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I'm just wondering if you all believe that if a newborn baby dies, God will punish it with everlasting torment?
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Originally Posted by I LOVE NORTH CAROLINA
No
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Originally Posted by katjonjj
Because they are cute? or what? They didn't have faith...nor believe... where's the loophole?
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Originally Posted by Katzpur
Well, I really am glad to hear that, and I say that sincerely. Would you mind telling me why you don't believe they do?
Because they (the babies) did not die with a rebellious heart...they never willfully sinned in rebellion to God's commandments...they never had the chance to live long enough to do so.
The same is true for the one who died never knowing about God...His Son, Jesus, or anything about Him...we are only held accountable for what we DID know...and whether of not we refused what we knew to be His truth...His Word.
Sin done in ignorance is forgiven. Sin done presumptiously is not...unless there is full repentance from sin once and for all time....and then again...once one has received the knowledge of the truth...and sins willfully...there remaineth no more sacrifice for that...it is like a dog who returns to his vomit...it would have been better for him to have never believed at all. It is written.
Because they (the babies) did not die with a rebellious heart...they never willfully sinned in rebellion to God's commandments...they never had the chance to live long enough to do so.
The same is true for the one who died never knowing about God...His Son, Jesus, or anything about Him...we are only held accountable for what we DID know...and whether of not we refused what we knew to be His truth...His Word.
Sin done in ignorance is forgiven. Sin done presumptiously is not...unless there is full repentance from sin once and for all time....and then again...once one has received the knowledge of the truth...and sins willfully...there remaineth no more sacrifice for that...it is like a dog who returns to his vomit...it would have been better for him to have never believed at all. It is written.
Well, that's essentially what I believe, but the OP stated, "Man is born into the world already under eternal condemnation." To me, what that's saying is that babies who die would be under eternal condemnation.
No way do babies go to hell, they are innocent and sinless.
they are not sinless for we are all born in sin and shaped in iniquity, however, as Verna pointed out it all has to do with willful sin and they certainly have no concept of right and wrong at that age. I don't believe they will suffer any hellfire, but rest assured whatever happens, God is just.
they are not sinless for we are all born in sin and shaped in iniquity, however, as Verna pointed out it all has to do with willful sin and they certainly have no concept of right and wrong at that age. I don't believe they will suffer any hellfire, but rest assured whatever happens, God is just.
they are not sinless for we are all born in sin and shaped in iniquity, however, as Verna pointed out it all has to do with willful sin and they certainly have no concept of right and wrong at that age. I don't believe they will suffer any hellfire, but rest assured whatever happens, God is just.
If they are not sinless, what sin did they commit?
Eternal Salvation is a free gift and freely offered, but it is conditional; we have to be obedient. Let no man deceive you about the importance of remaining obedient. If we are committing willful sin, then we are ungodly -- whether we profess Jesus as Lord or not.
2 Peter 2
[4] For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;
[5] And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
[6] And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;
[7] And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:
[8] (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds; )
[9] The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:
We cannot walk in sin and be a child of God; it's impossible. Don't fall for the deception that states ye shall not surely die; the devil told that to Eve in the very beginning. God does not accept sin. We must be pure, clean and holy.
Eph. 5
[1] Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;
[2] And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour.
[3] But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;
[4] Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.
[5] For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
[6] Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
[7] Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
[8] For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
[9] (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth; )
[10] Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
[11] And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
[25] Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
[26] That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
[27] That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
1 Cor. 6
[9] Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
[10] Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
[11] And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
The children of God are pure, clean and holy, for Jesus' blood has made it so. Bow down in humility and let Jesus make you a new creature in God's image, which is holiness; this is what the born again experience is all about.
Eternal Salvation is a free gift and freely offered, but it is conditional; we have to be obedient. Let no man deceive you about the importance of remaining obedient. If we are committing willful sin, then we are ungodly -- whether we profess Jesus as Lord or not.
2 Peter 2
[4] For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;
[5] And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
[6] And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;
[7] And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:
[8] (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds; )
[9] The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:
We cannot walk in sin and be a child of God; it's impossible. Don't fall for the deception that states ye shall not surely die; the devil told that to Eve in the very beginning. God does not accept sin. We must be pure, clean and holy.
Eph. 5
[1] Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;
[2] And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour.
[3] But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;
[4] Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.
[5] For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
[6] Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
[7] Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
[8] For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
[9] (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth; )
[10] Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
[11] And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
[25] Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
[26] That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
[27] That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
1 Cor. 6
[9] Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
[10] Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
[11] And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
The children of God are pure, clean and holy, for Jesus' blood has made it so. Bow down in humility and let Jesus make you a new creature in God's image, which is holiness; this is what the born again experience is all about.
Amen scgraham...and this does include keeping the Ten Commandments of God...either you (everyone in general) keep them and live in obedience to God's holy word...or you (in general) don't, and live in rebellion to God's holy word...life...?...or...death...?...it is your (in general) choice.
God Bless....in His truth,
Verna.
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