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Originally Posted by I LOVE NORTH CAROLINA It does burden me that people are going to be eternally separated from God because they have rejected Him, but like Mike said it is their choice. That is why it is so important to tell about Jesus NOW, because they won't get another opportunity after this life is gone.
[quote=Finn_Jarber;14099141] There is no point in crying over spilled milk. [quote]
I'll ask you what I asked Mike that I don't think he answered. Do you believe that view is Christ-like? We are supposed to become more and more like Christ. Do you believe His attitude is there's no point in crying over spilled milk? What about spilled blood? If his blood doesn't have the power to save all, that blood was spilled and wasted.
What about spilled blood? If his blood doesn't have the power to save all, that blood was spilled and wasted.
Yes, it is a scriptual view. It was never His intention to save those who willfully reject him. He created hell for such people. Your heart has been hardened if you can't see it although it has been proven to you dozens and dozens of times. You always come back to repeat your standard lines as if nothing had been said before.
Moderator cut: flame
2 Conrinthians 11:13-15 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.
Last edited by Miss Blue; 05-09-2010 at 01:36 PM..
Wow, that's what I call a very hardened heart! Amazing. I see nothing in your posts or your beliefs that make me desire to know God. Those that are Christ's are said to be the SALT of the earth and the LIGHT of the world. All I sense when I read your posts is great darkness. I find it astonishing as well that you believe we all have free will and that most people will freely choose to be eternally tormented in hell or the lake of fire. I was raised on this kind of teaching and it made my soul sick for many years until God delivered me from the bondage of it. You can see anything you want to see in the bible. It is the condition of your heart that determines how you SEE. Even Jesus said to be CAREFUL HOW YOU HEAR.
Heartsong
The only way so many can fail in this life is if they believe they are succeeding. No one would freely choose to fail . . . that is nonsense. There will be many surprised "hardened hearts", I fear . . luckily there will be recourse for reconciliation ("refinement") . . . unpleasant though it may be.
Yes, it is a scriptual view. It was never His intention to save those who willfully reject him. He created hell for such people. Your heart has been hardened if you can't see it although it has been proven to you dozens and dozens of times. You always come back to repeat your standard lines as if nothing had been said before.
Moderator cut: edit
2 Conrinthians 11:13-15 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.
Jesus said forgive them for they know not what they do.
Are those who crusified Him forgiven or not?
Remember Jesus also said the Father heard him ALWAYS
Last edited by Miss Blue; 05-09-2010 at 01:38 PM..
PS "You get what you deserve" is Biblical. You cannot accept it, so you went with something more convenient.
The issue is the word "deserve" . . . what could we possibly do in a life less than a century long that could "deserve" an eternity of torture??? Satan has already corrupted the "written word" . . . which is why we are told the "letter killeth." Literal reading under the veil of ignorance (and corruption by Satan) is why it killeth. It hardens the heart and kills part of your soul and its "love for each other."Everyone keeps waiting for the deception to occur . . . it already HAS and it infects the entire church.
As Paul makes clear in 2 Thessalonians 1:9, those who do not obey the Gospel (believe in Christ for salvation) will suffer eternal destruction.
2 Thessalonians 1:7 And to give relief to you who are afflected and to us as well when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire, 8) dealing out retribution to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9) And these will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power.
In Matthew 10:28, Jesus speaks of the destuction of the soul and body in hell.
Matt. 10:28 ''And do not fear those who kill the body, but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.'
The destruction is eternal-AIONION-Strong's Number is G166, and I have provided several links on the first post of this thread which speak to the fact that the Greek word AIONION is used with reference to things eternal.
The destruction is not that of the cessation of existence, but rather is the eternal ruination and uselessness and suffering of the wicked in hell.
The English word 'destroy' is translated from the Greek word 'APOLLUMI'.
Respected Greek scholar W.E. Vine stated in his Expository Dictionary of New Testament Word's, ''The idea is not extinction, but ruin, loss, not of being but of well-being.''
For more on what other knowledgable and respected Greek scholars say about the meaning of the word destruction as used for those in hell, please see the folowing link...
These are but two of the many Scriptures which make it clear to any reasonable person that the unbeliever suffers eternally in hell.
This post is for the purpose of encouraging those who care about the truth of God's word with regard to the eternal punishment that awaits those who reject Christ as Savior, and who wish to understand that universalism is a false doctrine, but who may not have as yet done so, to go into the websites listed in the first post on this thread. They are full of invaluable information and will prove to any reasonable person that not all men will be saved.
Last edited by Michael Way; 05-09-2010 at 11:54 AM..
What can you do to deserve it? If you reject Christ, you have done enough to deserve it. The Bible is painfully clear about it.
Compare the "Father forgive them they know not what they do" attitude of Jesus with your "letter" of the written word "Father if they reject Me Torture them for eternity" attitude. Accepting WHICH attitude . . . the "letter" or the Spirit of Jesus . . . is REJECTING Christ?
Compare the "Father forgive them they know not what they do" attitude of Jesus with your "letter" of the written word "Father if they reject Me Torture them for eternity" attitude. Accepting WHICH attitude . . . the "letter" or the Spirit of Jesus . . . is REJECTING Christ?
Amen!! I guess some think God told Jesus, "No, Son. I know you want me to forgive them even though they don't understand what they do, but I'd rather get revenge and torture them forever. Your sacrifice is good, but not good enough for that level of mercy. Sorry."
And the sad thing is that it is all in your heart... or if you claim the bible's words say this then the bible is full of painfully clear torture... either way it's a sad representation of the God I am familiar with.
Too bad you can't take God's mercy as seriously as you do eternal torture!
The Bible uses word "torment", not "torture", but close enough. And no, it does not go away, but converting to universalism.
This post is for the purpose of encouraging those who care about the truth of God's word with regard to the eternal punishment that awaits those who reject Christ as Savior, and who wish to understand that universalism is a false doctrine, but who may not have as yet done so, to go into the websites listed in the first post on this thread. They are full of invaluable information and will prove to any reasonable person that not all men will be saved.
Why don't you also use this thread to warn the SFS (sorry for sin) "false doctrine" believers? You said in the post below, "If you try to work up some kind of sorrow for your sins as a condition for salvation, you have added your work to the work of Christ on the Cross and you are NOT saved."
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I guess some think God told Jesus, "No, Son. I know you want me to forgive them even though they don't understand what they do, but I'd rather get revenge and torture them forever. Your sacrifice is good, but not good enough for that level of mercy. Sorry."