U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 05-17-2010, 12:52 PM
 
357 posts, read 1,212,958 times
Reputation: 194

Advertisements

I am starting to read the entire Bible and have just finished Exodus...i have a couple questions that popped into my head along the way...perhaps you can help and share opinions.

1)Who wrote Genesis, where and when? I have heard that it was Moses...is that just an assumption?

2)If Moses wrote Genesis, where did he get all the information for the stories in that book? Was it oral history of his people or did God dictate it to him on Mt Sinai?

3) If God dictated Genesis to Moses, what material was used to write it down...if it was stone tablets, that must have been pretty ungainely to carry around in the wilderness.

4)If God did not dictate the book,and it was simply the oral history that came from the mouths of various tribal elders, then would it be safe to say that the words attributed to God in Genesis (when he talks to Abraham) were not the actual literal words of God, but assumptions of what God said?

5) If God did not dictate the entire book to Moses, but simply inspired Moses to write it based on conversations they had on Sinai, how accurate can we assume the details in the Genesis stories are? For example, perhaps God just simply told Moses "It was I who made a great flood and spared Noah and his family" and Moses, sometime after the conversation, not only wrote down, but expanded on what God had told him, making his own assumptions along the way (Ie- That the flood was 100% global, that every species of animal in the entire world was on the ark, that the floodwaters covered every mountain everywhere)....So can we maybe say, some details in Genesis are inaccurate, but God allowed the text to go unchanged through the centuries, because the basic gist of the story was intact (That God punished a particular civilization with a great disaster and saved the few that were wholesome of heart)

How literal can we take the words in Genesis is basically what i'm asking. Thanks to anyone who can share some ideas.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 05-17-2010, 01:06 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
7,905 posts, read 8,479,538 times
Reputation: 11595
On thing to bear in mind as you read the Bible is that all of the Bible to be true. But some of the Bible is poetry, some is symbolic, some parts are conceptual, but most is literal. IMO the NT is literal except for the parables.

As to the creation story here is my understanding:

I view the first part of the book of Genesis as basically saying that God created everything. It should be noted that Genesis was written for the Hebrew mindset. We (westerners) are of the Greek mindset. By Greek I mean we follow the Greek way of thinking and looking at the world. We want precise answers, facts, figures order of occurrence and dates, etc.

The Hebrew mindset is primarily interested in concepts, with facts and figures being secondary. What mattered to the Hebrews is that God created the Universe. The order and time of the events were not important to the Hebrew mind.

As I see it you run into problems applying Greek thinking to a Hebrew document. That is why the creation story does not make sense to the scientific mind.

Of course we always must bear in mind that God is not limited to obey the laws of nature. So, if God wanted to create the universe in six, 24 hour days He could.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2010, 01:25 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
2,031 posts, read 2,685,420 times
Reputation: 528
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
On thing to bear in mind as you read the Bible is that all of the Bible to be true. But some of the Bible is poetry, some is symbolic, some parts are conceptual, but most is literal. IMO the NT is literal except for the parables.

As to the creation story here is my understanding:

I view the first part of the book of Genesis as basically saying that God created everything. It should be noted that Genesis was written for the Hebrew mindset. We (westerners) are of the Greek mindset. By Greek I mean we follow the Greek way of thinking and looking at the world. We want precise answers, facts, figures order of occurrence and dates, etc.

The Hebrew mindset is primarily interested in concepts, with facts and figures being secondary. What mattered to the Hebrews is that God created the Universe. The order and time of the events were not important to the Hebrew mind.

As I see it you run into problems applying Greek thinking to a Hebrew document. That is why the creation story does not make sense to the scientific mind.

Of course we always must bear in mind that God is not limited to obey the laws of nature. So, if God wanted to create the universe in six, 24 hour days He could.
Couldn't have said it better
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2010, 01:33 PM
 
357 posts, read 1,212,958 times
Reputation: 194
yes, thats a viewpoint that i will now consider whenever interpreting the Bible...thanks
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2010, 02:13 PM
 
Location: Gulf Coast Texas
26,200 posts, read 14,096,059 times
Reputation: 10087
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyr View Post
I am starting to read the entire Bible and have just finished Exodus...i have a couple questions that popped into my head along the way...perhaps you can help and share opinions.

1)Who wrote Genesis, where and when? I have heard that it was Moses...is that just an assumption?

2)If Moses wrote Genesis, where did he get all the information for the stories in that book? Was it oral history of his people or did God dictate it to him on Mt Sinai?

3) If God dictated Genesis to Moses, what material was used to write it down...if it was stone tablets, that must have been pretty ungainely to carry around in the wilderness.

4)If God did not dictate the book,and it was simply the oral history that came from the mouths of various tribal elders, then would it be safe to say that the words attributed to God in Genesis (when he talks to Abraham) were not the actual literal words of God, but assumptions of what God said?

5) If God did not dictate the entire book to Moses, but simply inspired Moses to write it based on conversations they had on Sinai, how accurate can we assume the details in the Genesis stories are? For example, perhaps God just simply told Moses "It was I who made a great flood and spared Noah and his family" and Moses, sometime after the conversation, not only wrote down, but expanded on what God had told him, making his own assumptions along the way (Ie- That the flood was 100% global, that every species of animal in the entire world was on the ark, that the floodwaters covered every mountain everywhere)....So can we maybe say, some details in Genesis are inaccurate, but God allowed the text to go unchanged through the centuries, because the basic gist of the story was intact (That God punished a particular civilization with a great disaster and saved the few that were wholesome of heart)

How literal can we take the words in Genesis is basically what i'm asking. Thanks to anyone who can share some ideas.
1- Moses.

