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Old 01-04-2010, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville,Florida
3,772 posts, read 9,019,989 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BudinAk View Post
IMO: There is no "tithe law" today under the new covenant. Tithing, what you are referring to, was under the law...the old covenant, which was replaced by the new covenant. Tithing is still commonly taught by many misled churches today, and by TV scam preachers, who can make a lot of money in a short time by dumping this old law onto believers backs.
Jesus never taught tithing to His disciples! What WAS taught in the N.T. was GIVING, out of a generous heart, and not because anyone "had to-or else". The disciples gave hugely: sold all that they had, and had everything in common! (talk about an example!) If we are not giving, then there is something wrong with our attitude. You give whatever percentage you feel led of God to do, not the legalistic 10%, or some such figure. Giving can also consist of your time, your skills, and your talents, such as volunteer work at your local church, senior center, jail ministry, assisted-living homes, etc. It's not that we "gotta give", it's that we should grow to the place where we WANT TO. We each ought to examine ourselves in this regard, and not be forcing the old testament law on anyone...because it does not apply to Christians today.
My parents stopped going to church over 70 years ago, because some minister told them they "had to" give a tithe of 10%, or they were "robbing God". And they've never gone back...all these years.
One has to wonder if the outcome would have been much different, had that preacher instead taught giving, out of a generous heart...

Bud
My point here was that people hold back from not giving to their church so that they can save up for something or they think they will come up short on paying a bill instead of putting their complete trust in the Lord. They are putting their trust in money to solve problems. Everything is from God and is of God. Yes you are right people should give with their heart and calculating 10 percent of wages is a little bit onerous and legalistic but to hold back and not give in anyway shape or form is robbing God because like I said everything is from God.Give what you can give and be a cheerful giver.
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:34 PM
 
Location: Prattville, Alabama
4,881 posts, read 4,830,369 times
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Can someone tell me when the Tithing Law changed from livestock and produce to money?? I've searched high and low in the bible and I can't find it anywhere.
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:38 PM
 
Location: In God's Hand
1,315 posts, read 1,450,679 times
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Tithing means you have to give.

Where is the cheerful giver if one has to give even out of necessity?

Paul boasted of the givings ( the ministering to the saints) from the church at Corinth in such a way that it provoked the other churches to jealousy. The agreement with the church was to set aside from the bounty the Lord has provided by way of cheerful givers for the church to meet the needs of the ministering saints. The church at Corinth would set aside a small portion from each bounty collection so that there would never be a time when they take up a special collection and thereby placing the burden on the believers that may see that as a means of covetousness.

2 Corinthians 9: 1For as touching the ministering to the saints, it is superfluous for me to write to you: 2For I know the forwardness of your mind, for which I boast of you to them of Macedonia, that Achaia was ready a year ago; and your zeal hath provoked very many. 3Yet have I sent the brethren, lest our boasting of you should be in vain in this behalf; that, as I said, ye may be ready: 4Lest haply if they of Macedonia come with me, and find you unprepared, we (that we say not, ye) should be ashamed in this same confident boasting. 5Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren, that they would go before unto you, and make up beforehand your bounty, whereof ye had notice before, that the same might be ready, as a matter of bounty, and not as of covetousness. 6But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully. 7Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver. 8And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work:

This is why Jesus taught a better way to give:

Matthew 6: 1Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven. 2Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. 3But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth: 4That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.

The churches were to rely on the glory of God's Providence for the ministry as the church when they come together are to set the example of faith in God's Providence by His raising up cheerful givers, thereby, when the believers go home, they have that same faith that God will continue to provide for them in meeting their needs.

