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Old 05-15-2010, 04:04 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,302 posts, read 5,305,481 times
Reputation: 420

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Refuting Error

Univiersalism is unbiblical. It leaves the way of truth and places Jesus Christ on the periphery of Godís plan of redemption. It declares repentance out of date, the born-again experience unnecessary, and accuses those who criticize Univiersalism as not understanding the fullness of Godís ďgrace.Ē Godís true grace is in His Son, Jesus Christ. He saves you as an individual. Salvation is an intimate, personal experience with the Lord. It is not an impersonal, universal principle for all mankind.

In the world today many saints witness for Jesus Christ at the risk of their freedom, their well being, and their very lives. One organization that reports on these activities is The Voice of the Martyrs.

These faithful saints live in repressive regimes. The powers that be hate the Gospel and the name of Jesus Christ. It takes great courage and Holy Spirit power to enable these children of God to preach and teach the hope of salvation in Christ.

Many go to prison. Many suffer disfigurement, and many die. They think it is worth it for the privilege of telling the lost about Jesus Christ and His salvation. They believe God enables them to infiltrate the darkness. We believe He does, too.

One wonders what these courageous saints would say to the teachers of the false doctrine of Univiersalism?

More exegesis at the link above.
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:20 PM
 
Location: RV Park
7,544 posts, read 11,597,916 times
Reputation: 4469
The teaching of Scripture, as to the destiny of the Human Race:

& more Scriptures
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:28 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,395,075 times
Reputation: 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
Refuting Error

Univiersalism is unbiblical. It leaves the way of truth and places Jesus Christ on the periphery of God’s plan of redemption. It declares repentance out of date, the born-again experience unnecessary, and accuses those who criticize Univiersalism as not understanding the fullness of God’s “grace.” God’s true grace is in His Son, Jesus Christ. He saves you as an individual. Salvation is an intimate, personal experience with the Lord. It is not an impersonal, universal principle for all mankind.

In the world today many saints witness for Jesus Christ at the risk of their freedom, their well being, and their very lives. One organization that reports on these activities is The Voice of the Martyrs.

These faithful saints live in repressive regimes. The powers that be hate the Gospel and the name of Jesus Christ. It takes great courage and Holy Spirit power to enable these children of God to preach and teach the hope of salvation in Christ.

Many go to prison. Many suffer disfigurement, and many die. They think it is worth it for the privilege of telling the lost about Jesus Christ and His salvation. They believe God enables them to infiltrate the darkness. We believe He does, too.

One wonders what these courageous saints would say to the teachers of the false doctrine of Univiersalism?

More exegesis at the link above.
I'm not going to post all the martyrs out there who believed that Christ would save all, as I have to go outside for a while.....I will post them later.

But having said that, I have suffered MORE than I want to for the things that I have believed.

I do not have a church to go to, I do not have many friends, I don't agree with most of the people on this planet.......

I have no allegiance to any country (our allegiance belongs ONLY to GOD HIMSELF--The KINGDOM is NOT OF THIS WORLD, WE ARE ALIENS), most of my family does not speak to each other, and I have no group to belong to. I Peter 2:11 Dear friends, I urge you, as aliens and strangers in the world, to abstain from sinful desires, which war against your soul.

The Jews have been TERRIBLY persecuted for the stupidity of their religious leaders, the Muslims are bombed and shot at because of the stupidity of their religious leaders, and Western Civilization, well, it's time is coming.....

I Timothy 4:10 Certainly, we work hard and struggle to live a godly life, because we place our confidence in the living God. He is the Savior of all people, especially of those who believe.

The delusion happened a long time ago.....
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:30 PM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,132,699 times
Reputation: 866
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
Refuting Error

Univiersalism is unbiblical. It leaves the way of truth and places Jesus Christ on the periphery of Godís plan of redemption. It declares repentance out of date, the born-again experience unnecessary, and accuses those who criticize Univiersalism as not understanding the fullness of Godís ďgrace.Ē Godís true grace is in His Son, Jesus Christ. He saves you as an individual. Salvation is an intimate, personal experience with the Lord. It is not an impersonal, universal principle for all mankind.

