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I am still looking for an exegetical rebuttal of the OP and link provided. Still nothing from UR.
Ummm... the OP is primarily refuting staw men. How can we rebut arguments against things we do not believe in the first place? At least the Berean authors found out what most universalists believe before writing about it.
Once you die, it is to late (John 8:24; Hebrews 9:27; John 3:36)
No it's not. The scriptures you cited do NOT say that. NO where in the Bible does it say that once you die it is too late.
Quote:
You have lost your opportunity to receive God's offer of salvation. You have been shown the Scriptures which show this. You choose to reject those Scriptures. As do all universalists, you prefer your own personal belief system rather than the revealed word of God. You have bought hook, line, and sinker into Satan's lie.
It is never too late for reconciliation. No one is rejecting any scriptures, it's just that your interpretation of them is wrong. How can you call such a wonderful message Satan's lie? It's about God's all consuming love and fire, and it is His desire that ALL men be saved.
1 Timothy 2:3-5
3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
Quote:
God cannot break His own rules. Once God has determined a thing, He will accomplish that which He has determined to do. The changes in the dispensations were all predetermined by God in eternity past.
Numbers 23:19 God is not a man, that He should lie, Nor a son of man, that He should repent (change His mind), Has He said, and will He not do it? Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good?
Malachi 3:6 ''For I, the LORD, do not change; therefore you, O sons of Jacob, are not consumed.
James 1:17 Every good thing bestowed and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation, or shifting shadow.
God does not break His own rules. To say that He does is to impugn His character.
The only impugning of God's character are the ones teaching that most of mankind has an eternal fiery fate. God IS love, he will correct and refine with love and He will have ALL of His creation saved and come to the knowledge of truth. I don't know why you're talking about God changing His mind.....all this is in the scriptures.
Mike, you seem to be caught up in the teachings of man (these Bible churches) and that's where I was for a long time. Universalism is not what you need to be concerned about.....you should focus on real false teachings and cults that kill people. There's something that you should know about Christian Universalism.....it's not a cult. As a good friend put it, there is no secret membership, no secret handshake or any kind of secrecy involved. As you can see, universalists are quite open and vocal about their belief. They don't even have churches to attend and are very spread out, as I've learned. They are loving, caring individuals who just want this exceptional news out there to help bring people to Christ now. No one wants anyone to suffer the wrath of God so they also know the importance of coming to accept Christ as Savior now. And the doctrine of an eternal fiery hell DOES NOT bring people to Christ.
I am still looking for an exegetical rebuttal of the OP and link provided. Still nothing from UR.
"The only verse one really needs to refute Universalism is John 3:16. “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” This verse is telling us the same truth we saw in the first chapter of John. Here it uses the words believesin Him rather than received Him, but it is the same truth."
If that's the only verse needed to refute UR then it's the only verse I need to respond to. I already believe that truth... that exactly and only those who believe in Christ will be saved. Where did the article prove that many will never turn to Christ?
No it's not. The scriptures you cited do NOT say that. NO where in the Bible does it say that once you die it is too late.
It is never too late for reconciliation. No one is rejecting any scriptures, it's just that your interpretation of them is wrong. How can you call such a wonderful message Satan's lie? It's about God's all consuming love and fire, and it is His desire that ALL men be saved.
1 Timothy 2:3-5
3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
The only impugning of God's character are the ones teaching that most of mankind has an eternal fiery fate. God IS love, he will correct and refine with love and He will have ALL of His creation saved and come to the knowledge of truth. I don't know why you're talking about God changing His mind.....all this is in the scriptures.
Mike, you seem to be caught up in the teachings of man (these Bible churches) and that's where I was for a long time. Universalism is not what you need to be concerned about.....you should focus on real false teachings and cults that kill people. There's something that you should know about Christian Universalism.....it's not a cult. As a good friend put it, there is no secret membership, no secret handshake or any kind of secrecy involved. As you can see, universalists are quite open and vocal about their belief. They don't even have churches to attend and are very spread out, as I've learned. They are loving, caring individuals who just want this exceptional news out there to help bring people to Christ now. No one wants anyone to suffer the wrath of God so they also know the importance of coming to accept Christ as Savior now. And the doctrine of an eternal fiery hell DOES NOT bring people to Christ.
Universalism is a lie from the mouth of Satan. The intent is to lull the gullible into a false sense of security about their eternal fate.
You seem now to be fully caught up in the cult of universalism. It matters not how sincere someone is in their beliefs. A person can 100% sincere and yet be 100% wrong. The lie of universalism is of Satan. It attracts the gullible, and those who can't face reality.
Each of the verses I listed show that once you die it is too late. As you have turned away from the truth and bought into a lie, I rather suspect that you shall remain in that lie.
The reality of hell is just that. Reality. Those who are wise will heed the warnings that God has given. The foolish will disregard the warning.
Universalism is a lie from the mouth of Satan. The intent is to lull the gullible into a false sense of security about their eternal fate.
You seem now to be fully caught up in the cult of universalism. It matters not how sincere someone is in their beliefs. A person can 100% sincere and yet be 100% wrong. The lie of universalism is of Satan. It attracts the gullible, and those who can't face reality.
Each of the verses I listed show that once you die it is too late. As you have turned away from the truth and bought into a lie, I rather supect that you shall remain in that lie.
The reality of hell is just that. Reality. Those who are wise will heed the warnings that God has given. The foolish will disregard the warning.
I just showed you how it IS NOT a lie or a cult, yet you still slander and call universalism a cult and a lie from Satan. I rather suspect that you will remain in the lie of ET as well. When you're cornered you resort to name calling and untruths. How do you think your behavior is furthering the gospel Mike? If I were an atheist/agnostic I would be shaking my head at you, simply because you're playing right into your own devil's hands.
Last edited by Ilene Wright; 05-16-2010 at 09:53 AM..
. Once God has determined a thing, He will accomplish that which He has determined to do.
God does not break His own rules. To say that He does is to impugn His character.
Exactly - His purpose will stand, and He will do all His pleasure (Isa 46:10).
Ummm... the OP is primarily refuting staw men. How can we rebut arguments against things we do not believe in the first place? At least the Berean authors found out what most universalists believe before writing about it.
That's an assumption. That is what we do here...we contend and debate....hence debate forum...or not...or let someone else. The OP was taken from the link, and at the link there are plenty of areas for rebuttal....many verses and interpretations to counter. That's how it is done. You can simply just disagree, but how does that help your ministry here? This isn't the Berean thread either...this is the IPA...International Preterist Association.
"The only verse one really needs to refute Universalism is John 3:16. “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” This verse is telling us the same truth we saw in the first chapter of John. Here it uses the words believesin Him rather than received Him, but it is the same truth."
If that's the only verse needed to refute UR then it's the only verse I need to respond to. I already believe that truth... that exactly and only those who believe in Christ will be saved. Where did the article prove that many will never turn to Christ?
LOL What about the very next verse? John 3:17...For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.
So the "WORLD" is just believers? How does verse 17 fit into your everlasting hellfire/condemnation paradigm?
The son was sent to save... does he save the world? Not if they end up in a fiery lake of torture!
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