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Old 05-05-2010, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
7,933 posts, read 8,506,993 times
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So what do you think?

**************

I view the first part of the book of Genesis as basically saying that God created everything. It should be noted that Genesis was written for the Hebrew mindset. We (westerners) are of the Greek mindset. By Greek I mean we follow the Greek way of thinking and looking at the world. We want precise answers, facts, figures, order of occurrence and dates, etc.

The Hebrew mindset is primarily interested in concepts, with facts and figures being secondary. What mattered to the Hebrews is that God created the Universe. The order and time of the events were not important to the Hebrew mind.

As I see it you run into problems applying Greek thinking to a Hebrew document. That is why the creation story does not make sense to the scientific mind.

Of course we always must bear in mind that God is not limited to obey the laws of nature. So, if God wanted to create the universe in six, 24 hour days He could.

*************
Just so you know I believe all of the Bible to be true. But……….some of the Bible is poetry, some is symbolic, some conceptual, but most is literal (esp the NT).
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Old 05-05-2010, 03:09 PM
 
Location: New York City
668 posts, read 799,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
That is why the creation story does not make sense to the scientific mind.
So-called scientific mind know nothing about God and creation because it is difficult to understand.
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Old 05-05-2010, 06:15 PM
 
5,500 posts, read 4,421,356 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
So what do you think?

**************

I view the first part of the book of Genesis as basically saying that God created everything. It should be noted that Genesis was written for the Hebrew mindset. We (westerners) are of the Greek mindset. By Greek I mean we follow the Greek way of thinking and looking at the world. We want precise answers, facts, figures, order of occurrence and dates, etc.

The Hebrew mindset is primarily interested in concepts, with facts and figures being secondary. What mattered to the Hebrews is that God created the Universe. The order and time of the events were not important to the Hebrew mind.

As I see it you run into problems applying Greek thinking to a Hebrew document. That is why the creation story does not make sense to the scientific mind.


Of course we always must bear in mind that God is not limited to obey the laws of nature. So, if God wanted to create the universe in six, 24 hour days He could.

*************
Just so you know I believe all of the Bible to be true. But……….some of the Bible is poetry, some is symbolic, some conceptual, but most is literal (esp the NT).
Aye...
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Old 05-05-2010, 07:48 PM
 
Location: Hagerman, Idaho
2,223 posts, read 4,849,040 times
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Mr5150, you are on to something. Indeed we need to get RID of those Greco-Roman reading glasses and put on the Hebrew glasses if we are to get a clue of the intent and meaning of the scriptures. It was penned by Hebrews with that mindset in mind. It is astounding what one discovers when delving into scripture from a Hebrew mindset. Greek is a "literal" language and Hebrew is NOT.
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Old 05-05-2010, 11:50 PM
 
Location: Gulf Coast Texas
26,265 posts, read 14,140,123 times
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It's not a Hebrew mindset or a Greek mindset - it's a faith mindset.

Heb. 11:3 -
By faith we understand that the worlds were prepared by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things which are visible.
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Old 05-06-2010, 12:02 AM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,316,236 times
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Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
It's not a Hebrew mindset or a Greek mindset - it's a faith mindset.

Heb. 11:3 -
By faith we understand that the worlds were prepared by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things which are visible.
I agree. It matters not if one is Hebrew or Greek. Both mindsets are dead towards the scriptures. The important thing is having a mind born of the Spirit. Wihout this renewed mind, and in the words of Solomon: "All is vanity and striving after wind".
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Old 05-08-2010, 05:34 PM
 
Location: In God's Hand
1,315 posts, read 1,530,765 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
So what do you think?

**************

I view the first part of the book of Genesis as basically saying that God created everything. It should be noted that Genesis was written for the Hebrew mindset. We (westerners) are of the Greek mindset. By Greek I mean we follow the Greek way of thinking and looking at the world. We want precise answers, facts, figures, order of occurrence and dates, etc.

The Hebrew mindset is primarily interested in concepts, with facts and figures being secondary. What mattered to the Hebrews is that God created the Universe. The order and time of the events were not important to the Hebrew mind.

As I see it you run into problems applying Greek thinking to a Hebrew document. That is why the creation story does not make sense to the scientific mind.

Of course we always must bear in mind that God is not limited to obey the laws of nature. So, if God wanted to create the universe in six, 24 hour days He could.
*************
Just so you know I believe all of the Bible to be true. But……….some of the Bible is poetry, some is symbolic, some conceptual, but most is literal (esp the NT).
If any part of it was considered conceptual, how could anyone stone anyone for being a heretick since it would be open for interpretation and different applications? Wasn't the Bible the basis for prosecuting a false prophet? Was not Jesus crucified because the Jews had not understood the scriptures?

