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Old 04-25-2010, 01:12 AM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
2,031 posts, read 2,696,156 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bright Hope for Tomorrow View Post
Everyone will, eventually.
What about the parable of the weeds in Matthew 13:24-30? Jesus explains this parable in verses 36-43. Why would Jesus tell this parable if all are saved in the end? How will the weeds (unbelievers) be saved if the harvesters (angels) separated them from the wheat (believers) to be burned?

 
Old 04-25-2010, 03:23 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,420,472 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CantWait2Leave View Post
What about the parable of the weeds in Matthew 13:24-30? Jesus explains this parable in verses 36-43. Why would Jesus tell this parable if all are saved in the end? How will the weeds (unbelievers) be saved if the harvesters (angels) separated them from the wheat (believers) to be burned?
The chaff from the wheat is burned along with the weeds. Both groups are burned with fire.
 
Old 04-25-2010, 01:08 PM
 
162 posts, read 177,597 times
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Please do not turn this thread into an argument about Universalism. Thanks.
 
Old 04-25-2010, 03:47 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, BC
823 posts, read 1,085,146 times
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I believe if Jesus does not really know you, you will not be fit for the highest of heavens. You may possess all of the knowledge of the Bible in your mind and try and live your life as best according to how you interpret the message. This may not be enough....as Jesus may not know you.

How will God recognize a true believer that is fit to live in the highest of heavens? First comes the knowledge and then the Love of God must transform your soul.
  1. “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” Jesus said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all you heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind. This is the first and great commandment.” (Matthew 22:36)
  2. “And the Lord your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your descendants, to love the Lord your God with all of your heart and with all of your soul, that you may live.” (Deuteronomy 30:6)
  3. “And you will seek me and find Me, when you search for Me with all your heart.” (Jeremiah 29:13)
  4. “… and you will find Him if you seek Him with all your heart and with all your soul.” (Deuteronomy 4:29)
  5. “They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord God of their fathers with all their heart and with all their soul …” (2 Chronicles 15:12)
  6. ” … you have not been as My servant David, who kept My commandments and who followed Me with all His heart to do what was right in My eyes …” (1 Kings 14:8)
There is only one way to be able to walk in Love with God which will provide the new birth to the soul – and that is learning how to draw that love from God in earnest prayer.
You have to be willing to enter into a true sanctification process with the Lord where He can begin to start the process of transforming your soul into the express image of His Son Jesus Christ.

There is no other way! There are no other shortcuts that you can take to get this accomplished. It is only when the very love of God Himself starts to flow into your soul can you even begin to love God, love yourself and love other people to the degree and to the intensity that He would really like from you.

Jesus told us that this was of utmost of importance and for a very good reason. This is how you shall be recognized.
 
Old 04-25-2010, 04:10 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 1,726,762 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airō View Post
We all need Biblical assurance of our salvation. Suppose you have doubts because of the lifestyle you are living. We cannot trust ourselves to whether we are saved, we must go to the Word of God to determine God's will and His sure-fire test of how we can know we are saved. It's what God's Word says about our life, not what we say about it or what others say for us.

If it's not a complete work of God.....