In the face of economic crisis and seemingly continual practises of society placing their security in money:

Matthew 6: 19Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal: 20But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

21For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also. 22The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light. 23But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness! 24No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon. 25Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment? 26Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?
27Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature? 28And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin: 29And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 30Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O ye of little faith? 31Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed? 32(For after all these things do the Gentiles seek for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things. 33But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you. 34Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.
So as a reminder: Jesus came to serve... not to be served. Seems nowadays, alot of ministries are seeking to be served, looking to pledges from supporters rather than by faith in God to provide. If a church wants the nation to believe "In God We Trust" should remain on the currency, then it is time to put away pledges and trust God to raise up anonymous cheerful givers, and be content with what God has raised as those do at home with what they have.
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Old 01-04-2010, 05:31 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
28,081 posts, read 44,192,845 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noland123 View Post
Tithing means 10 percent and when we don't tithe ,then we are robbing God. When we give from the heart we are putting God first by putting our cares and worries in to His hands and out of ours.
I understand that this is a major part of your Jewish Faith [tithing of your fruit harvest], however I am Christian.

So please do understand that this OT laws does not apply to me.

I do not tithe of my fruit harvest, nor of our herds.
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Old 01-04-2010, 07:13 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville,Florida
3,772 posts, read 9,019,989 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
I understand that this is a major part of your Jewish Faith [tithing of your fruit harvest], however I am Christian.

So please do understand that this OT laws does not apply to me.

I do not tithe of my fruit harvest, nor of our herds.
Who said I was Jewish?
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Old 01-04-2010, 07:19 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
28,081 posts, read 44,192,845 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noland123 View Post
Who said I was Jewish?
You were quoting your beliefs from the OT about how Jews were required to tithe of their fruit harvest and their herds.
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Old 01-04-2010, 07:35 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville,Florida
3,772 posts, read 9,019,989 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
You were quoting your beliefs from the OT about how Jews were required to tithe of their fruit harvest and their herds.
I never said or quoted this from the bible ,I was giving the meaning of tithing,which does mean 10 percent,and when we don't give to the Lord we are robbing Him. **** others have stated it doesn't need to necessarily have to be monetarily but we should give as everything is from God.
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Old 01-04-2010, 07:50 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
28,081 posts, read 44,192,845 times
Reputation: 15098
Quote:
Originally Posted by noland123 View Post
I never said or quoted this from the bible ,I was giving the meaning of tithing,which does mean 10 percent,and when we don't give to the Lord we are robbing Him. **** others have stated it doesn't need to necessarily have to be monetarily but we should give as everything is from God.
It was never once mentiond in the Bible as being cash.

In the Bible, tithing is always from your harvest or your herds.

Cash would of course violate the second commandment [remember the ten given to Moses?].
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Old 01-04-2010, 08:13 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville,Florida
3,772 posts, read 9,019,989 times
Reputation: 1963
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
It was never once mentiond in the Bible as being cash.

In the Bible, tithing is always from your harvest or your herds.

Cash would of course violate the second commandment [remember the ten given to Moses?].
The definition of tithe-It can be one-tenth of your annual income.

tithe: Definition from Answers.com
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Old 01-04-2010, 08:13 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
19,495 posts, read 18,728,390 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BudinAk View Post
IMO: There is no "tithe law" today under the new covenant. Tithing, what you are referring to, was under the law...the old covenant, which was replaced by the new covenant. Tithing is still commonly taught by many misled churches today, and by TV scam preachers, who can make a lot of money in a short time by dumping this old law onto believers backs.
Well, I'm glad you qualified that with an "IMO."

Quote:
Jesus never taught tithing to His disciples
Quote:
! What WAS taught in the N.T. was GIVING, out of a generous heart, and not because anyone "had to-or else".
Actually, He taught that we should continue to tithe while not ignoring the "weightier matters of the law."

Quote:
The disciples gave hugely: sold all that they had, and had everything in common! (talk about an example!) If we are not giving, then there is something wrong with our attitude. You give whatever percentage you feel led of God to do, not the legalistic 10%, or some such figure.
There is a difference between a "tithe" and an "offering." Tithing means exactly what it says and there is nowhere in the New Testament where the ancient law was rescinded.

Quote:
Giving can also consist of your time, your skills, and your talents, such as volunteer work at your local church, senior center, jail ministry, assisted-living homes, etc.
Good point. We often forget this.

Quote:
My parents stopped going to church over 70 years ago, because some minister told them they "had to" give a tithe of 10%, or they were "robbing God". And they've never gone back...all these years.
Wow! That's too bad. Too bad they threw out the baby with the bath water.
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