friend because they were perhaps a born again Christian and not a JW.
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Old 01-02-2010, 09:39 AM
 
313 posts, read 695,117 times
Reputation: 173
I still see a lot of misunderstanding about what JW's believe. Even when Witnesses try to set the record straight, we aren't always believed due to one thing or another... anyway try this:

The official website of Jehovah's Witnesses worldwide-

Jehovah's Witnesses: Watchtower Society Official Web Site

You can read a lot of the information in different languages if that is something you or a friend or family member needs and there is no pressure. You are not obligated to become a Witness just because you read information on the website- and no, they will not send you literature unless you request it! But you might end up printing things out for your own information :-) And that's okay!

That is why we have a website- to inform the public with accurate information, not only about what we believe, but why we believe it. Please check it out.

Last edited by DiJay; 01-02-2010 at 10:14 AM.. Reason: revamp after coffee!
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Old 01-02-2010, 06:10 PM
 
Location: Out of Florida........
4,309 posts, read 5,161,213 times
Reputation: 932
"Labels"....each coming with their own self-serving set of rules and regulations. This IMO is what keeps us from reaching out one to another! Wow! Is it at all possible to just love one another and leave the judging up to the JUDGE? ( and I'm not talking about Judge Judy either......).
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