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Old 05-18-2010, 02:02 PM
 
Location: Gulf Coast Texas
26,198 posts, read 14,090,937 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaykibs View Post
At the time Leviticus was written, the word "abomination" simply meant "uncustomary", meaning that it went against the customs of the culture in which it was written. Virtually everything else (other than incest) warned against in Leviticus is ignored daily by most Christians. They eat pork, plant multiple crops in the same soil and wear cotton-polyester blends. Now, if you look at the time and culture in which this was written, propagation of the culture itself was all-important, as they were threatened by war, famine, disease and all of those other unpleasant aspects of living in the desert.

The bible is a dangerous tool when interpreted too literally, and even more dangerous when the cultural context of it is ignored. Homosexuality is not a sin. Promiscuity, lust and adultery are sins, whether practiced by gay or straight people.

This link delves into the difference between homosexuality and other sins, if homosexuality is chosen to be seen as one. Its basic premise is that this is different from all other sins in that by not being allowed to 'practice' homosexuality, it actually cuts a person off from knowing love, which is the one thing that can always be done to know God, as the bible clearly states, over and over, that you must know love in order to know God.

Christians: When It Comes to Homosexuality, Man Up JohnShore.com
Just for reference regarding pork, Christ declared all foods as clean (Mark 7:15). I'm not sure about the cotton/polyester argument.

Homosexuality is a subset of adultery if you want to get technical - so it is sin.

Not practicing homosexuality cuts a person off from knowing love?? No way. You are only focusing on physical eros love. Christ did not have any physical interactions - did He know love? Yes. 1 Cor. 13 describes love - there is no mention of sexual actions.
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Old 05-18-2010, 02:11 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,427,722 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyr View Post
Ok, i am not going to say that homosexual activity is not a sin, since it is entirely clear in Leviticus that it is. I am wondering what was God's reason for making it a sin.

Most sins such as stealing, lying or murder, hurt somebody, or cause somebody to be unwillingly inconvenienced. True, any type of sex can lead to STDs, but if both partners are virginal or clean (or use protection), then the sex is not hurting anyone , assuming it is consensual for both parties.

I've heard people say it is a sin because it is against God's intention and/or natural law's intention for the use of our genitilia....but what if I were to use another body part, say my toenails, for a purpose contrary to what God/natural law made them for. If i am double jointed and strretch my leg behind my back and use my fingernails to scratch my back, i run the risk of harming myself, and I am clearly using my legs/feet and toenails for a purpose they were not bcreated for...but is it a sin? No, i really do not think it is.

Some would also say that being homosexual is against God's commandment to be fruitful and multiply. But what about priests who do not marry and procreate or someone with a hazardous job who does'nt want to bring children into the world for the fear that they would sooner or later have to deal with their father dying in a work-related accident....these people are breaking God's commandment to multiply, yet i would'nt think that their decision to do so would be considered sinful by God.

Please help me understand why God views homosexual behavior as sinful...could it possibly have been a commandment that only applied to ancient Israelites so that they would survive as a distinct nation and not assimilate to the ways of the pagans (pagans had lots of gay sex)...so would this law fall into the same category as the one about not having a goatee (Leviticus 19:27....the Egyptians wore goatees and God did'nt want the Jews to adopt pagan customs, he wanted them to have a unique culture that would set them apart and help Israel survive until the Savior came)
Sin is a missing of the mark. As far as man and woman goes, the mark or target is to have congugal relationships. The man's thing is for the woman's thing and vice versa.

For a man to lie with another man is to miss the mark or target. It is just not natural. It is against nature. The natural thing is for a man to do it with a woman. Sex is for procreation. Man with man is not procreative.
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Old 05-18-2010, 02:31 PM
 
357 posts, read 1,212,694 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Sin is a missing of the mark. As far as man and woman goes, the mark or target is to have congugal relationships. The man's thing is for the woman's thing and vice versa.

For a man to lie with another man is to miss the mark or target. It is just not natural. It is against nature. The natural thing is for a man to do it with a woman. Sex is for procreation. Man with man is not procreative.
Do you believe that sex within a heterosexual marriage that is not for the purpose of procreation is a sin?

What if a married couple cannot afford to ever have children or do not think they can live up to the responsibility of children...are they missing the mark, and therefore, sinning against nature if sex=procreation?
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Old 05-18-2010, 02:50 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,427,722 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyr View Post
Do you believe that sex within a heterosexual marriage that is not for the purpose of procreation is a sin?
I don't know.

Quote:
What if a married couple cannot afford to ever have children or do not think they can live up to the responsibility of children...are they missing the mark, and therefore, sinning against nature if sex=procreation?
I don't know. If one is a Catholic and they use condoms or whatever to keep from having babies then it is a sin. But it sure is better than the alternative . . . homosexuality.
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Old 05-18-2010, 02:53 PM
 
Location: Albany, NY
724 posts, read 526,971 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
Just for reference regarding pork, Christ declared all foods as clean (Mark 7:15). I'm not sure about the cotton/polyester argument.