Considering the extreme care that a Jewish scholars has to go through when copying the scriptures of the Old Testament, there are a series of checklist for them to follow and if there was one mistake and the entire scroll was destroyed:

Perhaps if you are implying conceptual in regards to Genesis, then how do you rate the words of Jesus when He referred to Genesis?

Mark 2: 23And it came to pass, that he went through the corn fields on the sabbath day; and his disciples began, as they went, to pluck the ears of corn. 24And the Pharisees said unto him, Behold, why do they on the sabbath day that which is not lawful? 25And he said unto them, Have ye never read what David did, when he had need, and was an hungred, he, and they that were with him? 26How he went into the house of God in the days of Abiathar the high priest, and did eat the shewbread, which is not lawful to eat but for the priests, and gave also to them which were with him? 27And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: 28Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

It seems for His word to have merit, then there has to be some literal application for these Jews to give charge just as there are some literal application to put down that charge.

Or here:

Matthew 19:3The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? 4And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, 5And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

Mark 10: 4And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away. 5And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept. 6But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. 7For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; 8And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh. 9What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

So we see here again that Jesus referred to Genesis by which the then present day laws were set upon and yet misapplied by the Jews. Jesus referred to the first act of creation and the first marriage by which Moses suffered a bill of divorcement to give unto the Jews because of their hardness of heart.

Jesus went on to expose the evil of it with a judgment:

Matthew 19: 7They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? 8He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. 9And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

So I see Jesus validating creation and the first marriage in Genesis as both came about from God.
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Old 05-08-2010, 05:54 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
7,933 posts, read 8,506,993 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enow View Post
So I see Jesus validating creation and the first marriage in Genesis as both came about from God.
Indeed. Both came about from God.

The problem that my little paragraph in the OP is addressing is the one of how old in the earth. What people have done is apply math to the Genesis and "discovered" that Adam was created in 4004BC.

Well, guess what? They have applied the Greek way of thinking to this Hebrew document. As a result we have all of these people running around saying the world is 6000 years old when it is clear that recorded human history is closer to 10,000 years old. Just google Jerico.

Anyway, it is clear that the world is older that 6000 years. It's not that the Bible is wrong we just have to understand what is being said. All of the Bible is true, but not all of the Bible is literal.
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Old 05-08-2010, 06:19 PM
 
425 posts, read 273,778 times
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In this day and age , if you don't have a grasp on Egyptian and Sumerian systems of religion and science your not going to grasp Genesis. Modern science is based on a split in teaching that occurred during the reformation period. I would suggest reading some George Berkeley on materialism. science and Christianity both became materialistic through the Reformation. The more I read about Egyptian studies one thing becomes absolutly clear. What we call history/progress of mankind is the history of personal misconceptions / misperceptions of the mankind's state of consciousness from generation to generation throughout the ages. I can assure the readers here for the most part none of you can derive and original context from the English bible , you can only circle around the garden of Eden , you may not enter. I don't mean this as an insult but as a revelation. The second coming and the outpouring of the Holy spirit will be full of ancient tongues . It is written Egypt's offerings will be reformed and acceptable to YHVH. I submit that in order for the powers that were given through the Holy Spirit back in the day to return in full , the Egyptian language will have to regenerate as well. Egypt is not simply an allegory it is a nation and a language and is a subset of the wisdom within the Torah.
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Old 05-10-2010, 06:48 PM
 
1,492 posts, read 2,225,729 times
Reputation: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
So what do you think?

**************

I view the first part of the book of Genesis as basically saying that God created everything. It should be noted that Genesis was written for the Hebrew mindset. We (westerners) are of the Greek mindset. By Greek I mean we follow the Greek way of thinking and looking at the world. We want precise answers, facts, figures, order of occurrence and dates, etc.

The Hebrew mindset is primarily interested in concepts, with facts and figures being secondary. What mattered to the Hebrews is that God created the Universe. The order and time of the events were not important to the Hebrew mind.

As I see it you run into problems applying Greek thinking to a Hebrew document. That is why the creation story does not make sense to the scientific mind.
I agree but I also would add that I think it was written that way (very simply)so that anyone could understand it.You need not be a genius to discern it.
You only tend to run into problems when trying cause the scripture to be more complicated than it is.IOW-God is saying, 'this is the way it is,plain and simple.I have spelled it out for you.You don't need to know any more than this, and I do not expect you to be able to understand the exact mechanisms responsible.Just be content for now,knowing you will someday know more'.
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