Can Nice People Be Unbelievers ? (Holy Spirit, mystic, Jesus, Bible)

[mmm...mabeynot]

Yes

[Cyber Munchkin]

Originally Posted by Miss Blue

Can a nice person be a believer even though others say he isn't..

Yes......

[shibata]

There are many non-religious who are far more agreeable to be with than many who attend religious meetings. But they do not compare to the born again.

[Betsey Lane]

Originally Posted by Miss Blue

Can a nice person be a believer even though others say he isn't..

It depends...on how he walks and talks and LIVE like, even still......only God JUDGES THE HEART, amen?

[june 7th]

Originally Posted by tonytonytony

There are some all the time.

They may be money generous but do they believe John 3:5 ?

They may share the atonement news of Jesus but do they believe
Romans 6:1 ?

They may be people never hating but do they believe Hebrews 4 ?

They may be people never cussing but do they believe Romans 7:2-3 ?

They may be people never judging but do they believe Mark 16:16 ?

They may be a 40 year church member but do they believe 1 John 2:27 ?

They may speak in tongues but do they believe 1 Peter 3:3 ?

They may be a leader but do they believe 1 Timothy 2:9-14 ?

They may be nice spouses but do they believe 2 Timothy 3:16 ?

They may be nice parents but do they believe 2 Peter 1:20-21 ?

They may be successful tycoons but do they believe 1 Timothy 6 ?

They may have a BMW but do they believe Luke 3:14 ?

They may pay tithes but do they believe Galations 1:8-9 ?

They may have trophies on the shelf but do they believe Acts 17:28 ?

They may have a dozen friends but have they lived out Matthew 10:22 ?

They may win people to accept God but do they believe 2 Cor. 6:14-17 ?

They may give up beer and cigarettes but do they believe John 8:31 ?

They may have the best wedding but do they believe 1 Peter 4:1-4 ?

They may be offended people but do they believe John 8:44 is real ?

They may have a lot of wit but do they reallly believe Isaiah 64:6 ?

They may have went to theology school but do they believe 2 Tim. 2:15 ?

They may have a favorite book author but do they believe James 1:5 ?

They may have a respected pastor but do they believe Matthew 15:14 ?

They may believe in fellowship but do they really believe 1 Thess. 5:12 ?

They may be drawn to people testifying about God in their life but do they really believe Amos 3:3 ?

They may have done a lot of good in the world but do they really believe
Matthew 5:18-20 and Romans 10:2-3 ? What about Rev. 22:18-19 ?

Originally Posted by Betsey Lane

It depends...on how he walks and talks and LIVE like, even still......only God JUDGES THE HEART, amen?

Here's what's interesting about the OP: June wonders whether the member posting it adheres to, and can say that he/she complies with all the (numerous) scriptural passages that yes, June did in fact, look up. Perhaps he can/does, in which case, no argument here from June. If anything, June would be the first to say "Now that is incredibly admirable!" --And she'd mean it.

The 'real' June, however, can't help but wonder about the very nature of the overall question: "Can nice people be unbelievers?" Initially, my reaction was to think "I know that I am someone who, overall, generally speaking, is considered a 'nice person.' I am also a non-believer. What's the point?"

It seems to me that the point is far more multi-complex than the surface question(s) would seem to appear. The reality of the situation is this: There are, and have always been, incredibly good, altruistic, and truly admirable people throughout the course of time/history who were NOT Christians. --They contributed to society; to other's well-being, and even in the event they were never noticed, recognized, or otherwise acknowledged, they did, in fact, leave this world just a little better off from having been here. --And yet, they weren't a "Christian."

You know, your 'god' works in oh, so provocative ways. You see, if you are going to believe in Genesis 1, in conjunction with/along with John 1:1, then you have to ask yourselves just who this god is, and just how he "presents" himself to his own creation.

The reality of the situation is this: June has met, known, been intimately involved with, and had relationships with a number of "Christians." Can this otherwise "unbelieving nice person" recognize, know, and identify a Christian when she meets one? Yup. She sure can. She has. Many times.

So tell me: What is this particular "nice person who is an unbeliever" to make of the fact that the ex-seminarian 'had his way with her' in the choir loft, way back when? What is this particular "nice person who is an unbeliever" to make of the fact that Christian men have engaged in less than honorable acts with her? What is this "nice person who is an unbeliever" to make of the fact that one of the most humble Christians she has ever met (who just so happens to be a Pastor) disclosed to her his pornography addiction? What is this "nice person who is an unbeliever" to make of the fact that non-Christians have 'disclosed' to her aspects of who they are, their 'true selves/identities' and have somehow been --more than anything else-- honest about who they are with her?

That is the real question.

