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Old 05-21-2010, 11:48 AM
 
Location: SC Foothills
8,830 posts, read 5,846,757 times
Reputation: 58110
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
I think Mike is under the impression that God DOES NOT speak outside words on paper.. either through the bible or doctrine.. but not without those two things.

Most of us can testify to God's involvement in our lives outside of the bible and learned doctrine... but apparently that is not what Mike believes. I have to agree with another poster who stated on another thread that some of this points to a reverence for the bible and doctrine rather than God.

Bible worship and doctrine worship, IMO.

The other thing I was wondering is that if God is not able or willing to speak to humans outside of the bible and doctrine then he is not a living God... right? For to be a living God he is able to communicate in many ways not just through limited means. To some, looking at nature and the complexity of life screams that God exists...

How can one tell another that their dealings with God are not real unless they consult a teacher of doctrine!
You make some very good points here Kat. I think it does amount to Bible and doctrine worship if one can't accept that God speaks to us in so many other ways than just that. Sad, really.

 
Old 05-21-2010, 11:49 AM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
2,031 posts, read 1,529,613 times
Reputation: 495
Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
I think she has a valid point considering what you said and have been saying.

You and sciotamicks follow teachers with very different doctrines, so who is being led by the Holy Spirit? I am being completely sincere when I ask this question. It seems to me that any people "outside the chosen camp" when it comes to doctrine are the bad guys. Just check out any Christian forum.

Either the Holy Spirit is confused or a whole lotta people are. I would say we
all know the Spirit is NOT the one that is confused.
This is the reason why we need to follow the BIBLE! It sounds good on paper to say that the Holy Spirit will lead you to discern what is true in the Bible, but clearly many people are being told different things and obviously the Holy Spirit doesn't tell people conflicting truth. This is why the Bible is so important. If the Holy Spirit is telling us something, it will align with God's Holy Word! If it doesn't, you need to really reevaluate what you believe the Holy Spirit is saying!
 
Old 05-21-2010, 11:50 AM
 
12,230 posts, read 5,823,702 times
Reputation: 1918
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
I think Mike is under the impression that God DOES NOT speak outside words on paper.. either through the bible or doctrine.. but not without those two things.

Most of us can testify to God's involvement in our lives outside of the bible and learned doctrine... but apparently that is not what Mike believes. I have to agree with another poster who stated on another thread that some of this points to a reverence for the bible and doctrine rather than God.

Bible worship and doctrine worship, IMO.

The other thing I was wondering is that if God is not able or willing to speak to humans outside of the bible and doctrine then he is not a living God... right? For to be a living God he is able to communicate in many ways not just through limited means. To some, looking at nature and the complexity of life screams that God exists...

How can one tell another that their dealings with God are not real unless they consult a teacher of doctrine!
You think wrongly. Go back. Reread my posts. Try to comprehend what has been written.
 
Old 05-21-2010, 11:57 AM
 
1,897 posts, read 945,555 times
Reputation: 242
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
The problem is that your assertion is that your religious belief is the word of God, you are not really talking about the bible, you are saying that everything you think the bible means is the word of God. There is a difference.
Amen!
 
Old 05-21-2010, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Texas
4,345 posts, read 3,434,631 times
Reputation: 816
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is alive and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Some will say that Heb. 4:12 refers to Jesus and not to the Bible.
12 For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are naked and open to the eyes of Him to whom we must give account.

May I ask, do you refer to your bible as a "He"?

That is - if someone says "Hey Mike, where's your bible?" do you answer "He's over there"
 
Old 05-21-2010, 12:09 PM
 
21,848 posts, read 9,713,172 times
Reputation: 3700
Quote:
Originally Posted by CantWait2Leave View Post
This is the reason why we need to follow the BIBLE!
This is why we need to follow our hearts and the Holy Spirit using the mind of Christ. If you have to rationalize anything to your inner heart as "God's ways are not our ways" or "God knows what is just not us" or whatever other rationalization you can accept to tell you that what your heart and everything within you tells you should be wrong . . . then you are not dealing with the truth that God has "written in our hearts." The Holy Spirit within will not lead you astray . . . but the veil of ignorance over the written word can . . . unless you use the heart and mind of Jesus to filter out what is evil and corrupt . . . to see the pure love of God within. It is NOT the details that involve MOTIVES to believe Jesus that matter . . . it is the believing and following in "love of God and each other" that matters . . . whatever your motives.
 
Old 05-21-2010, 12:25 PM
 
12,230 posts, read 5,823,702 times
Reputation: 1918
Quote:
Originally Posted by CantWait2Leave View Post
This is the reason why we need to follow the BIBLE! It sounds good on paper to say that the Holy Spirit will lead you to discern what is true in the Bible, but clearly many people are being told different things and obviously the Holy Spirit doesn't tell people conflicting truth. This is why the Bible is so important. If the Holy Spirit is telling us something, it will align with God's Holy Word! If it doesn't, you need to really reevaluate what you believe the Holy Spirit is saying!
So true!!!