What must you do to be saved?
  1. Say the right things.
    For by thy words thou shalt be justified. -- Matthew 12:37
  2. Do the right things.
    And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life. -- John 5:29
    For you render to each one according to his works. -- Psalm 62:12
    I the Lord ... give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings. -- Jeremiah 17:10
    For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. -- Matthew 16.27
    For we must all appear before the jugment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad. -- 2 Corinthians 5:10
    Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works. -- 2 Corinthians 11:15
    What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? -- James 2:14
    The Father, who without partiality judges according to each one's work. -- 1 Peter 1:17
    I will give unto every one of you according to your works. -- Revelation 2:23
    And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. -- Revelation 20:12-13
  3. Believe the right things.
    A man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. -- Romans 3:28
    Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. -- Romans 5:1
    A man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ. -- Galatians 2:16
    For by grace are ye saved through faith. -- Ephesians 2:8
  4. Do and believe the right things.
    Faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. -- James 2:17
  5. Feed the hungry, give drink to the thirsty, take in strangers, clothe the naked, visit the sick and imprisoned.
    Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. -- Matthew 25:34-36
  6. Do what is lawful and right.
    When the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness ... and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul. -- Ezekiel 18:27
  7. Do the will of Jesus' father.
    Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Matthew 7:21
  8. Be a doer of the law.
    Who will render to each one according to his deeds. ... For not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified. -- Romans 2:6, 13
  9. See Jesus and believe in him.
    Every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. -- John 6:40
  10. Believe in Jesus.
    Whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. -- John 3:16
    He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life. -- John 3:36
    Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life. -- John 6:47
    Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved. -- Acts 16:31
  11. Be born again.
    Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. -- John 3:3
  12. Hear the words of Jesus and believe in whoever sent him.
    He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life. -- John 5:24
  13. Be born of water and the spirit.
    Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. -- John 3:5
  14. Be dead with Jesus.
    It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: -- 2 Timothy 2:11
  15. Be washed by the Holy Ghost.
    Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost. -- Titus 3:5
  16. Be converted and become like a little child.
    Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. -- Matthew 18:3
  17. Hate your own life.
    The man who loves his life will lose it, while the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life. John 12:25
  18. Lose your life for Christ's sake.
    For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. -- Matthew 16:25, Mark 8:35, Luke 9:24, Luke 17:33
  19. Give a cup of water to a Christian.
    For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward. -- Matthew 10:42, Mark 9:41
  20. Believe and be baptized.
    He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. -- Mark 16:16
  21. Belong to a household that has at least one believer.
    And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. -- Acts 16:31
    For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy. -- 1 Corinthians 7:14
  22. Call upon the name of the Lord.
    Whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. -- Acts 2:21, Romans 10:13
  23. Confess with your mouth "Jesus is Lord" and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead.
    If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. -- Romans 10:9
  24. Follow the commandments (at least some of them).
    If you want to enter into life, keep the commandments. He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. -- Matthew 19:17-19
    Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life. -- Revelation 22:14
  25. Keep some of the commandments, give all your money to the poor, and follow Jesus.
    And a certain ruler asked him, saying, Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? ... Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother. And he said, All these have I kept from my youth up. ...thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.-- Luke 18:18-22
  26. Keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.
    Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. -- Revelation 14:12
  27. Love the truth.
    And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. -- 2 Thessalonians 2:10
  28. Endure to the end.
    He that endureth to the end shall be saved. -- Matthew 10:22, 24:13, Mark 13:13
  29. Wait until you die and then get baptized (after you're dead).
    Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead? -- 1 Corinthians 15:29
  30. Don't judge other people.
    Judge not, and ye shall not be judged. -- Matthew 7:1, Luke 6:37
  31. Have lots of babies (and be faithful, charitable, holy, and sober).
    And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety. -- 1 Timothy 2:14-15
  32. Get saved by your spouse.
    For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save thy husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save thy wife? -- 1 Corinthians 7:16
  33. Turn yourself over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh so your spirit may be saved. (For fornicators only.)
    It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you ... deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. -- 1 Corinthians 5:1-5
  34. Abandon your home and family for Jesus' name's sake.
    And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life. -- Matthew 19:29, Mark 10:29-30, Luke 18:29-30
  35. Don't be a serpent or a viper, and make sure none of your ancestors were prophet killers.
    Ye are the children of them which killed the prophets ... Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell? -- Matthew 23:31-33
  36. Try to enter through the strait gate.
    Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said unto them, Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. -- Luke 13:23-24
  37. Become an Israeli citizen.
    And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob. -- Romans 11:26
  38. Don't defile yourself with women. (Be a virgin male.)
    ...the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. -- Revelation 14:4
  39. Don't be ashamed of Jesus.
    Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels. -- Mark 8:38
  40. Don't let anyone see you do anything good.
    Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven. -- Matthew 6:1
  41. Be given by the Father and come to the Son.
    All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. -- John 6:37
  42. Be chosen (predestinated) by God.
    For many are called, but few are chosen. -- Matthew 22:14
    No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day. John 6:44
    For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate ... Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. -- Romans 8:29-30
    For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth. -- Romans 9:11
    He hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love. Having predestinated us ... according to the good pleasure of his will. -- Ephesians 1:4-5
  43. Be poor, not rich.
    Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. -- Matthew 19:23-24
    But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation. -- Luke 6:24
    Ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. -- James 5:1
  44. Be last.
    But many that are first shall be last; and the last shall be first. -- Matthew 19:30, Mark 10:31
  45. Be more righteous than the scribes and Pharisees.
    Except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. -- Matthew 5:20
  46. Eat the bread that comes down from heaven.
    This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die. -- John 6:50
  47. Eat Jesus' body and blood.
    Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you. Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. -- John 6:53-54
  48. Just ask.
    Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. -- Matthew 7:7-8
  49. Love God and your neighbor.
    He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live. -- Luke 10:26
  50. All you need is love.
    Love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God. -- 1 John 4:7
  51. Believe in the foolishness of preaching.
    For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. -- 1 Corinthians 1:21
What must you do to be saved?
 
