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Old 04-19-2010, 06:35 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post

I kinda get the "forever and ever" just means ages upon ages or somethin like that.
You are correct, and in the context of the Age to Come, that never ends.
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Old 04-19-2010, 06:59 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
You are correct, and in the context of the Age to Come, that never ends.
But the age to come is when Jesus is supposed to reign and His reign does end. I Corinthian 15:24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power.

Anyway, what happened to the thousand-year reign? And then after that thousand year reign, what happens next?

And by the way, it is very strange that so many people talk about how this planet is supposed to be nuked or a huge war is supposed to happen or a comet is supposed to hit BEFORE Jesus has his reign. How is He supposed to reign on an uninhabitable planet?

And after that reign we are supposed to see the BIG war when Satan is loosed for a season.

There are more ages to come.

Jesus is going to finally, in the VERY end, turn EVERYTHING over to His Father.

I Corinthian 15:28 The Son Himself will be made subject to Him who put everything under him.


Last edited by herefornow; 04-19-2010 at 07:31 PM..
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Old 04-19-2010, 07:17 PM
 
3,632 posts, read 476,301 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
But the age to come is when Jesus is supposed to reign and His reign does end. What happened to the thousand-year reign? And then after that thousand year reign when the second resurrection happens we get the great white throne.

And by the way, it is very strange that so many people talk about how this planet is supposed to be nuked or a huge war is supposed to happen BEFORE Jesus has his reign. How is He supposed to reign on an uninhabitable planet?

And after that reign we are supposed to see the BIG war when Satan is loosed for a season.

There are more ages to come.

Jesus is going to finally, in the VERY end, turn EVERYTHING over to His Father
herefornow,

The 1000 year reign is mentioned in a book that also talks about "beasts" coming from the "sea" and a "woman" in the "sky" with "stars around her head. "

Also it says that these things were to happen

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Rev 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.

I believe that things are not all that futurist christianity wants us to believe.
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Old 04-19-2010, 07:33 PM
 
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i copied a portion of an article that makes one think about the translation of the word we know as eternal, there is something amiss:


Sodom's fiery judgment is "eternal" (Jude 7)—until—God "will restore the fortunes of Sodom" (Ez. 16:53-55);

Israel's "affliction is incurable" (Jer. 30:12)—until—the Lord "will restore health" and heal her wounds (Jer. 30:17);

The sin of Samaria "is incurable" (Mic. 1:9)—until—the Lord "will restore . . . the fortunes of Samaria." (Ez. 16:53);

Ammon is to become a "wasteland forever" and "rise no more" (Zeph. 2:9, Jer. 25:27)—until—the Lord will "restore the fortunes of the Ammonites" (Jer . 49:6);

An Ammonite or Mo abite is forbidden to enter the Lord's congregation "forever"—until—the tenth generation (Deut. 23:3);

Habakkuk tells us of mountains that were "everlasting", that is—until—they "were shattered" (Hab. 3:6);

The fire for Israel's sin offering (of a ram without blemish) is never to be put out. It shall be "perpetual"—until—Christ, the Lamb of God, dies for our sins. We now have a better covenant established on better promises (Lev. 6:12-13, Heb. 8:6-13);

God's waves of wrath roll over Jonah "forever"—until—the Lord delivers him from the large fish's belly on the third day (Jonah 2:6,10; 1:17);

Egypt and Elam will "rise no more" (Jer. 25:27)—until—the Lord will "restore the fortunes of Egypt" (Ez. 29:14) and "restore the fortunes of Elam" (Jer. 49:39).


"Moab is destroyed" (Jer. 48:4,42)—until—the Lord "will restore the fortune s of Moab" (Jer. 48:47);

· Israel's judgment lasts "forever"—until—the Spirit is poured out and God restores it (Isa. 32:13-15).

NOW. BEAR IN MIND THAT CHRIST CAME TO FULFILL THE WORDS OF THESE PROPHETS, NOT TO DESTROY THEM. (Matt. 5:17-

Strange isn't it that a word is translated "forever" but if you read a little further, and somewhere else it does have an end???
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Old 04-19-2010, 07:34 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
herefornow,

The 1000 year reign is mentioned in a book that also talks about "beasts" coming from the "sea" and a "woman" in the "sky" with "stars around her head. "

Also it says that these things were to happen

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Rev 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.

I believe that things are not all that futurist christianity wants us to believe.

I understand what you are saying. I guess I am a partial preterist, if that's a term I can use. But, do people actually believe in a physical reign of Christ here on earth, surrounded by immortal believers that he raised up for that purpose? The ELECT, I guess?
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Old 04-19-2010, 07:40 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,398,176 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dipidydoodaa View Post
i copied a portion of an article that makes one think about the translation of the word we know as eternal, there is something amiss:


Sodom's fiery judgment is "eternal" (Jude 7)—until—God "will restore the fortunes of Sodom" (Ez. 16:53-55);

Israel's "affliction is incurable" (Jer. 30:12)—until—the Lord "will restore health" and heal her wounds (Jer. 30:17);

The sin of Samaria "is incurable" (Mic. 1:9)—until—the Lord "will restore . . . the fortunes of Samaria." (Ez. 16:53);

Ammon is to become a "wasteland forever" and "rise no more" (Zeph. 2:9, Jer. 25:27)—until—the Lord will "restore the fortunes of the Ammonites" (Jer . 49:6);

