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Old 05-01-2010, 01:23 PM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,534 posts, read 31,936,781 times
Reputation: 9415

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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
I guess I missed the part where you made a point... What does the verse mean to you? and how does that have anything to do with universalism?
It doesn't have anything to do with universalism. Who said it does? It says believers will be with the Lord when they die. They do not go to Hades as Eusebius was trying to say, they go to be with the Lord. I used the verse to support my point, but of course, Eusebius ignored the point completely and started bickering about the use of quotation marks. It's ridiculous. And after that he attacked my spelling.

AND YOU'RE ACCUSING ME FOR BEING OFF TOPIC?????

 
Old 05-01-2010, 01:24 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,825 posts, read 9,825,065 times
Reputation: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Ladies and gentlemen, what you are seeing here is a prime example of universalist bickering. When they realize they have lost the battle, they drop the topic entirely and start bickering about spelling errors, use of quotation marks or some other meaningless detail.

They must think this is a great tactic because they use it in almost every debate. To me it is childish, and an admission that they have no actual arguments to make.

Take your pick, use either "is" or "and" because it doesn't change the meaning in any way, and either way blows the universalist argument out of the water.

Over and out. I am done here
I know what you mean.

It's more than childish. It's offering a salvation plan to unbelievers that God does not offer. It's rejecting the truth

Matthew 12:37
For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."

John 12:48
There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day.

Ephesians 5:6
Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God's wrath comes on those who are disobedient.

2 Timothy 2:14
Keep reminding them of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen.

I know of one who have been ruined by their empty words. Hopefully, prayerfully the truth will un-sway our friend, Ilene.


Jesus isn't speaking about anything else than hell or heaven in Matthew 12:37. No one is "acquitted or condemned" to or from physical death or the grave.

Last edited by twin.spin; 05-01-2010 at 01:30 PM.. Reason: poor spelling
 
Old 05-01-2010, 01:27 PM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,534 posts, read 31,936,781 times
Reputation: 9415
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeallcomm View Post
Finn

Before you leave, I must say I am sorry for joking around here. I was wrong to do so. I just been asking simple questions here that have been dodged every time.
I couldn't care less about your attempt to ridicule and/or humiliate me. Seriously. I get it from your kind all the time, and I have immunity against it.

As I already told you (twice) your questions have been answered in this thread, and I am not going to repeat them to you only because you are too lazy to read the thred.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 01:29 PM
 
309 posts, read 295,448 times
Reputation: 60
Ok.....let try this again then and lets see who 'actually' does NOT answer the question or just 'changes the subjuct' as you say.

ANYBODY WHO WISHES CAN ANSWER THIS QUESTION. ANYONE ON THIS THREAD CAN ANSWER THIS QUESTION IF THEY WANT TO...SO HERE IT IS.

ACCORDING TO THE "SCCCRRIIIPPTTUURES", WHERE IS DAVID RITE NOW AS WE SPEAK????
 
Old 05-01-2010, 01:30 PM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,534 posts, read 31,936,781 times
Reputation: 9415
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
I know what you mean.

It's more than childish. It's offering a salvation plan to unbelievers that God does not offer. It's rejecting the truth

Matthew 12:37
For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."

John 12:48
There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day.

Ephesians 5:6
Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God's wrath comes on those who are disobedient.

2 Timothy 2:14
Keep reminding them of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen.

I know of one who have been ruined by their empty words.

Hopefully, prayerfully the truth will un-sway our friend, Ilene.


Jesus isn't speaking about anything else than hell or heaven in Matthew 12:37. No one is "acquitted or condemned" to or from physical death or the grave.
Amen. Satan keeps busy these days, and these boards are proof of it.

How many believers are there left around here? Not many, and they are outnumbered by preachers of false doctrine.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 01:36 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,447,545 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeallcomm View Post
Accually I have to agree with Finn on this one. There is actually a translation of scripture that states "to depart is to be with Christ." in that verse. It is the FJV translation, have you ever heard of it??
I have not heard of that translation. What does FJV stand for?

But it is really improper to translate that verse "to depart is to be with Christ."