Old 04-25-2010, 04:43 PM
 
696 posts, read 767,123 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scgraham View Post
Not at all. If we willfully sin, then the blood of Jesus no longer protects us. We are a child of the devil again. If we remain in that condition, we will go to hell. If, however, the Father draws us back to repentance, wherewith we forsake all sin, then the backslider can be restored again.

Any way, I have given plenty of passages to point out that "once saved, always saved" is heresy; it's a work of the flesh. The only way I believe it is if once we are saved, we remain saved through obedience. But, this teaching that we are stilled saved even if we go on to commit willful sin is heresy -- even if it's just one willful sin.
Sir you are thinking of it from mans perspective and thats why the Universalist in many ways agrees with you.

The once saved always saved arguement is not attributable to man, but to God. If God seals you with the Holy Spirit you can not be anything else but a child of God. If God sealed you and you want away then God Himself would have sealed you in error. As God does not error then we know those who claim they went away are false and never were of us.

This is why the Mark of the Beast is important in the end times. Those who take the mark are not saved because they are of the devil. They are sealed and condemned. The devil's mark is a imitation of the sealing God does to Christians. This is why those who refuse it will die, but thank God they die and do not take it. For in that day they will be in paradise

If you believe your obedience saves you then you believe in works. The only works the Christian can practice is that which Christ does thru the Christian and in that Christ gets the glory and the Christian gets none. Anything that points to an individual attaining or keeping anything by any action is a work and by scripture is false, lest any man should boast. Those who have claimed to have once been of us, never were of us, and never were or are sealed by the Holy Spirit. Even then a chance remains if pride and error are cast aside for the truth of Christ, but unless one is sealed one is not saved.
 
Old 04-25-2010, 04:54 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, BC
823 posts, read 1,085,146 times
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[quote=Aschultz73;13898572]Sir you are thinking of it from mans perspective and thats why the Universalist in many ways agrees with you.

How is one SEALED with the Holy Spirit?
 
Old 04-25-2010, 05:00 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, BC
823 posts, read 1,085,146 times
Reputation: 168
[quote=Aschultz73;13898725]
Quote:
Originally Posted by SisterKat View Post

You have told me your a Christian you tell me. If a Universalist is a Christian than a Universalist should know such things.
I asked you first I am not trying to be confrontational here I just asked a simple question and I am curious to know your belief on this, that's all.

PS: I don't recall that I have confirmed myself a Universalist although I do believe in a lot that they do.
 
Old 04-25-2010, 05:15 PM
 
696 posts, read 767,123 times
Reputation: 66
[quote=SisterKat;13898780]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aschultz73 View Post

I asked you first I am not trying to be confrontational here I just asked a simple question and I am curious to know your belief on this, that's all.

PS: I don't recall that I have confirmed myself a Universalist although I do believe in a lot that they do.
I understand you are not a confrontational person. But let me make a point.

My belief is unimportant. Christianity is not defined by what we believe, but what we know because God revealed it in His word. Only then can we believe. It is not just some weak attempt at displaying a belief system is just another denomination to make it sound equal to Christianity.

So when you state that you believe in alot that they do, the question is do you believe in what God has said or do you believe in a lot that they do. This is very improtant in knowing if one is sealed by the Holy Spirit.
 
Old 04-25-2010, 06:25 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 1,726,762 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airō View Post
BHfT, that has to be the worst rape of Scripture I have ever seen.
Excuse me? "Rape of scripture" is one the most vile things I've heard anyone say on this forum. That is a list of scriptures. Do you not believe the scriptures? You said that "we must go to the Word of God to determine God's will and His sure-fire test of how we can know we are saved." This is God's Word. I can't help it if you don't like what it says. If you choose not to believe that salvation is a complete work of God that was finished on the cross, and you have to do something to save yourselves, but you're not even sure what that is because you can't trust yourself, then go by all these scriptures.
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