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Old 04-26-2010, 11:25 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,385,346 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
I found that too .......


Quote:
Originally Posted by ans57 View Post
Eloquently said herefornow...

I went through the same darkness...having a mother who constantly announced...that people who ate pork or wear jewelry...etc...go to hell. I grew up hearing that often. I love my mom and pray that someday...she'll let go of the heavy yoke she's been asked to carry and feel GOD'S healing love.

Blessings...
I am sorry about your mom. It can be a VERY HEAVY burden for her and for those around her.


Didn't get your quote in here, Spm62, but, thank you.
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Old 04-26-2010, 11:30 PM
 
5,500 posts, read 4,422,036 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post




I am sorry about your mom. It can be a VERY HEAVY burden for her and for those around her.
Thanks...how do you quote more than one OPs with one response?...

Last edited by ans57; 04-26-2010 at 11:31 PM.. Reason: typos
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Old 04-26-2010, 11:41 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
702 posts, read 845,295 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aschultz73 View Post
I understand sir, but there is no grey area. Christ did ask for them to be forgiven, but Christ set the condition for belief. All must profess Him and His words and Scripture are Him for He is God. Thus those who twist His words are not of Him and are false teachers.
This too is my personal confession in all truth before God:

Acts 24:14-16 (Concordant Literal Translation)...)
14 "Yet I am avowing this to you, that, according to the way which they are terming a sect, thus am I offering divine service to the hereditary God, believing all that is written, according to the law and in the prophets,
15 having an expectation in God, which these themselves also are anticipating, that there shall be a resurrection which is impending for both the just and the unjust.
16 "In this, I am exerting myself also, to have a conscience which is no stumbling block toward God and men, continually.

"But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets..." (Acts 24:14, AV)
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Old 04-27-2010, 12:25 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,385,346 times
Reputation: 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by ans57 View Post
Thanks...how do you quote more than one OPs with one response?...

Hi, ans57. I was just on my way to bed and saw your question.

You need to click the tab next to the quote tab. It will have quotation marks and a little plus sign. It will show "Multi-Quote This Message" if you hover your mouse over it.

If you click it, it will turn orange. You can do that as many times as you want with as many messages as you want, I believe. It will then put all those quotes in your reply when you FINALLY do hit "Quote."

Hope I didn't confuse you.
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:31 AM
 
5,500 posts, read 4,422,036 times
Reputation: 5147
Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
Hi, ans57. I was just on my way to bed and saw your question.

You need to click the tab next to the quote tab. It will have quotation marks and a little plus sign. It will show "Multi-Quote This Message" if you hover your mouse over it.

If you click it, it will turn orange. You can do that as many times as you want with as many messages as you want, I believe. It will then put all those quotes in your reply when you FINALLY do hit "Quote."

Hope I didn't confuse you.
Thank you herefornow...
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:14 PM
 
696 posts, read 765,939 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
Actually I do believe in most that you have said ........ I thought that there were different gifts given to different members of the body

1Co 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
1Co 12:4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
1Co 12:5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
1Co 12:6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
1Co 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
1Co 12:8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
1Co 12:9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
1Co 12:10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
1Co 12:11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

Yes I believe that Jesus is our teacher, .............. it is when you start denouncing those that do not believe your interpretation of scripture and saying they are "false teachers" that you seems to be setting yourself up as a teacher that is not fallible.

An example of being fallible is where someone believes in futurism and "teachers" that it is true to Gods word ....... then after studying scripture finds that most if not all prophecy has been fulfilled in 70AD that would make them a false teacher in your eyes would it not?
You imply that God has left scripture open to interpretation. Show me where scripture says we can interpret anything to our own view. God has one absolute truth in scripture.

Your application of futurism vs preterism is not a matter of interpretation. I know of many who are preterists on here and they are my brothers in Christ as I am a futurist. But scripture does not say we are saved by our knowledge of prophecy, but by the blood of Christ.

Ultimately without doing so your arguement leads back to Universalism which I know you want to avoid so in the intrest of not getting deleted again for denomination bashing I will stay away. But I tell you this truly scripture is not a matter of interpretation. That is a wordly concept fostered by weaker world views such as postmodernism. When you shed such views of the world then can you understand.