The Bible, which is God's recorded word, is the absolute norm and standard by which the believer is to live.
 
Old 05-21-2010, 12:26 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 945,555 times
Reputation: 242
Quote:
Originally Posted by firstborn888 View Post
12 For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are naked and open to the eyes of Him to whom we must give account.

May I ask, do you refer to your bible as a "He"?

That is - if someone says "Hey Mike, where's your bible?" do you answer "He's over there"
WOW! That is a great point!!
 
Old 05-21-2010, 12:36 PM
 
12,230 posts, read 5,823,702 times
Reputation: 1918
Quote:
Originally Posted by firstborn888 View Post
12 For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are naked and open to the eyes of Him to whom we must give account.

May I ask, do you refer to your bible as a "He"?

That is - if someone says "Hey Mike, where's your bible?" do you answer "He's over there"

Do you not understand? Every word which proceeds out of the mouth of God is His word. That it is recorded in writing makes it no less His word and no less important. The Bible is God's recorded message to man. It is the written word of God.

Once again. Here is the original post...


It seems that many professing Christians regard the Bible as nothing more then dead letters in a book. This explains why they feel free to disregard the Scriptures that they personally don't like and refer to them as doctrines of men.

But what do the Scriptures themselves say?

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is alive and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Some will say that Heb. 4:12 refers to Jesus and not to the Bible. But as Jesus is the living Word, so too is the Bible the written word. The Bible is the mind of Christ. The thoughts of Christ set down in writing. The words that Jesus Christ communicated, whether spoken while He was on the earth, or written in the Cannon of Scripture, are alive and powerful. Indeed, Jesus never communicated the content of church-age doctrine that is contained in the New Testament Scriptures while He was on the earth. What we have in the New Testament Holy Scriptures was communicated by means of divine inspiration from God the Holy Spirit to the human authors of the Bible.

We have in the written Scriptures, God's complete and connected thought toward man.



2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. 17)That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works


The Bible is not human viewpoint, or of human origin, but rather the Holy Spirit's use of human agencies.

2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture originates from one's own disclosure. 21) For prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spoke as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.


The Bible is the source of all divine revelation and spiritual wisdom.

2 Timothy 3:14 You, however, continue in the things you have learned and become convinced of, knowing from whom you have learned them; 15) and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.


The Bible is the mind of Christ.

1 Corinthians 2:16 For who has known the mind of the Lord, That He should instruct Him? But we have the mind of Christ.


The Bible is the absolute norm and standard for the believer.

Psalms 138:2 I will Sing praises to Thee before the gods. I will bow down toward Thy holy temple. And give thanks to Thy name for Thy lovingkindness and Thy truth; For Thou hast magnified Thy word according to all Thy name.



In Romans 1:2 and 2 Timothy 3:15, the expressions 'Holy Scriptures' and 'Sacred Writings' are used respectively.

Rom 1:2 which He promised beforehand through His prophets in the holy Scriptures.

2 Tim 3:15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.



God expects the believer to learn and metabolize the doctrines of the word of God.

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Matthew 4:4 But He answered and said, ''It is written, 'Man shall not live on bread alone, But on every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God.

Jeremiah 15:16 Thy words were found and I ate them, And Thy words became for me a joy and the delight of my heart;

Psalm 119:105 Thy word is a lamp to my feet, And a light to my path.

Psalm 119:103 How sweet are Thy words to my taste! Yes, sweeter than honey to my mouth!

Psalm 119:104 From Thy precepts I get understanding; Therefore I hate every false way.

Yes, the Bible is the written word of God, and Jesus Christ is the living Word. Everything that God intends for the believer in the church-age to know and to understand has been set down in writing. We have our operating instructions, our marching orders, in written form.

When the believer under the filling ministry of the Spirit (Eph 5:18), through use of the principle of (1 John 1:9), studies the written word, the Holy Spirit will make the spiritual phenomenon perspicacious to the believer. If the believer, upon understanding the doctrine, then believes it, it becomes metabolized and serves to edify the believer, resulting in spiritual growth.

The Holy Spirit will never, I repeat, Never guide a believer contrary to what is contained in the Scriptures. Anyone who claims to have been led by the Spirit to believe somethng that runs counter to what is contained in the Bible is not in the truth.

2 Peter 3:14 Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, 15) And regard the patience of our Lord to be salvation; just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, 16) As also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
 
Old 05-21-2010, 12:43 PM
 
12,230 posts, read 5,823,702 times
Reputation: 1918
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Why bother reposting it then if the first time you posted it didn't work?

You know what they say about that don't you?

Trying the same thing over and over but expecting a different result is insanity!



Ive gotta go to work so I hope I don't have to read umpteen pages of repeated OP when I return... LOL
I post it again so that those with common sense can see the foolishness of those who stubbornly refuse to acknowledge the simple truth that God has recorded His word in writing for the benefit of the believer.
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