The word here translated "depart" in our versions occurs only twice more in the inspired Scriptures, once more as a verb and once as a noun. In Luke 12:36 it has been rendered "when He will return from the wedding." Since they have rendered it "return" in its only other occurrence, why not give it that sense in this passage? A study of the context will show that the word "depart" will not satisfy that passage. They will not open to Him when He departs from the feast, but when He arrives at the point from which He had gone. This is important. The word does not fix our attention on the point of departure but on the point of arrival. And, agreeing with this, it does not involve a single act merely, but the repetition of an act. This is found also in the form of the word itself. The prefix ANA- means back, or again; LUOO, means to loose. From it we have the English word analysis, almost the same as the Greek. And this is what Paul meant when he refers to his "departure" (2 Tim.4:6). It is his analysis or dissolution, or as he parallels it in the passage, he is to be poured forth as a libation. As we have already seen, death is such a dissolution. It is an analysis or return of the elements to their original habitat. In Philippians,
however, the apostle is contrasting a return with his death. Hence it cannot refer to his own dissolution. It is very far better than that. It is nothing less than the return of Christ Himself. This is, indeed, very far better.

That this is intended we are further assured by the next statement: "the being with Christ." How shall we be with Him? In death? No! When He comes and calls us to Himself in clouds, then (and not till then) we read "and so shall we ever be with the Lord" (1 Thess.4:17).
The meaning of this word is amply proven, even by the scant evidence offered by the sacred text. It does not occur in the translation of the Hebrew Scriptures, but there are several instances in the Apocrypha. These are, of course, not inspired, nevertheless they are admissible to show the usage of this word at the time. They fully confirm the fact that, we are to regard this word as recording the reversal of an action and to fix our attention, not on the point of departure, but on the destination.

ANALUOO IN THE SEPTUAGINT

Esdras 3: 3 And when they had eaten and drunken, and being
satisfied were gone home.
Tobit 2: 9 The same night also I returned from the burial
Judith 13: 1 Now when evening was come his servants made haste
to depart
Wisdom 2: 1 neither was there any man known to have returned
from the grave (hades).
5:12 as when an arrow is shot...it parteth the air,
which... cometh together again,
16:14 neither the soul received up cometh again.
Syr. 3:15 thy sins also shall melt away, as the ice in the
fair summer weather.
2 Mac. 8:25 but lacking time they returned :
9: 1 About that time came Antiochus...out of...Persia.
12: 7 he went backward, as if he would return...
15:28 Now when the battle was done, returning with
great joy

(Unsearchable Riches Vol.6 pp.180,181)
 
Old 05-01-2010, 01:40 PM
 
309 posts, read 295,448 times
Reputation: 60
Eusebius....Im sorry. Please forgive me. I was joking.

But great post though.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 01:42 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,447,545 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
I know what you mean.

It's more than childish. It's offering a salvation plan to unbelievers that God does not offer. It's rejecting the truth

Matthew 12:37
For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."

John 12:48
There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day.

Ephesians 5:6
Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God's wrath comes on those who are disobedient.

2 Timothy 2:14
Keep reminding them of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen.

I know of one who have been ruined by their empty words. Hopefully, prayerfully the truth will un-sway our friend, Ilene.
Why would Ilene want to go back to the vomit you and your ilk so much enjoy?


Quote:
Jesus isn't speaking about anything else than hell or heaven in Matthew 12:37. No one is "acquitted or condemned" to or from physical death or the grave.
And yet Jesus told Paul that God is going to save ALL mankind because Jesus ransomed all mankind (read 1 Timothy 2:4-6 if you don't believe me).

And God is already every man's Saviour even if they don't know it yet (1 Timothy 4:10) and we are supposed to charge and teach these things (1 Timothy 4:11). Oops! Guess who is disobedient on teaching these things? I wouldn't want to be you when your works are tried by fire. Oh, you'll still be saved yet thus as through fire. Good luck in that day. Wouldn't wanna be ya!
 
Old 05-01-2010, 01:43 PM
 
Location: SC Foothills
8,830 posts, read 9,757,325 times
Reputation: 58198
[quote=twin.spin;13989691]
Quote:
I know of one who have been ruined by their empty words. Hopefully, prayerfully the truth will un-sway our friend, Ilene.
Ruined? Un-swayed?? Come on TS, you know me better than that. Or at least I thought you did. There's nothing wrong with the universalist message as I'm finding out.....I have a mind of my own, a heart as big as Texas and enough Holy Spirit in me to get to the truth. I hope you can see that I am not being swayed or seduced or blinded by anything....quite the opposite actually. They did not come to me, I came to them wanting to know more. And they have been most gracious in helping me and full of love. I don't see that here. But you're not the first to condemn me. Good thing God has allowed my skin to become thicker since being on C-D.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 01:44 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,447,545 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeallcomm View Post
Eusebius....Im sorry. Please forgive me. I was joking.

But great post though.
Oh I get it . . . FJV translation is the Finn_Jarber translation! Ha ha ha! Good one! I googled it and couldn't find it. Probably one of those Satanic Bibles only they know about
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