2- I assume 40 days on Mt. Sinai.

3- God often told Moses to write God's words - Ex. 17:14, 24:4, 34:27. Lord established rules to Moses on Mt. Sinai (Lev. 26:46). So he could have dictated numerous other things in 40 days.

5- Check for inconsistencies with other books of the Bible. If you find any contradictions, then we can go from there.

Also, from things I have read, there is Egyptian terminology here and there - which goes back to Moses' background.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2010, 03:50 PM
 
7,858 posts, read 6,664,436 times
Reputation: 1371
There is five books of Moses ...Genesis was brought from word of mouth and clarified by Holy Spirit....Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuternomy, was brought through a witness of Moses and others who where close and leaders with Moses and many prophecies to Moses, through Holy Spirit...Moses did not dictated all these books because of the literal diffrences between the later books and the earlier books of Moses...The books were kept an parchment wickered paper......In the Judgement of Moses, the Lord God would tell Moses of something he wanted, a law or injustice, and then Moses would Judge what the Lord God said and condemn people to death for breaking the new law.... which the Lord God never told Moses to kill people as a judgement....
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2010, 04:07 PM
 
Location: God's Country
21,416 posts, read 29,537,833 times
Reputation: 29922
The Bible is not a human book. Through the Holy Spirit, God revealed His Words to man who wrote down His message. This process is known as inspiration. Although the writers used their own minds, talents, language and style, they wrote what God wanted them to write. Scripture is completely trustworthy because God was in control of its writing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2010, 07:09 PM
 
Location: New York City
5,556 posts, read 6,711,233 times
Reputation: 1351
Now for a little more, shall we say, "grounded" and reasonable explanation.

There are quite a few scholars who will tell you that the books in subject here were written long after the time of Moses and Moses did not have one hand in any of their writings. What might actually be the case if that they were attributed to him more than "fact" that he wrote them.

There is the curious latter words in Deuteronomy that tell of Moses' death which he most certainly could NOT have written and there is another passage, also in Deuteronomy, that hints at a much later authorship.

As for Genesis, clearly the book details events long BEFORE the time that Israel had its monarchy. It ends with the death of Joseph. Curiously, however, we read this in Genesis 36:31:

Now these were the kings who reigned in the land of Edom before any king reigned over the children of Israel.

How would Moses know about Israel's kings (1,000 years later) or WHY would this be mentioned unless the writer is writing a summary based on available knowledge?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-17-2010, 07:54 PM
 
2,981 posts, read 4,304,986 times
Reputation: 208
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyr View Post
I am starting to read the entire Bible and have just finished Exodus...i have a couple questions that popped into my head along the way...perhaps you can help and share opinions.

1)Who wrote Genesis, where and when? I have heard that it was Moses...is that just an assumption?
Moses wrote it, when God told him too.
Moses had all the writings of the patriarchs, from Adam to Enoch, to Noah, to Abraham... Jacob, and his twelve sons. Bits of the "testaments" of the patriarchs survive in the Dead Sea Scrolls, and are published as the "Genesis Apocryphon", from those texts.
Moses was the prophesied deliverer of Israel, and having been born only 48 years after Joseph died, and having been raised a prince, he had access to all that Joseph left, when Joseph ruled as the king of Egypt for 80 years.
The patriarchs of the tribes of Israel kept written records, as all the patriarchs had, from Adam on. Genesis 5 is from Adam's book.

Quote:
And it came to pass when Pharaoh reigned in his father's stead, he placed the laws of Egypt and all the affairs of government in the hand of Joseph, as his father had commanded him; And all Egypt was under the care of Joseph, and Joseph made war with all his surrounding enemies, and he subdued them; also all the land and all the Philistines, unto the borders of Canaan, did Joseph subdue, and they were all under his power and they gave a yearly tax unto Joseph.
And Pharaoh king of Egypt sat upon his throne in his father's stead, but he was under the control and counsel of Joseph, as he was at first under the control of his father.
Neither did he reign but in the land of Egypt only, under the counsel of Joseph, but Joseph reigned over the whole country at that time, from Egypt unto the great river Perath.
And Joseph was successful in all his ways, and the Lord was with him, and the Lord gave Joseph additional wisdom, and honor, and glory, and love toward him in the hearts of the Egyptians and throughout the land, and Joseph reigned over the whole country forty years.
[Joseph increased his reign]
And Joseph lived in the land of Egypt ninety-three years, and Joseph reigned over all Egypt eighty years.
- from Jasher, chapters 58 and 59.


Under Joseph's reign, Egypt prospered exceedingly, increasing its military might and strength, and increasing its borders by winning wars, in those years. The pharaoh who sat on the throne, after Joseph died, listened to bad council, against Israel, and began to subjugate Israel little by little, until the tribes were tricked into becoming slaves [except the tribe of Levi, who were never slaves because they did not fall for the trickery. -This is all recorded in the Book of Jasher.
Book of Jasher
The Real Book of Jasher?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-18-2010, 10:28 AM
 
Location: Pikeville, Ky.
13,459 posts, read 21,202,746 times
Reputation: 17675
Off topic posts were deleted from this thread any more off topic posts may result in infractions..
You are always free to start your own threads to discuss other topics not directly related to the op..

__________________
Moderator of:
Non Romantic Relationships
Parenting, and sub-forums

Last edited by Miss Blue; 05-18-2010 at 10:40 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top