Scripture is littered with false teachers who deny, pervert, and twist His word. To deny this is to deny scripture. If you think I have denounced anything you still dont understand the difference between the conviction of the Holy Spirit and the coming Judgement of God. If one does not head such conviction by the Holy Spirit then they will face the coming judgement and they are false teachers.

The problem sir is you are trying to manifest commonalities without your belief system. Ultimately you will fall back to your belief system even if you try to not do so.
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:22 PM
 
696 posts, read 765,939 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
If someone were to stone you to death, and in the middle of dying, you looked up, saw TRUE LOVE, and said, "Father, forgive them," what do you suppose your Dad would do? (Stephen, Martyred by Saul/Paul)

(especially, in Christ's case, You are your Dad, as traditional Christians believe)

In most of Christianity, Dad sets these guys on fire forever.


I Timothy 4:10 For to this end we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe.
Thank you for proving my point. There are teachers and there are those who are false. You apply Universalism not understanding the difference between conviction by the Holy Spirit versus the coming Judgement of God.
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:33 PM
 
696 posts, read 765,939 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
There is a HUGE frustration for me here, There are quite a few intelligent posters on these threads who have studied for YEARS and know the Bible INSIDE AND OUT, but many of you will not listen to them, AT ALL! You will not concede even ONE LITTLE POINT, ever. WHY? You tell me. NOT ONE person on these boards is perfect and neither are the men that give us the commentaries; and, yes, we do get a lot of information from them, whether we realize it or not. I understand that there are posters here, including myself, who do not know the scriptures inside and out, but we ARE able to study on our own and GLEAN information from those studies.

ALL interpretation can be clouded by fleshly thinking and FEAR.

I find it very frustrating that so many of us have STUDIED and pondered on so much of what we speak, and still nobody listens. I thinks it stinks to high heaven, and I am baffled......really. The first Christians out there did NOT have Seminary. They had the SPIRIT!

Seminary does not magically give one the Holy Spirit, and if you don't have that Spirit, you CANNOT discern problems in the scriptures. Even the students that do have the Spirit are not going to question, for the most part. They pay MONEY to go to these places and they TRUST their teachers. If these students have any little question in the back of their brains, they stifle them, mostly because of fear, in my humble opinion.

If they do end up seriously questioning, which MOST don't, they are given double-talk and other men's books to read, which of course puts cash in those men's pockets. And, many teachers out there are false teachers, right? You couldn't have so many denominations if they weren't. Am I correct?

Really?????

Anyhow, most of us here, I pray, are NOT intentionally misleading anybody. We have studied and are debating, as you are, the information that we have been given. The curse on false teachers, I believe, was for those scribes and false teachers who were KNOWINGLY and INTENTIONALLY misleading for monetary gain, power, and control. Or their motivations were foul. They were trying to lead human beings, who were given the same HOLY SPIRIT these men were given, back under men's control.

Makes one think.......
Really am I to accept what is false for being false. Am I to accept an interpretation simply because it is an interpretation? Show me this by scripture. The problem you cant understand is there a manifest difference between what is Christian and what is not.

Never did I say seminary gave anyone the Holy Spirit. But in the 1sy century there are numerous mentions of people who did not have the Spirit who claimed they did. Now you want to apply it one way, but not accept the other. There is false teaching here and it is made manifest daily. Would you now discount it?

What men of the Holy Spirit have led men back under mans control? Show this by scripture. Am I now to assume God leads man back under mans control to deception. One who leads to deception does not have the Holy Spirit. You imply all have the Holy Spirit with your words? Scripturally support this.

Christianity is one absolute Truth. It is not open to interpretation and it is not a combination of views. The problem is you make God out to be great, but then make man able to overcome God's word by the device of interpretation.
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:37 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,284 posts, read 20,927,906 times
Reputation: 9971
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aschultz73 View Post
Christianity is one absolute Truth. It is not open to interpretation and it is not a combination of views.
But the second you attempt to explain any passage of scripture you ARE putting an interpretation to it.
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:42 PM
 
3,581 posts, read 458,427 times
Reputation: 386
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
But the second you attempt to explain any passage of scripture you ARE putting an interpretation to it.
Correct -- and all of christianity's denominations seem to be made up of mens interpretations of the scriptures.

Pastors go the seminaries and are taught the interpretations by men to pass on to the flock.
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