An Ammonite or Mo abite is forbidden to enter the Lord's congregation "forever"—until—the tenth generation (Deut. 23:3);

Habakkuk tells us of mountains that were "everlasting", that is—until—they "were shattered" (Hab. 3:6);

The fire for Israel's sin offering (of a ram without blemish) is never to be put out. It shall be "perpetual"—until—Christ, the Lamb of God, dies for our sins. We now have a better covenant established on better promises (Lev. 6:12-13, Heb. 8:6-13);

God's waves of wrath roll over Jonah "forever"—until—the Lord delivers him from the large fish's belly on the third day (Jonah 2:6,10; 1:17);

Egypt and Elam will "rise no more" (Jer. 25:27)—until—the Lord will "restore the fortunes of Egypt" (Ez. 29:14) and "restore the fortunes of Elam" (Jer. 49:39).


"Moab is destroyed" (Jer. 48:4,42)—until—the Lord "will restore the fortune s of Moab" (Jer. 48:47);

· Israel's judgment lasts "forever"—until—the Spirit is poured out and God restores it (Isa. 32:13-15).

NOW. BEAR IN MIND THAT CHRIST CAME TO FULFILL THE WORDS OF THESE PROPHETS, NOT TO DESTROY THEM. (Matt. 5:17-

Strange isn't it that a word is translated "forever" but if you read a little further, and somewhere else it does have an end???
I know a little bit about the verses that say forever when they don't mean endless or eternal.

But, can somebody find me a verse that says "forever and ever" in the Old Testament that connects to something in the future that doesn't mean it was endless?

Can you find a verse with that EXACT PHRASE, "forever and ever," which had an ending in another verse? I've been looking for one.
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Old 04-19-2010, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
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Dan 7 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, [one] like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion [is] an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom [that] which shall not be destroyed.

1 Corinthians 15:24-26 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet. 26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death.

Christ's glorious power is made manifest in the second coming when he destroys/ed spiritual death and brought immortality. He puts, that is Christ, an end to all rule and authority. His reign never ends. let me explain....


1 Corinthians 15:25 For He must reign till (hou achris) He has put all enemies under His feet.

hou achris does not mean cessation or termination but is a point of reference.

Does Christ ever give up His reign?
Will there ever be a time when Jesus Christ will not reign?

Luke 1:31-33 And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bring forth a Son, and shall call His name JESUS. He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David. And He will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and of His kingdom there will be no end.

He reigns even unto the point that all his enemies are put under His feet. It is a point of reference. His reign will never end.

Micah 4:7 I will make the lame a remnant, And the outcast a strong nation; So the LORD will reign over them in Mount Zion From now on, even forever.

Hebrews 1:8 But to the Son He says: "Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your Kingdom.

Christ's rule never ends.
His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom and so is His reign.
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Old 04-19-2010, 08:33 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,506,710 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post

Those charts brought up some interesting questions for me. Are people still being born and dying when the elect are reigning? So they will be ruled by immortals but will die themselves? That would be interesting.
Yes, during the 1000 year reign people will still being born and still dying. I also believe this will be the case on the new earth as well.

Quote:
I believe in soul-sleep. But, if souls are sleeping, then they are not gonna care that they missed out on the reign. They just sleep and pop out wherever. Do you understand what I am saying?
The dead are dead. They are oblivious to whatever is going on. So let's say a person died in 1000 B.C. and they are resurrected in 5,000 A.D. To them, not even a second has passed.

Quote:
I actually have a whole lot of questions that I haven't really been able to form very well. I'm really confused on a lot of these issues. I'm still thinking.

(these questions aren't necessarily directed at you)
That's good.
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Old 04-19-2010, 08:45 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,398,176 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
Dan 7 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, [one] like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion [is] an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom [that] which shall not be destroyed.

1 Corinthians 15:24-26 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet. 26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death.

Christ's glorious power is made manifest in the second coming when he destroys/ed spiritual death and brought immortality. He puts, that is Christ, an end to all rule and authority. His reign never ends. let me explain....


1 Corinthians 15:25 For He must reign till (hou achris) He has put all enemies under His feet.

hou achris does not mean cessation or termination but is a point of reference.

Does Christ ever give up His reign?
Will there ever be a time when Jesus Christ will not reign?

Luke 1:31-33 And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bring forth a Son, and shall call His name JESUS. He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David. And He will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and of His kingdom there will be no end.

He reigns even unto the point that all his enemies are put under His feet. It is a point of reference. His reign will never end.

Micah 4:7 I will make the lame a remnant, And the outcast a strong nation; So the LORD will reign over them in Mount Zion From now on, even forever.

Hebrews 1:8 But to the Son He says: "Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your Kingdom.

Christ's rule never ends.
His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom and so is His reign.
How in the world does this happen then?

I Corinthian 15:28 The
Son Himself
will be made subject to Him who put everything under him.
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Old 04-19-2010, 08:46 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,398,176 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Yes, during the 1000 year reign people will still being born and still dying. I also believe this will be the case on the new earth as well.



The dead are dead. They are oblivious to whatever is going on. So let's say a person died in 1000 B.C. and they are resurrected in 5,000 A.D. To them, not even a second has passed.



That's good.
I don't mean you can't answer them. I just didn't want to cram a whole bunch of questions your way.
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