In the world today many saints witness for Jesus Christ at the risk of their freedom, their well being, and their very lives. One organization that reports on these activities is The Voice of the Martyrs.

These faithful saints live in repressive regimes. The powers that be hate the Gospel and the name of Jesus Christ. It takes great courage and Holy Spirit power to enable these children of God to preach and teach the hope of salvation in Christ.

Many go to prison. Many suffer disfigurement, and many die. They think it is worth it for the privilege of telling the lost about Jesus Christ and His salvation. They believe God enables them to infiltrate the darkness. We believe He does, too.

One wonders what these courageous saints would say to the teachers of the false doctrine of Univiersalism?

More exegesis at the link above.
It's not unbiblical. Telling people that they have to "make a decision for Christ in this life only", however, is very unbiblical. Man is blinded by sin. Only the Holy Ghost can revive, and that is HIS job, not ours.

If this is unconvincing, please ask yourself: if salvation is up to the individual to obtain, who should one truly thank for their salvation: Jesus, or oneself?

Blessings to you,
brian
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:50 PM
 
20,395 posts, read 15,761,505 times
Reputation: 7558
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
It's not unbiblical. Telling people that they have to "make a decision for Christ in this life only", however, is very unbiblical. Man is blinded by sin. Only the Holy Ghost can revive, and that is HIS job, not ours.

If this is unconvincing, please ask yourself: if salvation is up to the individual to obtain, who should one truly thank for their salvation: Jesus, or oneself?

Blessings to you,
brian
Salvation is indeed up to the individual. But there is no merit in faith. The credit does not go to the one who has believed. The merit in faith is in the object of faith. The object of faith is Jesus Christ. It is He who gets the credit.

What does it say in Ephesians 2:18, 19 except this... For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9) not as a result of works that no one should boast.

Man is saved through faith and God gets the credit. Faith is the means by which salvation is appropriated.

Following is the issue in salvation...


Man is born into the world already under eternal condemnation.

Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned.

Romans 6:23a For the wages of sin is death...

Spiritual death... loss of relationship with God; separation from God.


Romans 5:8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

I Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4) and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures.


Salvation is freely offered to all...

John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life.

John 6:51 ''I am the living bread that came down out of heaven; if anyone eats of this bread, he shall live forever; and the bread also which I shall give for the life of the world is My flesh.''


Salvation is a free gift...

Romans 6:23b ...but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 4:10 ''If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, 'Give Me a drink,' you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water.


The free gift of salvation which is offered must be received...

John 1:11 He came to His own (National Israel), and those who were His own did not receive Him. 12) But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name.


Jesus rebuked those who rejected His offer of salvation...

John 5:40 and you are unwilling to come to Me that you may have life.


The consequences for rejecting God's free offer of salvation is death. Eternal separation from God in the lake of fire.

John 8:24 ''I said therefore to you, that you shall die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am, you shall die in your sins.''

John 3:36 ''He who believes the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey (believe) the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.

Revelation 20:15 And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.


The Invitation to Come to Christ for salvation...

Isaiah 55:1

1) HO, every one who thirsts, come to the waters;
And you who have no money come, buy and eat.
Come, buy wine and milk
Without money and without cost.

6) Seek the LORD while He may be found;
Call upon Him while He is near.

John 4:14 but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall become in him a well of water springing up to eternal life.''

Revelation 21:6 And He said to me, ''It is done, I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end, I will give to the one who thirsts from the spring of the water of life without cost.

Revelation 22:17b ...And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost.