Homosexuality is a subset of adultery if you want to get technical - so it is sin.

Not practicing homosexuality cuts a person off from knowing love?? No way. You are only focusing on physical eros love. Christ did not have any physical interactions - did He know love? Yes. 1 Cor. 13 describes love - there is no mention of sexual actions.
It isn't actually a subset of adultery without going WAYYY to deeply into the meaning of adultery. I have never cheated on my partner, whom I do plan to marry.

Also, I am not at all focusing on physical love; nor was the author of that blog entry. If I had never had sex with my partner, I would still undoubtedly love him more than anything in this world. I find it incredibly offensive to insinuate that gays and lesbians cannot love each other, but can only engage in sex.
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Old 05-18-2010, 02:54 PM
 
Location: Albany, NY
724 posts, read 526,971 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
I don't know.



I don't know. If one is a Catholic and they use condoms or whatever to keep from having babies then it is a sin. But it sure is better than the alternative . . . homosexuality.
So you don't know, and you don't know. But somehow we're supposed to take your opinion seriously? I don't know...
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Old 05-18-2010, 03:13 PM
 
Location: Gulf Coast Texas
26,198 posts, read 14,090,937 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaykibs View Post
It isn't actually a subset of adultery without going WAYYY to deeply into the meaning of adultery. I have never cheated on my partner, whom I do plan to marry.
God has defined marriage in Gen. 2. Any physical relations outside of that is adultery.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jaykibs View Post
Also, I am not at all focusing on physical love; nor was the author of that blog entry. If I had never had sex with my partner, I would still undoubtedly love him more than anything in this world. I find it incredibly offensive to insinuate that gays and lesbians cannot love each other, but can only engage in sex.
I never said they couldn't love each other - that's what you said about the link. People w/ homosexual interests do not have to have sexual relations to experience love.

I don't think God will view you and your partner's relationship as a marriage. I am not trying to be mean, but just expressing what I believe God says about marriage.
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Old 05-18-2010, 04:22 PM
 
7,857 posts, read 6,662,302 times
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See there is fallen angels who are perverted and will maniulate man into perverted sexual mind that will not be of The Lord Gods goodness, In Genesis, Adam and Eve were manipulated by the perverted evil spirit and they discovered that they were naked.... God never gave them is idea....Perverted sexuality is an abuse in the eyes of Heaven..... These perverted fallen angels at the time if Leviticus was wrote would have corporately infested the Israel nation and would have be of no use to the Lord God Plan for this nation to be blessed that would eventually bring Jesus the Son of Man into being.......Sin was out and legalism was the regular tool but not the only tool for The Lord God in that time of Moses,......
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Old 05-18-2010, 08:22 PM
 
Location: Florida
580 posts, read 632,006 times
Reputation: 149
Just adding...
1 Corinthians 6:18 Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body.
The penalty for sin is death. When you sin against your own body, you yourself are causing death to your own physical body.
Now let us reason this in a Godly perspective. God has given us commandments that are good for us. He doesn't need them, He is Holy.
If not one single person in all of creation disobeyed the marriage covenant and there was no fornication in single people, no homosexuality, there never would have been veneral diseases or Hiv or Aids. By man's (also woman) sin he has caused death on himself.
The purity of the marriage bed is a blessing from God. Anything else is sexual immorality and a curse brought on by one's own self desire. If your desire is for God, then there is no temptation of sin.
James 1: 13When tempted, no one should say, "God is tempting me." For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone; 14but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed. 15Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death.
God Bless,
Mercy
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Old 05-19-2010, 06:20 AM
 
Location: Gaston, North Carolina
4,213 posts, read 4,899,792 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
No it isn't clear.

The Old testament is silent on homosexuality as a term. It can be interpreted through modern translations that there is a problem concerning males and most likely had more to do with anal sex than it did with the relationship itself because of hygene.

The same wording cannot be applied to females which brings question to the entire belief that homosexuality is wrong in and of itself.

The new testament is also silent on homosexuality as a term. It is more interpretation and ambigious definitions that it is said that it applies to homosexuality.

The issue is an always has been non consentual and loveless relationships that consist of people using one another for their personal gratification. You can find these kinds of behaviors in heterosexuality and homosexuality.
.
Homosexuality as a term? Are you missing something? Homosexuality wasn't even a term until the 20th century. No as defined it is clear as day within the scriptures for both male and female. Now if you would be so kind to read all aspects of the definition you will find the definition fits both male and female. Another words man don't have sex with a man and woman don't have sex with a woman whether it be a temple prostitute or an average Joe or Jane. If it is not between a man and his wife it is sin. And for clarification God never condoned polygamy and that is evident by all the ternoil in such relationships throughout the Bible.
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