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Old 05-11-2010, 01:38 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,390,352 times
Reputation: 437

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And these will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power.

The word "Eternal" can only properly be used next to the word "God," as God is the only thing that is eternal.

What word (in place of Eternal) should be used in the above verse?
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Old 05-11-2010, 01:39 AM
 
3,448 posts, read 2,592,588 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stargazzer View Post
No where in scripture does it say........If you fail to believe in hell and live in the goodness of the message you WILL go to hell.....
So find that and I will pay attention and address.......
otherwise ...retract statement
Thats what I thought....I'll tell you what.....take until tom if you have to and I'll check back
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Old 05-11-2010, 01:41 AM
 
20,335 posts, read 15,721,845 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stargazzer View Post
No where in scripture does it say........If you fail to believe in hell and live in the goodness of the message you WILL go to hell.....
So find that and I will pay attention and address.......
otherwise ...retract statement
You are denying the existence of hell are you not? In so doing, you are in direct opposition to the revealed word of God.
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Old 05-11-2010, 01:45 AM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
2,031 posts, read 2,693,931 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
You are denying the existence of hell are you not? In so doing, you are in direct opposition to the revealed word of God.
I agree with you Mike. Universalists believe God has revealed His true plan and we are deceived by Satan. Someone is wrong in this and I'll stick with God's Word! If they aren't following God, how can they know Him? Wouldn't they, when shown their error, come back to Him and yet they don't, which to me means, they never knew Him.
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Old 05-11-2010, 01:51 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,390,352 times
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What most of the original Universalists of old, and even Conservative Evangelical Universalists, deny is Dante's version of Hell or the "let's set these guys on fire forever" hell.

Many people "in the know" believe in "hell," as in the Old English word Hell. Hell the potatoes, hell the roof, and so on. It meant to cover. Not too hard to understand.

Of course there is the Germanic Hel, goddess of the underworld, but I think I know which one the KJV was going for.

Last edited by herefornow; 05-11-2010 at 02:05 AM..
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Old 05-11-2010, 01:57 AM
 
20,335 posts, read 15,721,845 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
And these will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power.

The word "Eternal" can only properly be used next to the word "God," as God is the only thing that is eternal.

What word (in place of Eternal) should be used in the above verse?
The lake of fire is eternal. The claim to the contrary is a typical universalist error.

The Hebrew concept of time and "aionios" and "aion"

BIBLE STUDY MANUALS: WORD STUDY ON AIONIOS, 'AIONIOS' LIFE MEANS ETERNAL LIFE

Aionios---An In Depth Study

L. Ray Smith, bibletruths.com -- critique

On the Greek words for Eternity and Eternal

A look at the phrase "forever and ever" | Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry

The many skilled and learned translators of the various translations knew what they were doing when they translated as eternal, the passages referring to hell.
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Old 05-11-2010, 02:00 AM
 
20,335 posts, read 15,721,845 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
What most people here are denying is Dante's version of Hell or the "let's set these guys on fire forever" hell.
Many people "in the know" believe in "hell," as in the Old English word Hell. Hell the potatoes, hell the roof, and so on. It meant to cover. Not too hard to understand.

Of course there is the Germanic Hel, goddess of the underworld, but I think I know which one the KJV was going for.
See article in original post.

Last edited by Mike555; 05-11-2010 at 02:45 AM..
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Old 05-11-2010, 02:08 AM
 
3,448 posts, read 2,592,588 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
You are denying the existence of hell are you not? In so doing, you are in direct opposition to the revealed word of God.
No play on words please. I do not "believe" there is a hell
I "believe" there is a god however like all do not "know" there is a God
Deity's all ask to "believe" in God not know there is a God
No where in scripture is it specifically outlined that even though one lives in virtue and conformity with scripture "failure" to "know" or believe that a hell exists will condemn one to hell.

You could not find as it is NOT WRITTEN therefore retract statement
that scripture is being rejected. As well,

I did not give you the authority to judge myself and either did the creator
you may want to be a little contrite about your ignorance
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Old 05-11-2010, 02:14 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,390,352 times
Reputation: 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
The lake of fire is eternal. The claim to the contrary is a typical universalist error.

The Hebrew concept of time and "aionios" and "aion"

BIBLE STUDY MANUALS: WORD STUDY ON AIONIOS, 'AIONIOS' LIFE MEANS ETERNAL LIFE

Aionios---An In Depth Study

L. Ray Smith, bibletruths.com -- critique

On the Greek words for Eternity and

Eternal


A look at the phrase "forever and ever" | Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry

The many skilled and learned translators of the various translations knew what they were doing when they translated as eternal, the passages referring to hell.

Thanks for those links, but I have already read most of them in the past. They make even less sense now than they did before I started studying. I
STUDY and I STUDY! I do not want to be ashamed before Christ.

I am not making light of these things as the people I've been around for the
last 30 or so years can tell you if you were to ever meet them!

Last edited by herefornow; 05-11-2010 at 02:31 AM..
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Old 05-11-2010, 02:18 AM
 
3,448 posts, read 2,592,588 times
Reputation: 478
Quote:
Originally Posted by stargazzer View Post
No play on words please. I do not "believe" there is a hell
I "believe" there is a god however like all do not "know" there is a God
Deity's all ask to "believe" in God not know there is a God
No where in scripture is it specifically outlined that even though one lives in virtue and conformity with scripture "failure" to "know" or believe that a hell exists will condemn one to hell.

You could not find as it is NOT WRITTEN therefore retract statement
that scripture is being rejected. As well,

I did not give you the authority to judge myself and either did the creator
you may want to be a little contrite about your ignorance
Stargazzer Part 2

I guess you would condemn the likes of Helen Keller and those inadequate of understanding concept of hell......To Hell Itself
Do you see how illogical this is ? Try to address entirety of post and retract the ridiculous judge displacement

Last edited by stargazzer; 05-11-2010 at 02:39 AM..
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