The work of Jesus Christ on the Cross makes salvation possible. Salvation is freely offered to all, but God places the responsibilty on each individual member of the human race to choose between receiving the gift of salvation or rejecting it.
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:58 PM
 
Location: RV Park
7,544 posts, read 11,597,916 times
Reputation: 4469
Mike - post #2 for your viewing pleasure.
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Old 05-15-2010, 05:15 PM
 
701 posts, read 660,648 times
Reputation: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Salvation is indeed up to the individual. But there is no merit in faith. The credit does not go to the one who has believed. The merit in faith is in the object of faith. The object of faith is Jesus Christ. It is He who gets the credit.

What does it say in Ephesians 2:18, 19 except this... For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9) not as a result of works that no one should boast.

Man is saved through faith and God gets the credit. Faith is the means by which salvation is appropriated.

Following is the issue in salvation...


Man is born into the world already under eternal condemnation.

Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned.

Romans 6:23a For the wages of sin is death...

Spiritual death... loss of relationship with God; separation from God.


Romans 5:8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

I Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4) and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures.


Salvation is freely offered to all...

John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life.

John 6:51 ''I am the living bread that came down out of heaven; if anyone eats of this bread, he shall live forever; and the bread also which I shall give for the life of the world is My flesh.''


Salvation is a free gift...

Romans 6:23b ...but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 4:10 ''If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, 'Give Me a drink,' you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water.


The free gift of salvation which is offered must be received...

John 1:11 He came to His own (National Israel), and those who were His own did not receive Him. 12) But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name.


Jesus rebuked those who rejected His offer of salvation...

John 5:40 and you are unwilling to come to Me that you may have life.


The consequences for rejecting God's free offer of salvation is death. Eternal separation from God in the lake of fire.

John 8:24 ''I said therefore to you, that you shall die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am, you shall die in your sins.''

John 3:36 ''He who believes the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey (believe) the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.

Revelation 20:15 And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.


The Invitation to Come to Christ for salvation...

Isaiah 55:1

1) HO, every one who thirsts, come to the waters;
And you who have no money come, buy and eat.
Come, buy wine and milk
Without money and without cost.

6) Seek the LORD while He may be found;
Call upon Him while He is near.

John 4:14 but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall become in him a well of water springing up to eternal life.''

Revelation 21:6 And He said to me, ''It is done, I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end, I will give to the one who thirsts from the spring of the water of life without cost.

Revelation 22:17b ...And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost.

The work of Jesus Christ on the Cross makes salvation possible. Salvation is freely offered to all, but God places the responsibilty on each individual member of the human race to choose between receiving the gift of salvation or rejecting it.

Finally Mike, something we agree on! Very well said.
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Old 05-15-2010, 05:43 PM
 
701 posts, read 660,648 times
Reputation: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
It's not unbiblical. Telling people that they have to "make a decision for Christ in this life only", however, is very unbiblical. Man is blinded by sin. Only the Holy Ghost can revive, and that is HIS job, not ours.

If this is unconvincing, please ask yourself: if salvation is up to the individual to obtain, who should one truly thank for their salvation: Jesus, or oneself?

Blessings to you,
brian
The Holy Spirit will convict each and every person, at some point in their life, regarding truth. This life on earth is the only opportunity they will have to accept that conviction or reject it, but the choice is theirs. Salvation is not up to the individual to obtain, Christ has already taken care of the obtaining part of it, now it is up to each individual as to whether or not they will accept it. picture this scenario: an entire city is quarantined and every person is infected with a deadly virus except for one man who is immune. Now, the immune man goes outside of the city and brings back a cure. He then sets up a single location in the city where all can come and receive the cure. The immune man then leaves, but sends another to go throughout the city letting everyone know where to go to receive the cure. Many people in the city rushed to the curing station and where cured, however there were many who refused to go, despite the pleadings of the Man's messenger. These people rejected the messenger and chose not to receive the cure.