I am the last person here who is looking to judge, point a finger, or for that matter, accuse. It's not my place; it's not who I am. However, in terms of the question asked, along with the scripture passages listed? --You all tell me: How many of you who are believers can hold your heads up high, and hold yourselves up to that level, that 'standard' of near perfection?

I've yet to meet any.

And that is perhaps the one aspect of your religion, your faith, your belief that resonates the most with this "nice person who is an unbeliever." It has been those (extremely rare, as in no one) few who have been able to say "Yup. I sin. I sinned with you; I sinned against you. I used you all the while that I sinned with you for my own self-pleasure/gratification. I exploited you, I cheated you, cheated with you, cheated on my wife with you, along with the fact that I lied to you, I was unfair to you, I was an otherwise insensitive and unkind person to you. I then went on to deny all those things, (based on my own 'Christianity' along with my ego) because I had to: my sense of self, and who I am as regards my wife, my job, my standing in the community, my church otherwise needed to be.....salvaged." --And so forth.

So who, to this atheist's way of thinking, are the one's for whom she has the most respect? --Perhaps those who (in her humble opinion) are not in denial about themselves, their faith, and most of all, what Christ really, truly said.

The rest?

They just had sex with me. In a choir loft. Or elsewhere....Or lectured me. Or deceived me. Or disclosed to me what they later regretted, because it exposed their "non-Christian" ways or humanness. --Imagine: Christians who are actually able to acknowledge: They are human. Just as Jesus once was. His message wasn't what yours is. However:

It's all good.


-Yet I should ask myself whether or not I am a "nice person who is an unbeliever?"


Lately, even June has had to re-think the definition of what "being saved" actually means.


Take gentle care,

~June: Nice Person Who Is An Unbeliever

[firstborn888]

Originally Posted by june 7th

Take gentle care,

~June: Nice Person Who Is An Unbeliever

June be nicer than most any person. Methinks she is a believer (in love - and niceness).

[MysticPhD]

Originally Posted by firstborn888

June be nicer than most any person. Methinks she is a believer (in love - and niceness).

As long as carnal minds equate what people claim to be as the measure of their belief . . . there will be confusion about who is or is not a believer. Belief is an internal state of being that cannot be willfully established. It has nothing to do with what we want or wish or claim to believe. It is reflected in who we are and how we are. Those who are Christ-like and conduct their lives in ways that Christ would are responding to the Holy Spirit within guiding them to the love that is "written in our hearts" and are believers. Believers are not identified by what they proclaim. They are identified by how they live and love. Their fruits identify them as believers whatever their words proclaim or deny. It is not those who say "Lord,Lord . . ." who are necessarily the believers.

Those who are remorseful when they disappoint themselves and behave or act in ways that they know in their heart is wrong are responding to the Holy Spirit convicting them. That is true repentance and the Holy Spirit provides the love and grace of Jesus to their Spirit. The kingdom of God is within and Jesus and His Holy Spirit reigns in us all. We speak to Him, share with Him and love Him in secret and with all sincerity. No outward show or proclamations matter.

Unfortunately, we are all free to acknowledge or reject this inner guidance and reap the consequences. Those who feel no real remorse because it is what they wish to do and enjoy . . . but overtly profess "repentance in prayer to God asking for forgiveness" will not receive it. They know it is wrong in their hearts but they are not really sorry about it and fully intend to continue. These are NOT believers . . . regardless what they profess to believe.

[little elmer]

Originally Posted by june 7th

How many of you who are believers can hold your heads up high, and hold yourselves up to that level, that 'standard' of near perfection?

And that would be self centered and prideful - which sadly, a lot of "Christians" do today. A Christian is a begger who's found Bread, the Bread of Life. Is the person changed because of their conversion? Yes.

But that conversion is not instantaneously complete - where they are now depends on where they started from - it's a process, a renewing of the mind. As for those Christians who revealed their corruptness? No surprise, but their falling away by turning to that old life or looking at it and saying, "This is me" isn't what we're to do - we don't look back.

We can say, "Yes, this is what I am, but this is not my Savior - and His life is replacing my old one".

Originally Posted by june 7th

Lately, even June has had to re-think the definition of what "being saved" actually means.

I'm not sure we could fully grasp the whole meaning of it either.

[RobinD69]

Originally Posted by rayneinspain

Well said.

I see the same attitude in the OP mirrored by our Muslim posters: how can you possibly be a decent person if you don't share my beliefs and accept MY way as the truth?

What a pathetic way to judge a person's worth or character.

IMO there are quite a few people who would do well to focus on self-examination...sadly, judgmental types seldom do.

No offence intended but you sound like the pot calling the kettle black. You do realize you just judged others.

[rifleman]

You called?

(Sorry; I didn't answer right away because I was out helping an old lady across the street while on my way to our local Children's Museum to give them a fun lesson in science and critical thinking...)