Who obtained their cure(salvation)? Who was the cure(salvation) available to? Christ will never force anyone to accept Him. If Christ's death on the cross saved every human being, regardless of whether or not they rejected Him, then why are we still on this earth 2000 years after calvary? The reason we are still here is because Christ, in His infinite mercy, is trying to give people as much time as possible to choose Him. He knows that this life is the only opportunity we have to make that choice and so He seeks to give us time to make that choice. Universalism is centered around the notion that God will force, those who reject Him, to accept Him, and that couldn't be further from the truth of God's loving nature. It is true that every knee shall bow and every voice shall proclaim that God is just, but admitting that a courts decision is just, is not a statement of love for the court.
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Old 05-15-2010, 05:43 PM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,132,699 times
Reputation: 866
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Salvation is indeed up to the individual. But there is no merit in faith. The credit does not go to the one who has believed. The merit in faith is in the object of faith. The object of faith is Jesus Christ. It is He who gets the credit.

What does it say in Ephesians 2:18, 19 except this... For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9) not as a result of works that no one should boast.

Man is saved through faith and God gets the credit. Faith is the means by which salvation is appropriated.

Following is the issue in salvation...


Man is born into the world already under eternal condemnation.

Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned.

Romans 6:23a For the wages of sin is death...

Spiritual death... loss of relationship with God; separation from God.


Romans 5:8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

I Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4) and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures.


Salvation is freely offered to all...

John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life.

John 6:51 ''I am the living bread that came down out of heaven; if anyone eats of this bread, he shall live forever; and the bread also which I shall give for the life of the world is My flesh.''


Salvation is a free gift...

Romans 6:23b ...but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 4:10 ''If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, 'Give Me a drink,' you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water.


The free gift of salvation which is offered must be received...

John 1:11 He came to His own (National Israel), and those who were His own did not receive Him. 12) But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name.


Jesus rebuked those who rejected His offer of salvation...

John 5:40 and you are unwilling to come to Me that you may have life.


The consequences for rejecting God's free offer of salvation is death. Eternal separation from God in the lake of fire.

John 8:24 ''I said therefore to you, that you shall die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am, you shall die in your sins.''

John 3:36 ''He who believes the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey (believe) the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.

Revelation 20:15 And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.


The Invitation to Come to Christ for salvation...

Isaiah 55:1

1) HO, every one who thirsts, come to the waters;
And you who have no money come, buy and eat.
Come, buy wine and milk
Without money and without cost.

6) Seek the LORD while He may be found;
Call upon Him while He is near.

John 4:14 but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall become in him a well of water springing up to eternal life.''

Revelation 21:6 And He said to me, ''It is done, I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end, I will give to the one who thirsts from the spring of the water of life without cost.

Revelation 22:17b ...And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost.

The work of Jesus Christ on the Cross makes salvation possible. Salvation is freely offered to all, but God places the responsibilty on each individual member of the human race to choose between receiving the gift of salvation or rejecting it.
It is necessary to read ALL of Romans to get the whole picture. All were made under Adam in order for ALL to be put in Christ. All men have been reconciled, all will be saved. It's not an "order now, supplies are limited" type of situation. All will drink, because all are thirsty. That's how He made us!

In theory, man should not get the glory for his belief in Christ. But when our message is about a "personal decision" for Christ, then the flesh begins to work..


Blessings,
Brian
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Old 05-15-2010, 05:50 PM
 
701 posts, read 660,648 times
Reputation: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
It is necessary to read ALL of Romans to get the whole picture. All were made under Adam in order for ALL to be put in Christ. All men have been reconciled, all will be saved. It's not an "order now, supplies are limited" type of situation. All will drink, because all are thirsty. That's how He made us!

In theory, man should not get the glory for his belief in Christ. But when our message is about a "personal decision" for Christ, then the flesh begins to work..


Blessings,
Brian
Brian, how can this view be considered one of love? Where is the choice in the matter? If I had a wife who did not make the "personal decision" to love me, then how could she love me? How empty would her affections toward me be? What would bring a king greater glory: having people who he programed to praise him, praising him, or to have a host of people with free will to make the personal decision to give him all the glory?
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